Belfast attack

[Greenwitchart]

I can see that the previous thread on the topic is full so I am starting a new one to continue the discussion.

The points I wanted to say as someone who immigrated to the UK over 30 years ago:

• This is a horrific attack and everyone's thoughts should be with the victim and his loved one.

• However, I do think that we have an issue with some people getting into the country whether legally or illegally who simply don't have the same values as the majority of the population and are not able to follow its laws and customs.

• The asylum and immigration system needs a serious overall and to do more to stop men who are a potential danger to society because of their beliefs/culture/failure to integrate getting through the system and ending up committing violent acts. Some people destroy their documents and checks can only go so far when it is hard to verify claims and the chaotic countries they come from does not have reliable records that can be accessed . There are many peaceful and genuine asylum seekers who just want a safe place to live in peace but we seem to be getting in too many angry, violent men who abuse the system and that has to stop.

• I don't want to share the streets with people who have no respect for women and girls, are religious fanatics to the point of extremism or show hate towards gay people and bring violence in general.

• Having people from different cultures coming in is fine as long as they integrate well and take on the values of the country they live in. It does not work if they just live parallel lives and fail to follow the law of the land.

The crime has already happened, it’s too late.

Living in constant fear is no way to live.

Why on earth would you struggle to define it?

Would you be happy to live next to an asylum hotel? Would you be OK with your daughters (assuming you have any) walking past a group of male asylum seekers ?

It's also interesting to see the rising numbers of MN posters willing to openly say they are fed up with unfettered, unregulated immigration. This was unheard of say, 6 months ago as anyone expressing these views would be shut down and labelled a far right racist. Is the tide turning?

All of 'them'? Do you mean all people from Sudan, like this alleged attacker?

What makes me sad about that (apart from the obvious immediate human cost) is that we have come to a place where people can almost proudly say extremely racist things, and be applauded rather than chastised.

And of course were we to follow through with your racist suggestion it would all be done without any material improvement to public safety because, as those pesky facts prove, immigrants are no more criminally inclined than anyone else.

Dark times indeed when we sacrifice so much that has genuinely kept us harmonious and safe for decades on the alter of prejudice, wilfully ignoring facts in the process.

I imagine the poster will say yes because because they apparently “don’t see what we see” so we must be all racists and imagining it eh!

Hopefully it is turning. It's just sad it's taken the recent tragedies to turn the tide.

Ah the racist card again! How many times is that now? How unoriginal and boring.

Indeed. If she doesn't see it, it's fabricated.

I dont know the full stats per head of population but one crime is more likely to be committed by male Muslims which is terrorism, the facts bear that out

I dont know what the proportion of crimes of rape, sexual assault, murder are committed by white British, black African, black Caribbean, ME, south Indian, Chinese etc etc.

Most crime is committed by men overall, thats for sure.

Agree with you OP.

The only good thing that has come out of this most recent one is that it seems the establishment is monitoring this now online and knows US tech giants incite people, warning locals of potential riots, the politicians are warning of violence and at least there is some mitigation of angry mob protests. Now that they are listening to keeping people safe from angry protests, next step is to keep people safe full stop from letting in foreign criminals or anyone who has a heightened risk profile. Monitor them continuously then if you want to unleash this on innocent people on our streets? Responsibility must be taken.

I wouldn't want to live next to any kind of place where bored young men congregate all day. Asylum status has nothing to do with it.

I genuinely don't see what you see. You aren't imagining what you see, but what you are doing is assuming that it represents something much bigger than it does. You take your experience and assume that it represents the country. Facts say otherwise.

I base my opinion not on my own small scale experience but on statistics and facts. What else sensible is there to do?

Agreed. @Greenwitchart

The political classes need to address the issues

Not rely on a system that leads to horrific crimes?

100% agree. I'm glad to see the tide is turning. I am sick to death of people being called racist for raising concerns about all of this (that you talk about in your OP,) and I am very glad to see so many posters agreeing with you @Greenwitchart

Many places I have visited online today (including Facebook) are full of posts like yours OP. People have had enough, and it's reached a point where many people are saying they've had enough, and are no longer afraid to say so, because they know that the few people calling them 'racist,' are ignorant, bigoted, narrow-minded, liars, who are hard of thinking.

Anyone who is coming up with excuses for this vile monster's violent and abhorrent attack needs locking up - with him!

Same area, across the way

You need to step out of your little bubble and venture into the towns and cities that are being affected. Then come back on here and say there's nothing to see.

Absolute rot! My parents were immigrants and had never committed a crime in their lives. This all boils down to taking the piss with a weak system. I’m sure you wouldn’t be happy if it was your family being attacked, I’m sure your bleeding heart empathy would fly out the window.

The system doesn't lead to horrific crimes. The system exists, and horrific crimes exist alongside it. Asylum seekers are disproportionately less likely to commit crimes than the native population.

offensive to suggest this area is anything other than safe normally given the shocking and abhorrent event that took place here today and the bravery of the residents that intervened

Just because you don’t see what the rest of us see, doesn’t mean we are liars and racists and quite frankly, I’m sick and tired of seeing posts like yours popping up on these threads from people who don’t see what we see who then have the cheek to gaslight us and call us racist! If you don’t see what we see then you have no right to comment on it and trying to counter it by claiming we are wrong or racist! Either go out yourself to these areas and open your eyes or just quit with your gaslighting nonsense and overdone, outdated racist card excuse

I live in a large town and am in a big city daily for work. I just don't see what you see. It's as simple as that.

I also suspect that I don't see the social media that you see. Maybe that's part of the reason.