Have parents given up parenting

[Dearparents]

So I was just watching some news.
And apparently their is a rise in reception school children, that 1 in 4 children are not potty trained ,can't eat or drink independently and try to swipe pages in books.

Some parents are saying it's down to the teachers to teach these thing's.

Most say it's because their child has some sort of SEN.

It got me thinking of a family member that has 3 kids 3/4 and 5 that are all in nappies and sippy cups and all glued to a screens.
The 4 and 5 year old dont go to school as teachers said they have to be potty trained first.
I said to said family member the teacher is right, it's your job to parent ther job is to teach.
But im wrong apparently because her kids all have SEN.
I just see 3 normal kids that have not been taught the basics.

Now i do understand some children are unwell and can not do these things.

But im talking about kids that can but parents are playing on the sen to back out of parenting the basic things.
Am I wrong about it?

It really isn't the same

Would anyone judge your circumstances? Hope your boy is doing grand now.

Saying that it is difficult to tell at such a young age doesn't mean I believe it is only down to undiagnosed SEND, it is simply pointing out how difficult it can be to tell the difference because it isn't always going to be obvious which means it isn't as simple as just saying only children with SEND can start school in nappies which some people on this thread think could be a solution.

I have clearly said that it isn't down to just one thing and that it is a mixture of several things.

There was a poster who I presumed was a doctor or nurse judging a parent for giving her child an iPad earlier. I looked and they are indeed a nurse. No kids themselves. Utterly fucking clueless of the desperation and other feelings you have when your child is hospitalised.

Ah, apologies I missed that bit.
Yeah, they can bugger off if the case. Poorly child can have anything to make life better for them. Cripes, I remember smuggling in sweets, crisps and McDonalds to my brother stuck in hosp having chemo when he was 21. He could have anything he wanted as far as I was concerned, esp if he managed to keep it down.

This was also part of our experience. DC went to nursery 4 full days and although I must say they were supportive with potty training, they didn’t help with the movicol treatment, often ending it too early without our knowledge and the response we had when trying to speak through the issue was ‘dont worry this is so common, one day it’ll just click’ - it didn’t! Well it did, but not before school.

It’s quite sad really

So many children nowadays not school ready, that during their very early years neither parent or any other loving adult around them, read them books, spent time eating with them, show them how to toilet, put a coat on. No one. Leaving intimate training to school staff, not wanting to see their little ones put a coat on for the first time or even use a spoon.

Many kids are iPad ready. But not book ready.

And neither parent cares.

It just feels like there is less and less just instinctive basic parental love. Which will mean a huge number of future adults with issues as yet undefined.

Parents are very quick to read up their rights yet not so quick to read to their children.

Not all school readiness is down to utter neglect but some is.

Some parents of young children just clearly can’t be bothered. Shove an iPad in their face to keep them quiet - it’s criminal it really is.

If more demands were made of the lazy fuck parents then the available support could be more targeted towards the children who medically need it.

All this “you don’t know what they are going through” acceptance without questioning contributes to services being spread thin. It’s in everyone’s interest, especially parents of SEN children, to be able to distinguish between lazy, neglectful parenting and actual real needs.

I just don’t get it.

They can fuck off!

Things are much better now thank you. We were so lucky, the surgery went even better than hoped for and he did not need the further surgeries that had been predicted. There were poor wee souls in that picu who had been having surgeries for years. One with the same condition as my wee boy. Every day I feel gratitude for how very lucky I am to have him here and safe and well :)

The iPads must have an awful effect on their vision

When I was 5, I was left to roam around with my cousins all day. My parents didn’t know where the f I was, as long as I came back before it got dark. I might be working FT now and see my kid in the evenings and weekends, but I don’t recall my mum ever drawing with me or making slime. Putting me in front of the telly or letting me outside was the equivalent of iPad. You can talk about which one’s better for your development, but you can’t say one of lazier parenting than the other.

You would like to think not, but it sounded like that pp was and it upset me tbh. He is 100% grand thankfully. We are very lucky!

My son has spent some time in PICU too. He had 4 surgeries during his 7 weeks there (plus 1 last surgery later on). He's doing well now too, has some lasting effects but much better than anyone ever expected.

I feel incredibly lucky too.

Are you not allowed to ignore your dc then.

it’s good for them to entertain themselves but I think this is better than an iPad

I don’t believe in acceptance without questioning at all. BUT randoms with no knowledge questioning online aren’t helping because all it achieves is making good parents who are engaged but toilet training isn’t going well or their kid won’t sit with a book etc, feel judged. The truly shit, neglectful parents are not reading this thread, they aren’t on mumsnet reading about parenting, looking for tips, concerned about development etc.

We need more experts, more doctors, more health visitors, nurses, psychologists, etc as they are the ones who can really help. Also less pressure on both parents to work full time just for a basic standard of living. The family unit needs encouraging, a parent being able to afford to stay home til their child is at school, so affordable housing etc. There are so many reasons. No government wants to pay for those things though.

