Should we leave London after burnout, or stay for my husband's career?

[ChickenChitty]

Help me with my life dilemma.

DH and I have been together for 15 years, we are late 30s with 2 kids at primary school. I work in a stressful job in the City, requiring extremely long hours (60-70hr weeks, weekend work most weekends and most holidays too). DH is in a creative career - his passion. I earn c.6x what he does. He is self-employed so does more with the kids and more around the house (I’d say he does 60% of the childcare and maybe 70% of household tasks).

I nearly died earlier this year with a ruptured appendix that was missed and negligent medical care. It came off the back of a period of very intense work - about 9 months of hell. I’m mentally traumatised from that experience and burnt out generally, and the whole thing has made me reassess my life.

Ive suddenly got clarity that I don’t want to continue doing my job anymore and I don’t even know what I’m doing it for as London is so expensive our quality of life is not great. We have enough equity in our small London terraced house that we could move back to my home town (up north) and buy somewhere large and detached and lovely mortgage free, near much better schools for the kids and near my family. DH really doesn’t want to leave London as he loves it, and his work is here (his family is up north too but nowhere near mine). He would want to continue commuting to London if we moved, which would probably involve overnight stays and impact family life.

Im starting to feel a bit of resentment as I increasingly feel like I’m killing myself and sacrificing my quality of life so that DH can live his dreams. But I love him, am proud of what he does, and would feel awful to effectively force him to move (which we would need to do if I quit my job, as he could never pay the mortgage alone). I knew when we got married that this would be his career. I’ve thought of middle grounds like downsizing in London or moving to a commuter area if I took a pay cut, but that would feel like a much worse outcome for the kids, to leave everything they know for something materially worse, and/or both parents travelling more than we do now . I don’t know whether I’m being unfair in wanting to do this or not, or what the right balance is, so thoughts from other people would be welcome!

@Heronwatcher i can tell you now that that house needs £50k-£100k spent on it (rewiring, likely new heating system, new kitchen and bathroom, before any structural work that’s not obvious from the pics) and one of my children would be in a room so small they haven’t put a photo on the advert. I would not regard that as a reasonable compromise or even good value for money.

You definitely don't need to live in a £2 million house in Hampstead like a Pp claimed (I don't think you do!).

I didn't say she needs to - I said if someone wants to live in Highgate a decent family home is 2m.

I had budgeted more like 1.6m for the OP; she's found houses around the 1.5m mark in areas that fit the bill so I wasn't too far off.

All of these houses are (a) enormous for a 2 child family, and (b) full of beautiful period features which cost a premium. You don’t “need” either of these things to have a happy family/ nice life.

It sounds to me like all you’re prepared to consider is buying something very similar to this type of property but in the north- that’s why you seem to have so few options to choose from. Of my friends who live in London with kids and aren’t in a punishing miserable job, absolutely none of them live in houses like this.

I think given that you’re the one earning most of the money and you’re also the one whose health has been adversely affected, he really has to be the one to compromise. He can only have his nice creative London life while you are financing it; and you’ve reached a point where you can no longer do that for the sake of your health. He needs to come up with some ideas if he doesn’t like yours.

Sheffield and York have some of the best schools in the country and are amazing cities to live in. Very different, but having lived in both I think you would be lucky to live in either and bring up kids there. Both are also 2 hours to London on the train. I think it is easy to put up barriers why we can't do something but something obviously has to changeyou can't do this for the next 50 years. If your husband could commute a couple of times a week you could have a comprimise that would work. I guess it depends where 'home' is up North and if that would workor if you could consider other options that would work for both of you.

Those are what comparable houses look like and cost in the catchment areas for good secondaries. I’m not the one determining the market - it just is what it is.

As mentioned, our families live far away so we have a spare room for them to stay in. We also have a home office now which is essential atm - could ditch that if I didn’t have to work all night anymore, so we’d need a 4 bed - but that reduces the price to £1.25-£1.35m in these areas which is still absolutely loads.

OP - me and my husband have gone round in circles about this for years.

My DH is the one with the high paying, stressful job and our families are all SE (which makes it harder as we don't actually know where else to go and I don't want to move too far from my parents).

