Depraved, Desperate, Deluded and Dangerous - Trump Thread #160

[Spandauer]

More of the same. 🤬

Previous thread:
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5510944-the-king-of-crazytown-cant-control-the-chaos-trump-thread-159

I read back your post and here's the thing. @Terrribletwos, you've misrepresented what I posted. Fortunately I had copied my original post so can quote directly from it.

you're specifically asking why should Isreal exist.
I wrote "What if there were no Israel? This requires hypothetical answers, because Israel does exist. So it's about what would the world be like under these circumstances.
Which is very different from something like "Why does Israel exist", which factually questions Israel's existence.
There's also a whole Philosophy topic on the difference between 'should' and 'is' btw.

Sorry if I'm ott; words and meaning fascinate me. I blame Philosophy! I should have studied Engineering.😆

<moving on>

Funnily enough we covered this at school yesterday. If I remember correctly, nation = a people with a shared history/culture/religion, state = the government structure, country = the geographical location. Although nowadays they are all used interchangeably.

Even if Iran engage and perhaps allow independents to go in and search or verify any nuclear weapons. How does anyone know where they are? Is it just agreed, from before, that the sites are the same? Could they have been moved? And if so, how can anyone find them? Is there a way of tracking uranium from the sky?

Oh @MrTiddlesTheCat you're making me think that the post should have stayed up after all. What year was this discussed in? Definitions matter.

Is it too late to rouse @RedTagAlan to request a bingo card for the peace negotiations?

It has not escaped my notice that we're also starting to develop a Trump era dictionary. <purses lips>

I suspect that similar questions get posted on SM a lot with malicious intent or for gaming engagement. If you assume everyone is doing that then I can see how it could be seen as inflammatory. But I don’t think your post read like that at all.

sometimes a question is just a question to further understanding or thinking.

Pope Leo's at it again.

In his strongest words yet, Pope Leo XIV on Saturday denounced the “delusion of omnipotence” that he says is fueling the US-Israel war in Iran and demanded political leaders stop and negotiate peace.
Leo presided over an evening prayer service in St Peter’s Basilica on the same day the US and Iran began face-to-face negotiations in Pakistan.
The first US-born pope didn’t mention the US or Trump by name in his prayer, which was planned before the talks were announced. But Leo’s tone and message appeared directed at Trump and US officials, who have boasted of US military superiority and justified the war in religious terms.
“Enough of the idolatry of self and money!” Leo said. “Enough of the display of power! Enough of war!
“Stop! It is time for peace! Sit at the table of dialogue and mediation, not at the table where rearmament is planned,” he added.
Leo, who is known for choosing his words carefully, has emerged as a vocal critic of the Iran war.
The Guardian.

I go to school for adults in Sweden. Currently I'm doing my equivalent of A-levels. We're starting WW1 in history next week, so were discussing nationalism and what defines a country.

I was just coming on to talk about Pope Leo. He’s really taken the gloves off over that last week. How long before he gets banned from the US?

This was from earlier in the week:
God does not bless any conflict. Anyone who is a disciple of Christ, the Prince of Peace, is never on the side of those who once wielded the sword and today drop bombs. Military action will not create space for freedom or times of #Peace, which comes only from the patient promotion of coexistence and dialogue among peoples.

Here’s looking at you JD.

Being undereducated (especially compared to you wonderful bunch), with a dislike of Geography despite a love of history, this conversation bemuses me.

The ideas are big. I would relate it to counties, Devon and Cornwall, both have scones- jam or cream first can often be used to define where they belong. For me, I am Welsh, my parents, grandparents, great grandparents etc were all welsh- if I was told that this land was now Engish I would object with every fibre of my being.

There is a reason that many Ukrainian towns and cities under Russian control have seemingly lost many of the residents who lived there 20 years ago while many more Russian speakers have recently moved in.

The importance of nationhood and belonging underlies the reasoning behind the theft and transportation of Ukrainian children to be brought up in Russia.

I'm on a couple of threads and starting to forget what was discussed where. Putting this here anyway as part of the discussion on what could be the fallout if the fake peace talks fail.
https://archive.ph/C1DZG

America’s inability to deliver decisive action will not go unnoticed by China and Russia who could use the shambles in Iran to their advantage

He was born in Chicago.
He cannot be refused entry to the US.

He could run for President in 2028

I'm not a lover of Church and State being one and the same, but the irony of that would be delicious.

I think ICE would have a go.

Hi

I see an EO stripping him of his citizenship as he's obviously heading the Barrio Kings drug cartel. ICE might even put find a tattoo on him as proof.

I just feel so overwhelmed and sad over the whole debacle.

I have ray of hope, and that is that this whole debacle may wake people up - who are we and what do we want?

However, our democratic systems are so and so divided (looking at you Social Media and Murdoch types), and so dominated by gazillions of dollars from who knows who, that I worry we may not...

Even Fox news is calling out Trump's bullshit now

Fox News points out that Trump’s claim about all the Iranian leaders being dead is undermined by the fact his administration is negotiating with Iranian leaders right now

@DuncinToffee I worry about that though - like they could goad him into doing something dreadful.

You know what quote that comment will trigger :-)

"I know exactly who reads the papers. The Daily Mirror is read by people who think they run the country. The Guardian is read by people who think they ought to run the country. The Times is read by people who actually do run the country. The Daily Mail is read by the wives of the people who run the country. The Financial Times is read by people who own the country. The Morning Star is read by the people who think the country should be run by another country. And the Daily Telegraph is read by people who think it is."

No Problem. It's all set up to drag and drop.

I assume you mean a bingo card of things Turd will say to fuck it up ? He has already said a fair bit in that direction. And that was just walking to the helicopter.

Because we all know they are not actually talking about it in Islamabad. They are singing Abba karaoke and drinking 500 quid a bottle scotch. What happens in Islamabad stays in Islamabad. Wink wink.

I've recently been mentally amending those last lines to:

"The Morning Star is read by the people who think the country should be run by another country. And the Daily Telegraph is read by people who are trying to make that happen."

Lovely guy - that name instantly triggered my brain to remember his arrest for assault. (Why does it remember stuff like this and not where I put the nail polish remover?🤔)

I do think some newspaper proprietors would genuinely have to pause to work out which they prefered, if offered the choice between having the UK run by a Labour government (any Labour government), which they consider an affront to the natural order of things, and having the country run by the mafia-boss in the Kremlin or that mafia boss's mini-me in the White House.