Should we leave London after burnout, or stay for my husband's career?

[ChickenChitty]

Help me with my life dilemma.

DH and I have been together for 15 years, we are late 30s with 2 kids at primary school. I work in a stressful job in the City, requiring extremely long hours (60-70hr weeks, weekend work most weekends and most holidays too). DH is in a creative career - his passion. I earn c.6x what he does. He is self-employed so does more with the kids and more around the house (I’d say he does 60% of the childcare and maybe 70% of household tasks).

I nearly died earlier this year with a ruptured appendix that was missed and negligent medical care. It came off the back of a period of very intense work - about 9 months of hell. I’m mentally traumatised from that experience and burnt out generally, and the whole thing has made me reassess my life.

Ive suddenly got clarity that I don’t want to continue doing my job anymore and I don’t even know what I’m doing it for as London is so expensive our quality of life is not great. We have enough equity in our small London terraced house that we could move back to my home town (up north) and buy somewhere large and detached and lovely mortgage free, near much better schools for the kids and near my family. DH really doesn’t want to leave London as he loves it, and his work is here (his family is up north too but nowhere near mine). He would want to continue commuting to London if we moved, which would probably involve overnight stays and impact family life.

Im starting to feel a bit of resentment as I increasingly feel like I’m killing myself and sacrificing my quality of life so that DH can live his dreams. But I love him, am proud of what he does, and would feel awful to effectively force him to move (which we would need to do if I quit my job, as he could never pay the mortgage alone). I knew when we got married that this would be his career. I’ve thought of middle grounds like downsizing in London or moving to a commuter area if I took a pay cut, but that would feel like a much worse outcome for the kids, to leave everything they know for something materially worse, and/or both parents travelling more than we do now . I don’t know whether I’m being unfair in wanting to do this or not, or what the right balance is, so thoughts from other people would be welcome!

OP, move. You will not regret it. You'll also get used to the new normal. Through no fault of his own DH has been in London Mon-Thur for months. We're not particularly happy about it, and I railed against it, but you get into a rhythm. We have a child with significant ASN & it's all on me, but I've got used to it. We're in Scotland, so very far, but I think of it that he's only not sleeping here 3 nights.

Living here I work a 3 day week & have a lovely, period 4 bed property with garden in a major city but with easy access to countryside & coast. It is worth compromising for.

Sure @thesealion but whatever happens we are moving house in London, even if I don’t quit my job, as the schools nearby are not good. So there’s going to be massive upheaval for the kids regardless, and I don’t want to combine that with moving somewhere much worse.

OP, it sounds like you want an "out" of your current job (totally understandable), but with a sense that you have still "succeeded in life" (i.e. big house and nice schools for the kids) and without the guilt of forcing your husband to give up his job. I don't unfortunately think it is possible.

The only solution that ticks your boxes would be to get divorced, establish a good coparenting arrangement and marry a rich man.

On a serious note, if I were in your position, I would find a good secondary in a cheaper area of London (i.e. Streatham), top up with tutoring / clubs and purchase a 3 bed near it without a mortgage. Once your expenses are down, look for another job in London with fewer hours (you don't need to earn more than your husband, he should at least understand that I hope).

In every thread I've ever where the woman wants the man to continue majority financing a lifestyle he's not happy in, there's posts pointing out to her that she can't make him and would be wise to plan with that in mind.

My husband and I have always worked for London based companies (so get London wages), in jobs that offer hybrid working, and we live an hour's door to door commute to central London, in a nice part of Kent. Schools are excellent. Our home is a large detached house with a garden, with lovely countryside within touching distance. The value of it would probably buy a 2 bedroom flat in London. The commute (2 days a week each) costs us approx £3000 a year each. Well worth the approximate like-for-like £900,000 house price difference! Not to mention cost of living. It's no contest for me, you couldn't pay me to live in London. Where we live gives us all of the benefits of a London life, with very few downsides.

This is 100% right btw.