We actively looked at houses out in Kent and in the end decided the same as you - it isn't worth the extra commute time. House prices in commuter towns are still high, you lose 1-2hr a day and pay a fortune in train fares. Unless you can get completely away from the gravitational pull of London, to me, you are better off staying in zone 2/3.

We have missed the boat due to secondary school and not wanting to uproot the kids. I really wish we had done it when we had the chance.

It sounds like you have given up a lot over the past 15yrs and maybe your DH will just have to suck it up? I know I would in a heartbeat for my DH. If he really wants to stay in London then maybe he needs to get a better paid job?

I would not be prepared to work 60/70 hour weeks for a small terraced house and no downtime/social life OP. What are you living for? To pay the bills? We live in a 4 bed detached in Yorkshire, each working exactly 37 hours/week in decent but not amazing jobs. I doubt our combined income even matches your sole income but I’ll bet we have more disposable income.

I think so many people fall into the London trap but you have to look at the bigger picture. If you can have the same standard of living elsewhere (or in a lot of cases, a better standard of living) earning X amount less, but able to have your evenings and weekends back to actually enjoy life then why wouldn’t you?

Your husband will just have to suck it up. I’m sure you did not agree to facilitate his passion career for 40 years when you got married. You’re not his workhorse.

But these are still investment banker houses! Even in those exact areas if you go for something 1930s, ex council, or an upper maisonette you’d get something decent for a lot less money. If for you, success must include a beautiful Victorian villa and nothing else then, yes, your options will be very limited! Because you’re competing against all of the investment bankers, partners and family trust fund buyers who want that type of house and you won’t be in that position any more if you give up your job.

What about somewhere like Cambridge? It has a booming tech sector but I don't know what it's like for your industry. It's very quick to get to London for your DH. Houses are expensive but basically anywhere you buy you'll have access to a great school. Personally, I would sacrifice the size and style of the house in order to have an otherwise good quality of life for both parents.

You have researched the alternatives in the SE. None of them work for your family. So now you focus together on the alternatives that do work. Yes DH is likely to have to do some overnight stays in London (I take it not enough equity to get a studio/one-bed in London?). You now just need to focus on the alternatives that make the purchase of a family home in the north the least stressful and the least likely to cause resentment for both you and and DH. The move is not going to be a miracle solution but it is going to be better than the status quo which is you feeling resentful and desperate to escape.

I've looked and I can't see if you've said how often DH has to commute for his teaching job or how much he's off performing/whatever. If it's once a week teaching he can commute from Leeds or York easily. It'll be hard but doable.

The thing to do is not get hung up on what looks like a good house provincially vs London. You've got used to living in a tiny terrace with all the inconvenience that incudes, don't now insist on swapping that for a massive detached house in the countryside because that's not what you need. You need good schools, good transport, and ENOUGH space, not loads of space. You need enough spare cash to commute.

I say do it now. We didn't move when the kids were in primary and there is no way we could uproot them now they're in secondary - and in fact I'm starting to realise that moving out of London once they've left would be quite cruel to them too now, at least until they're established.

If you don't do it and burnout turns into total breakdown you're totally fucked anyway right.

You need a sit down serious talk without children around.You have had enough,you have been very ill.you won’t continue this life.Your work is paying the mortgage how does he think this will be paid each month is he able to do this.Obviously not.So you need a solution.I agree with you .you could have a happier solution moving.There is no point in buying in London all the decent school area are expensive eg Teddington a basic 3 bed is over a million and that is nothing special.I know this the schools are good.Your DH could find an overnight room in a decent area lots of people do this.You have use of the facilities easy commute for his work.It will be a different life he will see less of the children but that is life for many people.A wife who becomes unable to work is far worse and you will survive as a family.Good luck.I have been in your place.

Yes, this is my point.

Those houses I linked to aren’t beautiful Victorian villas - they’re bog standard terraces, of which there are millions around the U.K. and in my home area they would cost about £200k in the less nice areas and £500k in the very nice areas.

Even in London the same style of house could be £500k in not great areas with bad schools vs the £1.5m you see there which prices in the schools and relative safety of the area.

