Toy phone or potential meltdown at a family restaurant meal?

[NavigatingASD]

Having a disagreement with dh about the best way to manage ds (7, autistic) at an upcoming family meal.

He can stay very calm if has a particular toy phone to play with (lights games sounds etc) it’s got 2 volume settings but doesn’t go very loud . Dh says it’s going to be inappropriate but without it ds shouting / screaming / noises will be much more noisy?? Which will annoy other people more than a toy!

We’ve had this discussion before. I always take the toy but this time he’s saying it’s not going to be ok. It’s not a particularly quiet restaurant anyway. It will keep ds calm so I can’t see the problem but what do others think is more annoying - a child on a moderately at worst noisy toy that actually may not be audible if the restaurant is very busy or a screaming child who is overwhelmed and/ or bored?

Also, I have an autistic sibling and I don’t remember ever going out for meals when we were young. Even when we got older it was an extremely rare occurrence. It never occurred to me that this was unusual as it was normal life to me and it was only when I became an adult that I realised we didn’t get these experiences but I’m 100% ok with it.

And they might not?
There might be a disabled person there who has higher needs and makes more noise.
There might be people there who are absolutely fine with the noise of a small toy so that he can be included. 🙄

Another jumping on the neither option sounds good bus.

I get all you are saying about desensitising but this shouldn’t be done at the expense of other diners. It could be done in other ways or other situations.

I have a child who did not cope in restaurants so I get it. But we just didn’t go until he could manage and not affect other diners. And now we play it by ear, sometimes he copes, sometimes it’s too much and he has to leave but I constantly have on my mind ‘is his behaviour disruptive to other people?’

As someone who is sound sensitive having a child with an audible electronic toy within earshot would really ruin a meal for me so I am very aware of my children not being noisy in restaurants.

Totally agree with this post. It beggars belief the amount of DC these days who 'can't cope'. If he can't cope, remove him from/don't take him to, the stimuli.

Apologies the noise of a toy 🙄🙄🙄

Lighten up fgs, he’s SEVEN

"It beggars belief the amount of DC these days who 'can't cope'" - part of this is because it's more acceptable for more severely disabled children to be in public 'these days'. I'm sure you'll agree that this is a good thing 👍

Plenty of dc at family restaurants play with this sort of thing anyway - even without SEN issues.

I'm not saying your DH is wrong to try to think of a better solution, but if he can't I honestly don't think it will rock the other diners to their core.

Okay then so fuck anyone (adult or child) who actually finds it distressing (not just irritating). Because ableism is okay toward them.

Gotcha

I have misophonia so a screaming child or a noisy toy would mean I had to leave the restaurant. If I'd saved up for a posh meal and wanted to hear my fellow eaters speak I would be intensely annoyed that someone brought a screaming child into the restaurant whether they were neurodiverse or not. By all means take him to a Greggs or a Macdonalds but don't take him where he'll ruin the experience for those who have paid a lot for their meal and for whom it is a special occasion. You also need to consider that other people in the restaurant might be autistic or otherwise neurodiverse and that having your child screaming or playing with a noisy toy might trigger them too. It sounds as if he doesn't enjoy his trips to the restaurant anyway, or why would he be screaming or need to be distracted or soothed by a toy? Take him to something noisy that he might enjoy - a football match, perhaps.

They both sound equally bad, a noisy toy or a screaming child, no thanks not what I want when going to a restaurant.

It's a family restaurant though. Surely with misophonia you would know to pick a different style of venue?

Posh meal doesnt usually equal family places though does it?. I'm assuming you would avoid those types of places anyway..

And additionally, I've also got Misophonia and going out to eat with people is my worst nightmare. How can you cope with all the people eating it it's that bad you can't cope with kids?

.

You’re very fixed on seeing this from one (IMO selfish) perspective.

My son is awaiting an autism assessment. He finds restaurants difficult. He is 7. We tend not to go, it might be that he has a meltdown, it might be that he’s moaning because he can’t wait. We are very aware of others’ right to enjoy their paid for meal in a peaceful setting so we just don’t go! And that’s fine - we do other things that are better suited to his needs.

He’s sensitive to noise but isn’t a fan of the feel of ear defenders, particularly if eating. Let’s say we build him up to going to a restaurant. Does the autistic child’s need to have a noise making toy trump my child’s need for a quiet dining experience? Both families need a family friendly restaurant, both have autistic children with opposite needs.

I'm sure there's a middle ground. E.g. 5pm at a Pizza Express there are lots of babies and toddlers etc but OP's family could still have a special feeling celebration meal. I'd imagine the people replying with misophonia or autistic people with extreme noise sensitivity are not going to a Pizza Express at 5pm otherwise they'd constantly have to leave just from the squealing toddlers and overexcited 10 year old birthday party dinners alone. If it's a venue/time acceptable for children to make normal child noises, it's acceptable for a small disabled child to bring a noise toy on a quiet setting imo.

Also the number of family style restaurants has increased, so the less-developed habits of children are on display more. My grandfather had to eat in the nursery in his own home!

I don't think anyone here thinks OP should take him with his phone to somewhere targeted at diners who want a quiet meal.

Now now! don't you come on here talking sense!

If your husband is refusing to allow him the toy, then he needs to be responsible for calming his son if he gets disruptive.

Yup there is always one who comes up with a reasonable, win/win plan 😬🤣

Take the toy. It's the one thing that keeps him content/comfort, no contest. But I guess be prepared to go home if all too much anyway.

You are doing all the right to gradually get him used to day to day life.
Good on you!

Take the toy phone, let DS know it's on your bag ready for when he needs it. But discuss with him up front whether he might like to try the lower volume this time. Do this plenty in advance. Remind him in the days leading up to and on the day and as you leave.

When (not if) you give it to him in the restaurant, remind again that he's going to try the lower volume.

Is it a restaurant he knows well?

oh, just to add, if your DH doesn't agree to the toy, then let him know when DS melts down that he will be the one taking him out of the restaurant while the rest of you finish your meal

By 'selfish adults', do you mean adults who've paid to eat at a restaurant and not to hear screaming kids or some annoying toy? Surely the selfish adults are the ones subjecting them to that?

It's obviously not what you want to hear OP, but neither are okay. Family friendly just means they cater for children food wise and a usual expected level of chatter, etc. family friendly doesn't mean shouting or noisy electronics, neither are in any way acceptable for others trying to enjoy their meal. You keep saying it's a good opportunity, but only for you, not for the other poor diners trying to have a meal.

I'm not sure this type of exposure helps tbh. You may find he is naturally able to cope better as he gets older and his understanding grows, or he may become more sensitive (this happened w my son) but I'm not sure putting him in stressful situations now will pay any dividends long term.

I think if he needs a noisy toy for a distraction then he's not ready for this type of environment.