Thread 51 Starmer : pedo mellon a minno

[DuncinToffee]

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https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5534682-thread-50-starmer-to-taksidi-inai-i-antamoivi?page=40&reply=152862844

I honestly don't think Starmer made the Labour party electable. People made fun of his boring delivery before he won.

The Tories made Labour electable.

I am different from a lot on MN because I voted Labour at the last election because I am a Labour voter . So I have never floated and didn't vote for a a change/ because the Tories were so bad- because none of that surprised or disappointed me!. Those people are obviously likely to wander back off again if Labour aren't well led. There are a lot of instinctive Tories on MN.

What Labour led by KS keep ignoring is the pissed off Labour voters. The size of Burnham's victory is , therefore, interesting because where he was available no one went to the Greens (I will say Hannah Spencer is another one with bags of charisma)

Burnham is closer to representing Labour values than Starmer (or Streeting) . Even if he does move a bit rightwards he may well pull it off.

Except that this by-election was meant to be Reform showing what it could do in a constituency that had just voted for Reform in the councils. They were throwing the kitchen sink at it. It was a huge gamble for Burnham. Blah blah. Then he/Labour won with 55% of the votes. Reform weren't even close. So I don't think we are as doomed as people believe. I do think that Labour needs to find some self belief.

I think maybe they are worried. They were so gleeful at the thought of getting Starmer out they didn't consider the fact that Burnham is actually quite popular. The size of his majority has spooked them.

It's a bit ridiculous to suggest that Labour changing leadership is destabilising. Starmer has been the Labour party leader for over 6 years. That's a good innings. Certainly better than the chop and change Tories.

I think they are indeed spooked by the margin of the win.

Maybe a lesson that X is not real life?

There was also very little support for the Greens or the Lib Dems. So the progressive vote has come together to keep out Reform. I’m very pleased that Andy Burnham had far more support than Reform/Restore combined.

Sadly, they’ve probably also voted to get Starmer out. I’ve always liked him but I don’t see how he can turn this around now.

What this isn’t necessarily is a vote for Andy Burnham himself.

While I recognise Starmer's strengths and achievements (not least his performance on foreign policy), I don't think he would have any chance of winning another general election. I thought at the time that the Tories lost the last election rather than Labour winning it and I can't imagine any scenario in the next three years that would make Starmer electable.
Being a confirmed lefty I don't like Blairite policies - but I do think that Burnham (assuming he doesn't fuck everything up...) is much more likely to perform well at the polls in three years time.

I'm on the same page as @Piggywaspushed and @Grumpyoldpersonwithcats

If AB becomes leader I really do hope he doesn't drift any further to the right. And I would like Angela Rayner back in the fold.

Totally agree that while I can list good things labour have done the average member of public can't.

I don't think labour have been amazing at Comms but even whatever good they have done on that front either hasn't been reported or has been twisted. They don't stand a chance.

Sadly I totally agree with you here.

I think he’ll have to bring Rayner back into the fold, after she supported his return to Parliament. Plus, she’s been cleared by HMRC now.

I think bringing Rayner back at this point would be a huge mistake. Maybe once he has settled in as PM for a good year, maybe.

This is assuming he does become PM!

That will cause meltdown lol! I think MSM will be even more ferocious on a more left gov’t - and how many threads on here will there be!

Im not sure Tice organised his right wing supporters well for tactical voting then - though the more left leaning seemed organised for the desired outcome- we need some unity on the left to keep the RW down and it doesn’t always happen so well.

I am wondering whether AB would dial back on the immigration rhetoric - I’d hope so - otherwise I’ll probably stick to not unsettling the party/leadership for now.

I think you’re right that it would cause meltdown, but I believe he’ll be pressurised into bringing her back sooner rather than later, especially if she openly supports his leadership bid.

All hypothetical, obviously, though it does look inevitable that Burnham will be the next PM.

I have really mixed feelings. I agree with @cardibach that Labour have a marked card with the media. I like Starmer but I really didn’t like the pandering to the right and to Reform voters on immigration. I think Starmer has been excellent on the world stage and has dealt well with Trump.
Maybe he should be Foreign secretary to Burnham’s PM.
I’d to see them be much more radical and I’d like to see Rayner back.

I am also a pissed off Labour voter. I voted Plaid once, in the last EU elections because I didn’t like Labour’s stance at the time but otherwise I’ve always voted Labour. I’m still a member.

DARVO

Starmer has said "If there is a contest, then yes, I will stand."

What absolutely no one (except me) is saying is that even under any PR scheme, Burnham would have won.

Quite how that frames the narrative for the forthcoming electoral reform, I don't know.

Interesting, we had two council by-elections yesterday. Labour held one. The other, to fill a vacancy created by the Senedd elections went to the Tories. The seat had previously been held by a Tory councillor who defected to Reform and who now sits for Reform in the Senedd. I’m weirdly pleased that it’s gone back to being Tory.

Maybe he (Starmer) should be Foreign secretary to Burnham’s PM.

I've been thinking the same thing. Don't think it will ever happen though.

Except votes fall differently under PR. There was definitely some tactical voting on the left to beat Reform/Restore and those votes wouldn’t go to Burnham under PR.

Another loss for Reform

https://goodlawproject.org/high-court-rejects-reforms-bid-to-throw-out-our-challenge/

Oi ! Nige ! Can you spare some wonga ?

Reform is also likely to have to pay our costs to be assessed if not agreed – over £40,000 which we incurred and over £160,000 to the Access to Justice Foundation in respect of our solicitors’ pro bono representation.

Chicken feed

£5m 🎶

Ha!