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Labour isn't working - Thread 20

1000 replies

TheNuthatch · 17/11/2025 11:40

A chat thread for those who don't like this Labour government. 💙* *

We are bracing for the budget. 😬

The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.

Previous thread:
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5443813-labour-isnt-working-thread-19?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share

Labour isn't working - Thread 19 | Mumsnet

A chat thread for those who *don't *like this Labour government. 💙 We are bracing for the budget 😬 ^The problem with socialism is that you eventua...

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5443813-labour-isnt-working-thread-19

OP posts:
Thread gallery
40
NoWordForFluffy · 19/11/2025 14:59

I really do think that Kemi is starting to cut through now. 🤞🤞

My algorithms are skewed, but she's all over my socials!

Julen7 · 19/11/2025 15:00

DancingFerret · 19/11/2025 14:59

But, but...one of them during PMQs was braying about Labour's huge majority (completely ignoring their downward trajectory in the polls and obvious "buyer's remorse" from those who voted them in.🙄

They may have a huge majority but they are so divided as a Party

Upstartled · 19/11/2025 15:01

TheNuthatch · 19/11/2025 14:59

Thanks.
Strange that the Greens are so low on that poll. They're at 17 on YouGov.

Yeah, it's weird, isn't it? And it's similar week in and out too so not a quirk.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

TheNuthatch · 19/11/2025 15:05

DancingFerret · 19/11/2025 14:59

But, but...one of them during PMQs was braying about Labour's huge majority (completely ignoring their downward trajectory in the polls and obvious "buyer's remorse" from those who voted them in.🙄

Bless. They need to keep telling themselves that. Starmer just leaves the country so he can pretend that he's not despised.
They'll all be unemployed (and unemployable) in 3 years.

OP posts:
Noodledog · 19/11/2025 15:14

DancingFerret · 19/11/2025 14:59

But, but...one of them during PMQs was braying about Labour's huge majority (completely ignoring their downward trajectory in the polls and obvious "buyer's remorse" from those who voted them in.🙄

Yes, and ignoring that Labour's huge majority was based on less than 34% of the vote.

Actually, I've just googled and it was 33.7% of the vote. Helpfully described as "the lowest of any majority party on record." And also that it made it the least proportional general election in British history.

SouthernAccents · 19/11/2025 15:17

FT - can’t stand the author but some
good points here.