DH works hard, he is brilliant at his job. He does a lot with the kids (2 pick ups and drop offs a week) though he does also work on Saturdays so I have them then, plus when he’s travelling for work (maybe 3-4 nights a month but it’s sporadic). He does pay into the joint account per month, and he also does much more of the day to day house admin - laundry, cooking etc. It’s not that he doesn’t pull his weight and I’ve always known this would be his career. And yes, I grew up with very little money and so my career choices have been driven by what will give me the most financial stability, but it’s pushed me over the edge now I think.

when I’ve said I’m struggling he says I’m just still recovering physically and mentally (which is true), and shouldn’t make any hasty decisions

Post after post you are going over the ins and outs of all the options, looking at it this way and that. Meanwhile, DH has his head in the sand and is talking about not making 'hasty' decisions. What he means is that he doesn't want to make any decision at all. He wants you to carry on funding his dream job.

I feel honestly like I’ve let everyone done by now failing to sustain a life that the kids and DH are perfectly happy with.
Who made it your role to keep everyone else happy, at the expense of your own health? Who gave you that role? Who dares to judge your for "failing"?

As others have said, if you were not in the picture, how would he stay in London and do his dream job on his salary alone? Would he live in a grotty bedsit, totally unsuitable for his responsibilities as a father?

You cannot carry on.
Are you still off sick now? If so, when is the deadline for you going back to work?
Or are you back at work and DH is hoping this will all blow over?
You cannot carry on.
Hand in your notice. Get some estate agents round to value the house. Tell your DH he has two weeks to get with the changes and get involved in making necessary decisions, or you will just move ahead without his input.

I get the point about not making any hasty decisions, but the other side to that is, the status quo is not sustainable. Which means a decision might need to be made sooner than is ideal, regardless.

@StandingDeskDisco I think truthfully if we hadn’t got married then DH wouldn’t have had kids at all, and would have been totally happy living alone in a grotty bedsit. He obviously loves the kids and is a good dad, but he agreed to have them because I wanted them.

I had a month off work so am back now. DH is definitely assuming it will blow over.

I totally agree it isn’t fair or sustainable for you to continue working these long stressful hours. You are not a failure if you give it up and make other lifestyle compromises. However, I would not see your husband giving up his job and you all move up north as the only option. I would consider other options that involve school/house/area compromises. Everyone wants the very best of everything for their kids, but sometimes it isn’t possible. What they want most of all is you and your husband’s health and presence.
I would insist your husband discusses options. I would hope a compromise could be reached where he doesn’t have to give up his job, but him not engaging with discussions given your situation is unacceptable.

OK, you may not want to hand in your notice and get the estate agents around right now. But you can't let this situation drift on, or you will just have another health crisis eventually.

Set yourself a deadline to re-assess everything, perhaps four months?

Meanwhile, for that four months do the absolute minimum at work, no 'going above and beyond', and take care of your health.
Tell your boss that your health is still fragile and you need to avoid unnecessary stress. This might 'mark your card' and prevent any promotion or advancement, but you don't want that anyway, and couldn't cope with it.
Mentally get your head round the fact that your time in this job is limited: you don't know quite when you will jump, but you will jump at some point.

OP I think you come across as really quite detached from reality at this point.

Believe if or not there are plenty of good schools outside London and many people live in commuter towns without 6 figure salaries.

I think somehow you have got used to/have been so focused on having a high paying job and an expensive house that you have forgotten about what life is like for most people.

I think its reasonable to expect your DH to commute under these circumstances.

The East Coast mainline is a decent route into London. I live in the Midlands and can do the daily commute to London, although it is a long day. My preference is to stay 1 or 2 nights and there are a number of relatively cheap hotels near my office that I chose from. It keeps it flexible, as I travel abroad regularly too. Staying overnight would be very doable from York etc. although probably too much to do daily on a regular basis.

No, it’s just that I dont want to live in a commuter town. Having this preference isn’t detached from reality. I was born and grew up in a city and I live in a city now and I want to continue living in a city, just not London.

It’s got absolutely nothing to do with the house or the pay - it’s about lifestyle and what day to day would be like with a longer commute.

I don't think not wanting to live in a commuter town and commute into London means being detached from reality. It doesn't even mean being unaware that some people do it and like it.

You could get something perfectly nice in Ham, Kingston or Surbiton and get everything you want. Your husband would be able to keep doing his stuff. You would have good schools, easy access to the river, Richmond Park. You could access jobs all over London.

Surely you start with what jobs you are qualified to do, what is available in X areas, calculate likely joint earnings, factor commute costs (including costs of lodging/renting buying for DH) and then work out from there.