If I’m going to be disrupting my kids lives by taking them out of the area they know, where all their friends are and their lovely primary, I don’t want to move them to a small ex-council flat when I could instead live in a different city and they could live in a similar or nicer house. I don’t have any family here, all my friends have also moved out, so the idea of moving to somewhere that is significantly smaller than we currently live just to be in London for DH’s job is really not what I want. Maybe that is selfish, maybe it’s unreasonable, but it is where I’ve got to I think.

Prestigious but badly paid, therefore a luxury. You earn the money, you nearly died. I think you get final say on this and his little ego can suck it up.

I agree that you need to present this to your DH with a commuting option for him.

The only thing I would warn against is that you need to earn a HUGE day rate to pay for commuting costs into London - never mind making money on top. So I would consider that beforehand, and if it's realistic, just accept that your DH may lose money on commuting into London - but overall it may be worth it for your quality of life.

I gave up a big job in the City when I adopted. I simply couldn't cope with the commuting and the childcare I needed didn't exist and the children needed a f/t parent.

I can't tell you how hard it was to lose the amount of self worth, identity etc I got from my job, never mind the money. Later on I took an interesting but minimum wage job I could do around school hours (I too had no qualifications for decent local jobs) and it was really hard being so junior and having little power.

I'm not saying don't do it. For me it was the right thing to do. But I gave up a lot and there was no way I could get it back.

My husband had a good job and we managed to stay in our house - we are in outer London.

But I would just say that it might bring up stuff about your identity etc if you are stuck in a new place, your husband constantly away in London, and you doing an entry level job, which might end up being just as stressful as the job you currently have, only in different ways.

People respond differently to you once you don't have the big job. I became invisible to a lot of people.

I’d love to know where these “bog standard terraces” are for £200,000 please? Even a little more. I’ve spent a long time looking for somewhere for myself and my teenage nephew, so we have enough space each but live together. I can’t even find a three bedroom place in most areas for my £325,000 budget. I don’t know these areas, I live in a flat N London but circumstances have changed.

Except she has rejected all the suggestions of a lower-paying/lower stress job or downsizing to a more affordable house because it would feel like a failure. She wants to move up north to somewhere where her own career prospects are uncertain and her DH’s are zero, just so they can have a similar or bigger house. This reads like someone who doesn’t want to work those insane hours any more but also is unwilling to give up any of the trappings of wealth that that kind of job made possible.

Honestly OP he needs to understand how his lifestyle is funded.

my DH is a high earner and I have always considered the impact on him of the high pressure environment. If he needed to step away from work and we had to adjust our lives I would never stand in his way and we would adjust. Staying in London isn’t going to be good for you and he needs to recognise that.

Oh come on you’re having a laugh now. Those are in no way, shape or form “bog standard” 😂😂😂 they’re huge, high-end, aspirational period terraces. Most terraces in most towns do not look like that, apart from in the more upmarket areas.

It seems quite clear that you can’t carry on with your current role but it sounds to me like you are jumping to the solution (move up north). Based on what you’ve said that may well be the best all round solution but I think you’d have a more productive discussion with your husband if you co-own the problem eg tell him that you can carry on in such a high stress / high paying job and consider together what the options are.

All the commuter towns in Herts have good if not amazing state schools.
Still expensive south east but you could get a nice family home for 600-900 (area depending).
Obviously you'd still pay to commute to London but it's max an hour depending on which part and often significantly less. Admittedly this is a cost you will have to factor in. There would be local jobs in places like Watford and St. Albans and Stevenage depending on your industry.

OP, by the sound of it, I do the same job as your husband. There are a lot of us who live around the Biggleswade/Bedford type areas, because there are fast trains to
Kings Cross. If you were to move somewhere like that, you might find housing cheaper, a local job for you, and your husband could continue as he is? Just a thought.

Just saw your equity level - come and live in Bath OP - you will get a fabulous house , great state schools, tons on your doorstep , beautiful countryside and a very creative crowd ( we work in music industry) and lots here in film, cameramen, documentaries, sports journalism etc - plus lots of work around here on high net worth/ investment management - as well as Bristol, Swindon and Reading ( all easy on train) - London a 1 hr 20 commute every half an hour -

here’s a couple of examples and would enable a modest mortgage - and they aren’t small andare central - ( walkable into town)

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/90692634

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/89197488