Sorry format

Critics were lukewarm about the second Oasis album, released 30 autumns ago. When it sold tens of millions, and some of the tracks became auxiliary national anthems in Britain, the press did the natural thing. It overcorrected. It gave five-star reviews to the band’s grandiose mess of a third album. In striving to redeem a mistake, people made the equal and opposite one. Since the summer of 2024, I have wondered how Sir Keir Starmer’s Labour party was elected with so little scrutiny. One theory is overcorrection. Starmer was trashed as a no-hoper during his first 18 months or so as leader. When the polls turned his way, those doubters were flummoxed, like the indie dweebs who couldn’t tell that Don’t Look Back in Anger would enchant a nation. The result was the softest treatment of an incoming government I can remember. There are two things that readers should do now. First, ignore anyone who talks about Labour being a “disappointment”. This government is exactly as bad as it was always going to be. Second, expect things to deteriorate from here. The people who lead the government are unfit and their internal critics are worse. As the latter are gaining strength, it follows that Britain will be in ever less capable hands until 2029. Take the chancellor Rachel Reeves: one of life’s triers, but never cut out for this particular office at this particular time. At next week’s Budget, she will announce a second round of tax rises, which she said would never come. She has spent 2025 fanning and then dousing speculation about certain levies, such as higher income tax, with predictable effects on confidence. (A Tory who behaved like this would be called a vandal.) Most workplaces, including newspapers, contain staff who are out of their depth but survive because the boss is too embarrassed to fire them. They just tend not to be the second-highest person in the organisation. What can be said in her defence? That she is braver than her leader. There were warnings about Starmer’s character in opposition. He let others stand up to Jeremy Corbyn, whom he served in shadow cabinet. He let others fight woke dogma, until the tide turned against it. Even now, he makes liberal use of human shields. Notice that every crisis for Starmer quickly becomes a conversation about his underlings. His then chief of staff Sue Gray used to be the problem. Now it is her successor Morgan McSweeney. What rotten luck the prime minister has with recruitment. The British are having to relearn a lesson that Theresa May should have fixed in their minds forever. Don’t assume that uncharismatic people have hidden depths. Being boring does not make someone a “technocrat”. One can be dull and inept. If Starmer is both, how can things get worse? Look at his challengers. This is how the coming years are likely to play out. Whenever Starmer is in trouble, Andy Burnham will say something nebulously crowd-pleasing and flash those sad eyes at Labour members. (A part of me wants the Greater Manchester mayor to become prime minister, just to see him run a national budget.) Angela Rayner will offer a similar northern-left alternative. Both have prestige in a middle-class and southern party that is touchy about its estrangement from the industrial regions. To survive this dissent, Starmer will tilt left. Or the left will topple him. Even if a relative right-ist such as Wes Streeting or Shabana Mahmood becomes leader, the internal logic of this government is now towards more fiscal concessions and less public sector reform, barring a 1976-style shock in which markets force Labour’s hand. The central event of the government so far was Starmer’s retreat from welfare reform last summer. It established the precedent that backbenchers and grassroots can morally blackmail him. Look at their influence. As unemployment rises, a sensible prime minister would ditch his plans for more red tape on hiring. But he can’t, in case the unions ditch him. In a stagnant economy, the government should pursue growth at all costs. The priority of its MPs is to increase child benefit claims. All of this and more was foreseeable. Starmer exorcised the hard left but the soft left are more numerous and not much less deluded. If you trusted these people to unleash Britain’s economic potential, I don’t know what to say to you. For 14 years, Labour’s analysis of the country’s problems was to repeat a proper noun (“Tories”) and an abstract noun (“austerity”). The two words were said with a tone of incantation, like rote-learned scripture. It was easier than thinking. It was easier than questioning a state that hasn’t balanced a budget since around the millennium. So, while anger is a sensible reaction to the government, surprise isn’t. There is not enough contempt in the kingdom for what the Conservatives did on Brexit, planning, unfunded tax cuts and what we might call the moral tone of public life. But none of this ever added up to a case for Labour, let alone a landslide. Its ruling duo are inadequate and remain preferable to their likeliest usurpers. Britain has another three years or more to reflect on this Hobson’s choice. To capture the bleakness of the situation, and its potential to deteriorate, I will leave you with my considered verdict on the chancellor. Reeves is honour-bound to quit, and I hope she doesn’t. [email protected]

nearlylovemyusername · 19/11/2025 15:25

@SouthernAccents

You beat me by 5min! I was going to post this exact article! FT.com, no less

"ignore anyone who talks about Labour being a “disappointment”. This government is exactly as bad as it was always going to be."

"The people who lead the government are unfit and their internal critics are worse. As the latter are gaining strength, it follows that Britain will be in ever less capable hands until 2029."

Both points we were trying to make since June 2024

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat · 19/11/2025 15:35

Upstartled · 19/11/2025 14:29

Clive Lewis is such a shit stirrer. It would be funny if it all weren't so bloody desperate at the moment.

Is his seat really that safe?

TheNuthatch · 19/11/2025 15:52

@SouthernAccents Great piece. I was just about to c+p the exact same section as @nearlylovemyusername above.

Starmer and co are exactly how I thought they would be. It was all there is opposition, including the penchant for freebies.

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SouthernAccents · 19/11/2025 15:56

With Labour we're getting the really dumb type of socialism: welfare socialism in which state resources are directed not into productive state investment, instead allocating vast sums of money to economically inactive working age adults, people who pretend to have ADHD etc

Think about what the priorities of the Labour rebels are about this budget, what exactly are they begging Reeves for? New infrastructure spending, more R&D spending, new energy infrastructure...? Nope, the Labour rebels have secured vital concessions such as: Abolishing the child benefit cap!

This is in contrast the model of industrial socialism which you see in China; massive spending on tangible, productive investments such as their huge high speed rail network, green energy dominance and well resourced Chinese scientific research. But all that the senior figures in Labour seem to want to talk about is welfare, they seem totally uninterested in having any sort of industrial strategy or any coherent vision for the economy.

Rexinasaurus · 19/11/2025 16:02

strawberrybubblegum · 19/11/2025 10:39

I thought this was interesting from the Telegraph

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/gift/cd9c77a24867d7ad

It seems that the government has instructed civil servants to monitor social media for “high-risk narratives” and to produce counter-narratives to protect both departmental reputation and policy goals.

Now there's a surprise.

Yep. I’m shocked. 😑

The most annoying thing (apart from the fact they’re obviously annoying), is that we’re paying for these civil servants to monitor the ‘social media’. I’ve mentioned it a couple of times before. They guffaw and bray ho ho as if etc. They have their useful idiots to support to obviously.. Ah well!!