Size and types of houses come further down the list.

You could move to Macclesfield, DH could be in London in approx 2 hours and you could workin Manchester.

I think you know it’s time to go. Working that much is no life and it’s impacting your health. Health is everything ultimately. I would move while you have this window of opportunity.

I appreciate you are probably not in banking OP, but I can't help feeling that eg Leeds is getting a very poor rap on this thread from some posters. It's England's second largest centre for banking, financial and legal services outside London, (3rd after Edinburgh), with plenty of good jobs. There are television companies such as Channel 4 and Opera North, a branch of Harvey Nichols and for your budget comparatively attractive housing in the better areas of Leeds or surrounding villages. York is half an hour away, and Manchester across the Pennines. I am sure other cities such as Birmingham and Manchester will also have their claims to fame.

I would do some serious research on commuter times into London for your husband from various towns and cities, I think you could be very pleasantly surprised, when I hear what commute times people in the south west put up with. (As someone whose DH flew abroad weekly for thirty years for his commute, and often during the week thereafter, you will understand that my sympathies for him are somewhat limited). I am a bit concerned that you sound worried about suggesting he makes adjustments, why is that?

It’s clear as day that continuing with your job is not an option. So deal with that part first - tell your husband that you are definitely leaving your job and this is non-negotiable.

If you can also just go ahead and resign that would also be a good idea, depends how long you could live off savings while you decide where to live (as that will dictate next job).Every day you stay in that job is damaging your health.

Whenever you are ready to get a new job, candidates who have no notice period are always more attractive anyway. We just did exactly that, chose between two excellent people on the basis that one was available sooner.

@GalaDinner I fully agree re the attractions of eg Leeds. For me it would offer all the benefits of city life that I love but on a smaller scale, so shorter journeys and also nicer climate as far as I’m concerned.

Re DH I think it is because I feel it’s unfair of me to enforce a change on him that he doesn’t want, just because of the unfairness that my job is higher paid than his. And because living here is the status quo, I’d be the one pushing through the big change, so it would be all my fault if we regretted it. And because I know that I was the one who wanted the kids, and actually DH has already made career sacrifices (eg reduced travel and ironically took up more teaching, which is the main thing tying him to London) after we had them.

You are looking for the impossible. 600k 4 bed house, good schools and 30mins from your central London office? You can't find it as it doesn't exist. Reality is you have to pick a priority and compromise. You'd get a very nice 3 bed flat in a good London location, or a big house near family.
What are you willing to give up to make a lower paid job work?

@Seagulldancing Im very much not looking for a £600k house within 30 mins of London, but rather repeatedly telling other posters that that doesn’t exist and that is why I want to move up north.

I think it is because I feel it’s unfair of me to enforce a change on him that he doesn’t want,
[...] equally it is unfair of him to resist a change that is needed for your health and wellbeing. That would be extraordinarily selfish of him.

I’d be the one pushing through the big change, so it would be all my fault if we regretted it.
Would he blame you? Or would it just be you blaming yourself?

Weigh up the risks: the possible outcome of regretting the move, against the likely outcome of you crashing out of your career with damaged health (possibly permanently damaged, physically or mentally), and you will see it is a no-brainer.
There is risk either way. Just that the safer option of leaving might be 'your fault' (in your own mind), but the tougher option of staying in the job would just be 'the status quo' rather than actually being DH's fault.

I know that I was the one who wanted the kids
It is toxic to keep thinking like this. Ultimately making children takes two, so he had a choice.
Imagine that you divorce and you want to take the kids up north - would he object? Would he try to stop you? If he would object, there is your answer: he wants the kids to stay with or near him, so forget that bullshit about him not wanting children.

DH has already made career sacrifices (eg reduced travel and ironically took up more teaching, which is the main thing tying him to London) after we had them
Every parent makes sacrifices. It is rare indeed for someone's life to carry on unchanged after having children. If a parent's life remains unchanged, that means they are not doing their fair share in taking on the burdens of parenthood.
Just because he has already made some sacrifices, doesn't mean he is exempt from making any more.

You seem to be talking yourself out of making changes. Fair enough - your choice. But don't underestimate the long-term health effects of chronic stress.