As a child who was outside all day long too, I can relate. But when you're outside playing, you're engaging with others, learning communication skills and people skills, using imagination, getting fresh air, moving the body, gaining confidence and social and real problem solving too. Am sorry to say, none of this happens with an ipad. They really are not the same.

My parents wouldn't 'play' all day long with us kids either, but I do remember bedtime stories when I was young, first read by parents and then by my big brothers. My mum taught us how to cook, how to read, how to swim. We did have toys, colouring in stuff, things to do too. Living overseas we rarely watched TV because it wasn't in English and cartoons were never shown anyway. We also sat down at dinner every day and talked with all of us before mum went off to work her night shift and dad took over the care. He'd also show us how to mend things, how things worked, I can remember him teaching me how to decorate, trusting me with gloss paint and a carpet, lol! And sure, when we were back in the UK, we'd all watch a bit of TV together for an hour before bed but us kids were all getting older by then anyway and wanting to do our own thing. We ate together though as a family every day.

I like to think things were more balanced and while my parents style wasn't all green goo and board games, they did indeed parent and we learned a lot of valuable life skills and tbh, it was fun anyway.

Were you pooing yourself?
could you use a spoon?
could you turn a page in a book when you went to school?
if you couldn’t zip up your coat did your mum run to the doctor asking for an adhd test?

yes you could say you risking around was neglect if you were alone - but you were with cousins - safety in numbers, learning social skills, exercising, and watching tv especially in yesteryear, the adult stuff was boring and the children’s stuff was heavily regulated it wasn’t a personal screen no interaction like an iPad - eyesight problems are increasing because children don’t go outside and look at things far away, close up, they are fixed on an illuminated 20vm distance

and things that used to happen are interesting but not relevant today

today there are seemingly increasing numbers of children who can’t turn a page FFS - some parents are crap perhaps your mum was perhaps not but today there clearly are and they should be judged for that - they are failing - but instead of being responsible they run for a diagnosis because it couldn’t possibly be their fault

to avoid this possibility for not upsetting anyone’s feelings is totally wet and causes further harm to their children - people’s skin is like tissue paper nowadays

I hate seeing kids on screens and agree with ops premise.

However, I'm strict on screens and it seems to have made no difference.

My kids can watch TV sometimes but we don't own tablets or game consoles (I don't have one myself either), and I don't let them use my phone. They are really good at playing with their toys, we read and play outdoors etc. However despite me and their dad both being acaedmic, my ds is below expected level, and my dd is way behind in her learning, can't pay attention and isn't well behaved at school. She's got some of the problems listed in the thread, like lack of independence and bed wetting. Some of my friends let their kids watch screens a lot, and their kids are really smart and doing great. So I don't know.

Yes but in terms of parenting, it’s still ‘lazy’, which is what is being questioned about why kids aren’t toilet trained. Maybe back then they put effort in to toilet training so their kids were ready to kick out the door from morning til night, without it being noticed as the neglect it clearly was back then. My brother was playing ‘out the front’ unsupervised at aged 3. Yet my mum will judge someone for letting their 3 year old have an iPad. You have to laugh,

Yep, I was listening to a podcast recently and apparently there are now a massive percentage of people in there late teens/early twenties really struggling because they don’t know how to communicate.
Not only are they having issues dealing with work but also they have no friends, don’t know how to ask someone to go on a date ect. It was an interesting conversation but worrying.

The regular anti ND posters are arriving now I see. Same old.

And perhaps adults thinking though before they get pregnant- can we do this? What if we have a disabled child? Can we afford to house and feed them?

Lack of social housing and medical experts has been known for years children starting reception are 4/5. You know the risks when you get pregnant. You know your costs, your work situation, your relationship situation. You know if you are ND you have a higher chance of a child with ND.

Again it’s about taking responsibility for your choices and the results of those choices. When it comes down to it your child the buck stops with you, except in very exceptional circumstances if they can’t use a fork that is the parent’s fault entirely.

What was lazy?
What was neglect??
Honestly, if my parents were still alive, I'd say this to them, lol.

I think it was different though, hardly any cars and lots of other dc around and mums at home. We used to go into each others houses. Early 70s

i was never turfed outside to play alone though

My point is around lazy parenting = both are “lazy”. There is no more effort put in to letting your kid do whatever they want without bothering you, to giving them an iPad for prolonged periods of time.

I did acknowledge that the first option was developmentally better in many ways, but I was making a point of the label on parents.

Re: diagnosis. Back then it just wasn’t recognised on the scale that it is today. Of all my school friends who have dropped out / struggling today I wonder how it would have panned out if they had a diagnosis then.

I don’t disagree with a lot of your sentiment, but I don’t think it’s all down to parents tbh, the world is different and sadly the generational gaps all think their methods are best when in reality the truth is somewhere in the middle.

Some parents can find hours to scroll on their phones but not 20 minutes to read to their small child.

Yes they should be judged on that. If not that what?