I absolutely lost it at our 15 yo this evening. Need a handhold.

[MoSalahsBeard]

We have been through years of hell with our 15 yo ds. He has always been horribly rude and explosive, and after a few incidents last year which involved physical aggression towards us we pursued a diagnosis of adhd. He was diagnosed and is medicated, but we still went through hell after that with him vaping at school, getting in trouble and hanging around with the awful trouble making kids.
Since September his behaviour at school has been a lot better but he still talks to us like dirt most days. The amount of blow up arguments over his rudeness and attitude we have had is insane. It’s got to the point where sometimes me and dh don’t want to live anymore. I’ve started self harming and dh is having awful stomach trouble and even vomited the other day through stress. Years and years this has been all piling on top of us. It’s too much.

and then at the end of last week ds started talking to this girl who is a friend of a friend at another school and they became ‘together’ despite having never met. I then checked his phone as I do occasionally and found she had been sending him explicit photos much to his delight.

Fast forward to today. He send me a text saying can he meet her after school for half an hour. her school is nowhere near his so there’s no reason that would be possible so I was suspicious. PLus naturally I wasn’t happy about the photos so I wasn’t keen for him to go off and meet her. So I said no just come home please. However he didn’t come home for another 25 mins and it turned out he was hanging around with one of the douche bags from his school who had a managed move to another school recently because his behaviour was so bad. When he came in it all got heated and his attitude was appalling, he was muttering ‘whatever’ and other rude things under his breath while we were talking to him. It all escalated to the point where I burst into tears and told him straight up that both me and his dad’s mental health is majorly suffering because of his rudeness and behaviour and neither of us want to live with someone who makes the house into a miserable stressful mess.

he went quiet after that and apologised. I’ve put him on a phone ban and he’s quietly sitting doing his homework while I try to stop crying.

I grew up in a horrendous violent situation as a kid and spent every day terrrified of my parents. I fear because of that I’ve been too soft on him.

i often feel l am constantly failing and like they’d be both better off without me. Please help.

Can I just ask - is he someone who is quite literal? Does he see things in black and white? Because my ND son is quite literal and sometimes I feel he is being rude but I realised he is often stating facts and not sugar coating things. People don’t realise that the inattentive part of adhd means kids miss social cues and therefore don’t have the same social skills as other kids their age so people think they are being rude but it’s part of their disability.

The trick is not to take it too personally.

Loads of teenagers are vile. Loads of parents clash with them. In so many ways, it ISN’T personal. They have to reject their parents to become their own people. It’s literally part of the process.

Although it’s not the end of the world to shout at them sometimes, in general you should try to be calm and authoritative, making it clear what is and what is not acceptable and encouraging acceptable behaviour. There are so many reasons:

1. Kids learn much more subconsciously from what their parents model than from what their parents consciously tell them to do.
2. If a parent tries to keep too much control for too long, it will create more conflict, not less. And ruin the long-term relationship.
3. If you tell your child he is destroying your mental health, this will only add to his burdens. He will feel he can’t tell you stuff. He will feel you can’t handle him, thst he is worthless, that you can’t love him warts and all, that he has to pretend he doesn’t have any feelings, instead of learning how to deal with his feelings.
4. There is actually no need to catastrophise that this is how he will behave when he is married, for example. That’s not how it works. This is teenage behaviour which he will get through if you support him. Catastrophising just raises the stakes and makes everything worse.

If you can manage not to take it personally, think how free you will feel and what a weight will be lifted. Surely everyone will be happier? Just try to see yourself as one of an army of parents struggling with the same issues, not one of whom is taking it personally. Solidarity!

I have adhd and so do both my kids. It’s very hard as an adult with adhd to parent a child with adhd. People with adhd struggle to manage their emotions, need down time, become overwhelmed. It’s almost impossible to balance your own needs so you can be in the right mind set to help him with his.
Can I suggest you share this journey with him? Explain how your adhd affects you and therefore why certain things are harder. Sit down together and help each other identify what behaviours are adhd behaviours so you both can be more sensitive to each others needs. Him speaking under his breath is not ok - but it is just him trying to manage his emotions. Rather than just say he can’t do it - teach him to say out loud I just need a minute to process my emotions and walk away but come back later.

Honestly, @MoSalahsBeard . Some people on here have no sense of proportion and no generosity of spirit.

Usually, I am sure you parent wonderfully but sometimes, teenagers need slapping in the face with a wet fish. If you got to bed this evening with “everybody fed, nobody dead”, then tomorrow is all a new day.

ND children need completely different parenting.

I think you are trying to dominate him too much.
Sounds like you just want to punish him even if it's just because he was grumpy about the last arbitrary punishment.

You need to pick your battles. Concentrate on your relationship with him.

Hmm. Lots of drama and extremes written into your OP. I wonder if you and your DH have been modelling the kind of behaviour you see in him? What kind of example do you set? What boundaries/consequences does he receive for being rude? Have you let him get away with too much?