SouthernAccents · 19/11/2025 16:20

Sir Keir Starmer has told his son he wants a closer relationship with him than he did with his own father.

In a video for International Men’s Day, the Prime Minister told his 17-year-old son that he was proud of the “confident, kind, wonderful young man” he had become.

Sir Keir, 63, spoke about the distant relationship he had with his own father, admitting that they “never really spoke” and “never really got to know each other”.

Many of us agree, Starmer - you really ought to spend more time with your son. Don’t worry, the country will muddle on without you. Thanks for your service etc etc.

SouthernAccents · 19/11/2025 16:20

.

TheNuthatch · 19/11/2025 16:24

That would involve Starmer being in the UK for more than one day a week though. He only comes back for PMQs.

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SouthernAccents · 19/11/2025 16:27

TheNuthatch · 19/11/2025 16:24

That would involve Starmer being in the UK for more than one day a week though. He only comes back for PMQs.

Good point.

And why did he bang on about his father being a tool maker if he hardly saw or spoke to him?
More bullshit probably.

Rexinasaurus · 19/11/2025 16:31

I’m glad Starmer has finally piped down about his trans views (he was very much in the people can change sex camp 👀). The Supreme Court did well. It would’ve been difficult for Starmer otherwise. Mind you it’s the least of his problems now. That was another issue our friends bullied people over.

TheNuthatch · 19/11/2025 16:39

SouthernAccents · 19/11/2025 16:27

Good point.

And why did he bang on about his father being a tool maker if he hardly saw or spoke to him?
More bullshit probably.

I think he's been watching the John Lewis xmas advert 😂

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EasternStandard · 19/11/2025 17:01

Upstartled · 19/11/2025 14:56

More in Common:

Good on Kemi. Keep going.

Interesting about the 80 MPs in the pp Clive post. They’re circling

EasternStandard · 19/11/2025 17:05

SouthernAccents · 19/11/2025 16:27

Good point.

And why did he bang on about his father being a tool maker if he hardly saw or spoke to him?
More bullshit probably.

All that stuff was absolute nonsense and spin. I can’t believe it was a factor in the GE.

SouthernAccents · 19/11/2025 17:28

EasternStandard · 19/11/2025 17:05

All that stuff was absolute nonsense and spin. I can’t believe it was a factor in the GE.

Agreed.

All in an attempt to burnish his working class credentials.

The bloke is a fraud.

SouthernAccents · 19/11/2025 17:28

TheNuthatch · 19/11/2025 16:39

I think he's been watching the John Lewis xmas advert 😂

😂

SouthernAccents · 19/11/2025 17:37

Only 9% of people believe Rachel Reeves is making economy better, YouGov poll suggests

YouGov has released some new polling on what people think about the economy. There is a lot of bad polling for Labour around at the moment, but these figures should be particularly worrying, given how important perceived economic competence is in electoral politics.

Labour’s argument – repeated by Keir Starmer again today, and at every PMQs since the election – is that the government inherited an economy that was in a mess, but that it is clearing it up.

YouGov says most people do think the government’s economic inheritance was poor. But, unfortunately for Labour, only 9% of people think Rachel Reeves, the chancellor, is making the situation better.

Julen7 · 19/11/2025 17:43

SouthernAccents · 19/11/2025 16:27

Good point.

And why did he bang on about his father being a tool maker if he hardly saw or spoke to him?
More bullshit probably.

He was on about it again yesterday “my father worked with his hands and I often felt looked down upon”….I didn’t even read to the end to see what spurious point he was going on to make.

twistyizzy · 19/11/2025 17:47

It is pathetic identity politics.
Poverty porn.

Despicable.

No-one who went to Reigate Grammar, was a member of an orchestral conservatoire then went to Oxford and lived in leafy Surrey is, or has ever been, poor.

Rexinasaurus · 19/11/2025 17:51

twistyizzy · 19/11/2025 17:47

It is pathetic identity politics.
Poverty porn.

Despicable.

No-one who went to Reigate Grammar, was a member of an orchestral conservatoire then went to Oxford and lived in leafy Surrey is, or has ever been, poor.

Does going to Leeds for his first degree (cos he didn’t get into Oxford first time he tried, had to do post grad at Oxford) count as povvo? Cheap northern town? Maybe he had water on the inside of his uni accommodation windows? He suffered.

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