Sounds like he has some pretty major behavioural issues, especially at school. Is moving him to a new school (or home schooling) an option?

@MoSalahsBeard
I feel really sorry for your DS.
What a miserable teenage experience he is having at home.
Poor him.
He has been exploding in temper at you because of his ADHD symptoms mixed with teenage hormones.
Since his diagnosis, have you educated yourself on how difficult it is for him to self regulate if he has ADHD? Have you educated yourself on the enormous complexities of ADHD? And of all its symptoms? And how it impacts mood and behaviour? And have you read about how incredibly stressful and challenging it is on a daily basis dealing with secondary school if you are neurodivergent?
You state he is rude to you, but have you considered that neurodivergent individuals, particularly teenagers, can sound as though they are being rude even when they are not meaning to come across as rude? Are you aware that if a teenager thinks that their parents are treating them in a non-understanding and intolerant way, then their hurt and upset feelings about this comes across as being blunt, which is interpreted by parents as rudeness? Are you aware that if a teenager is stressed with daily life, which many teenagers are, and which many neurodivergent people are, and he is a mixture of both so he has double the stress, that home should be his safe place where he can let his stress out?
His violence at home is not acceptable and needs to be addressed.
But you and your DH have shown no insight into what is going on for him.
Why haven't you sought counselling or therapy for him in all these years?
I firmly believe that unhappy, angry teenagers have valid reasons for why they are unhappy and angry. Then they get dealt with by adults who punish them for their anger and in turn they become even more unhappy. These adults include parents and teachers.
Have you ever actually sat down with him and asked him to tell you how he feels, and really, truly listened to him? Have you told him you love him and want to support him?
So what if he has a girlfriend. He is 15. This is normal. Why are you angry about this?
Honestly, your poor son has texted you to ask if he can meet his girlfriend (many 15 year olds would not text and ask this, they would just do it); obeyed you when you have said no to meeting her (many 15 year olds would ignore the refusal and go to meet their girlfriend regardless of you saying no); spent 25 minutes hanging out with a friend after school who used to go to his school, probably spent the time having a conversation with the boy about what the boys' new school is like and just having a general chat (this is entirely normal for a 15 year old and shows good social skills. It also shows that your DS is not horribly judgemental and prejudice against this boy like you are by calling him a 'douche bag' without knowing anything about what that boy has struggled with in life), it is perfectly reasonable to have a 25 minute chat with someone on the way home from school, there is nothing wrong with this, and maybe he'd had a tough day at school and needed to decompress for a while before returning home; then he walks in to his mother having a go at him; he responds to this by muttering "whatever" and other things under his breath (probably thinking to himself 'why is my mum having a go at me again when I've done what she instructed and didn't meet my girlfriend because she told me not to yet she's still having a go at me); then gets his mum bursting into tears and blaming him for his parents having poor mental health (that is a wild amount of emotional pressure and guilt to dump on a 15 year old); then gets his phone confiscated (at the age of 15?! It's his phone. Give it back!); And his response to all this unfair and emotionally guilt-tripping parenting? His response is to go quiet, then go upstairs and do his homework (I shouldn't need to tell you that many 15 year olds would shout back and then storm out of the house and not return for hours).
Sorry, but this is not a bad son you have.
These are the actions of a good son.
What you have, is a deeply misunderstood neurodivergent teenager who is struggling.
Get him the professional support and help he so desperately needs. Private counselling or therapy.
Be a more understanding, empathic parent.
Read books on ADHD teenagers. Learn about how hard it is for him. ADHD is not only about attention deficit. It's so much more complex than that.
And get professional help for yourself. Educate yourself about all the symptoms of ADHD that you yourself have. Are you aware you are having ADHD RSD in response to his communication with you. Maybe he has RSD too. Learn about it.
And get professional help urgently for your self harming.
It is not your son's fault you are self harming. It is not your son's fault your husband is vomiting.
You and your DH clearly have mental health difficulties, so please seek help for this and look after yourself. You have a responsibility towards yourself and your son to look after your mental health and seek support with this. Book a GP appointment today. Find a private counsellor or therapist today.
Stop blaming your son, and start listening to him.
And please, tell him you love him. Tell him every single day. He really needs to hear it.

Honestly, your poor son has texted you to ask if he can meet his girlfriend

She is not his girlfriend. He has never met her. He doesn't even know if she really exists.

....then gets his phone confiscated (at the age of 15?! It's his phone. Give it back!);

He has explicit images on his phone sent by this girl, or someone purporting to be a young girl. Do you not understand that this is illegal and is potentially a grooming and exploitation situation? Not only is op right to confiscate his phone, she needs to report it as a safeguarding issue.

Another secondary teacher here. He needed to be told. He’s a bit sad? Good. He should be!

Howwever I also agree that he is save-able. His reaction shows that.

I agree I don’t think he’s that abnormal and he still cares

I mean this kindly but your post comes across as you not fully understanding ADHD and what sounds like a PDA profile. Also, calling the students hes associating with douchebags etc doesn’t come across well considering your child is demonstrating the same behaviours due to his needs, they are likely having significant issues at home/SEND themselves. I’m really sorry you are both suffering so much, it is unimaginably difficult but, it isn’t going to improve until you work out a way to parent a ND child. Hugs xx

I agree she needs to see gp tomorrow so does the father, they can’t blame this all on their son

All of this

Well done op you have stood up to him and set the boundary. Now keep it up. He needs rules and ways to regulate his emotions. Punch bag in the garden for the summer?

I think when he gets older and more mature (and I'm sure he will), if you had kept the 'parent mask' fully on, he'd be horrified that you hadn't said anything.

He does have some control over his behaviour and he ought to know that your DH is so stressed that he's been physically sick and you're feeling you don't want to be here anymore.

if you had kept the 'parent mask' fully on, he'd be horrified that you hadn't said anything.
No he wouldn't. He'd be grateful for his parents doing the job of parenting and not putting their complicated emotions on to him as a child.
he ought to know that your DH is so stressed that he's been physically sick and you're feeling you don't want to be here anymore.
No, he should NOT know this! OMG. I despair🙆

But he wasn't just 'told'.
He had his mother arguing at him in what she describes a situation as 'escalating' and then bursting in to tears in front of him and telling him he's responsible for his parents' mental health 'majorly suffering'.
This is appalling.
I'd say this is emotional abuse towards a 15 year old. A 15 year old who is a child. A 15 year old who is ND. A 15 year old who is struggling with his mood and his emotions.
I'm honestly horrified that you would reply by saying "Good" in response to him feeling sad. That boy will have been sad and quiet whilst he internalised all of those heavy, adult, mentally unstable emotions expressed by his mother. Along with him feeling 'a bit sad' as you put it, in response to what his mother said and did, he will have felt fear, guilt, worry, anxiety, self-blame, rejection, insecurity, failure. He didn't even do anything wrong, he just texted to ask if he could meet a girl, got told no, obeyed that, chatted to a boy he knows, then came home from school.
What was wrong with this?
His parents are mentally ill. His mother is self harming. His father is vomiting with stress. These aren't normal responses from parents. This IS NOT his fault.
If his mother is self harming and his father is vomiting in reaction to the stress of having a ND teenager, then they are not acting or behaving normally around him on a daily basis. He will be absorbing and noticing their mental instability. And this is his home. This is what he's living with. Yet he needs stable parents to help him, support him and guide him in managing his ND symptoms through his teenage years.
And, as a secondary school teacher, your response to his sadness is "Good".
You should be ashamed of yourself.
Go and educate yourself on teenage psychology and ADHD symptoms and the impact of living with ND. And whilst you're at it, educate yourself further on the impacts on children, teenagers and young people of living with parents who are emotionally and mentally unstable within the home.
Appalling comment from you, in your position as someone who works in education and has authority over teenagers. What an abjectly appalling lack of insight.

She is not his girlfriend. He has never met her. He doesn't even know if she really exists.
That was my phone's autocorrect. I actually typed out 'meet this girl' and my phone changed 'this' to 'his' (or maybe that was a typo on my part, I don't know, it was 4am, I was tired), and it definitely autocorrected 'girl' to 'girlfriend'. It's just done it again but I've noticed and changed it.
Anyway, I know it's not his girlfriend. The important point is, he texted his mum to ask if he could meet her, his mum said no, he obeyed his mum and he didn't go and meet the girl. He did exactly as his mum told him. That's good, right??
He has explicit images on his phone sent by this girl, or someone purporting to be a young girl. Do you not understand that this is illegal and is potentially a grooming and exploitation situation? Not only is op right to confiscate his phone, she needs to report it as a safeguarding issue.
I never commented on this aspect of what has happened. I literally did not mention the images on his phone. So why are you questioning me on my understanding of the legalities of this and the potential for grooming and exploitation? You do not know my position on this, because I have not mentioned the images or what my opinion or thoughts are regarding this, which means that you have jumped to what can only be defined as presumptions about me.
The OP is not right to confiscate his phone. She needs to handle the situation by formally reporting these images that have been sent to her son's phone, and teaching her son about the implications, dangers and risks involved in these images being sent to him, and I agree it needs to be taken very seriously and OP was right to say no to her son when he was asking to meet up with the girl, but his phone should not be confiscated from him.

Hi @MoSalahsBeard , I'm neurodivergent, as is my DP, and very probably our DS. I think you're doing fine. Take any useful advice offered from the comments here; ignore the posters using this site as a means to abuse or process their own issues. There are a lot of them. The toxicity of Mumsnet is nothing new. You love your son, you're doing your best, tomorrow you'll try to do better, it's all we can do.