We are being labelled disrespectful and I disagree over funeral

[Bluehummingbird]

We don’t agree with so don’t attend funerals. It’s part of a wider belief system we have devised part of it being to see those we care about as much as possible and do as much as we can for anyone we love who is ill or needs support.

Recently FIL passed after a long illness. We helped with care, spent a lot of time with him and supported MIL which we continue to do. We were with him in hospital and were able to say goodbye.

The issue is that we didn’t go to the funeral. We’ve had nasty comments from family members (who never bothered to see him or help MIL as they ‘lived too far away’ and who managed to travel though to the funeral and stuff their faces afterwards as they told us they even managed to take food for the journey home then the next sentence calling us out for behaviour).

SIL said it wasn’t fair she had to step up to help with funeral arrangements. I said to her ‘we arranged the care, we did all the hospital appts, I cleaned the house for MIL and we looked after the dog when they needed a break so it was your turn to do something’

Everyone is saying dh can’t have been able to say goodbye properly but he did - in the hospital? It’s like we don’t need to physically go to church each week to feel close to god or worship we don’t feel the need to go to a set place on a set day to say goodbye to someone who isn’t there any more and we find it performative.

I know most people do funerals but I’m struggling with having to repeatedly explain our position on this and we try to be good people and want to be judged on our actions for the last few years not for the 1 hour service and then the few hours after wake that we missed ?

I've lost it to quote it now but the post a few minutes or so ago from a mother with an autistic daughter is really enlightening so thank you for sharing that.

family members (who never bothered to see him or help MIL as they ‘lived too far away’ and who managed to travel though to the funeral and stuff their faces afterwards as they told us they even managed to take food for the journey home then the next sentence calling us out for behaviour).

I have been, and in some ways still am, a carer to family members, I understand the strain and toll it takes on a person. I've been the person frustrated with the sibling who doesn't seem to bother.

I've also been the family member furthest away who cannot do the practical support and aware of the resentment building from the relative who is close enough to do it.

Much of the time, people do what they can. Often if they're not stepping up it's because they don't realise it's needed or because they can't find a way to do so. It doesn't mean they don't care.

I'm also ND, although I don't (clearly) share your feelings about funerals. They can be hard, yes, and confronting. But at the same time they're also cathartic and comforting.

People are often at a loss of how to approach each other when there's been a bereavement, how to offer help & support. Funerals give people a place to do so and contact with the bereaved so that they can offer support both emotional and practical.

For many people, funerals are a way to channel and manage their intense emotions when bereaved.

One reason why people eat a lot at funerals is because they need to. Grief is exhausting, they need the fuel and the comfort which food can bring. Mourners also may not have eaten beforehand because of emotions they feel. It isn't greed, it's coping.

I don't say this to attempt to change your beliefs, but to help you have compassion for those who didn't clean the house or do the appointments. Their grief and need is as valid as yours.

The undercurrents of resentment I pick up in your original post are normal, but recognising that other family members are in pain too will help you manage this situation and avoid family fall outs.

It's also worth considering that you SIL may be struggling with the fact that you got to spend so much time with her father. The rights and wrongs of that are largely irrelevant and for a different thread, but suffice to say compassion is what is needed now.

When compassion is given, its easier to return.

My DD is ND and has very "black and white" thinking, so I can see why you have your thoughts and won't vary from them, but also, I hope you can see that your reasons are very far from "normal" and that is why you have had so many shocked reactions on this thread.

I agree that it is better to see people when they are alive, and not just attend the funeral, but the funeral is closure, the funeral is respect, the funeral is the last thing that you can do for that person.

It would be seen as extrememely odd for a person not to attend their parent's funeral, and seen as a sign of disrespect.

If you intend to stand by this and not attend any funerals of anyone, your parents, friends, or any family member, ever, then I think that you do need to clearly explain this to family , but I don't think many will understand you. Your famly also need to learn to say "They have chosen not to, you will need to ask them why" and not get engaged in discussing your issues with others.

I sometimes don't go to funerals of people I know, they might be in a tiny church, standing room outside only etc, and I just can't do that, but there is no way I would not go to the funeral of a family member.

Yes except he did drive and we decided a year ago to not have a car anymore but the rest of it yes

They're both ND. So it's not really that odd. My ND son can't manage in crowded places, can't cope with people trying to talk to him socially. He too would opt out - we will be choosing direct cremation out of respect for him and his feelings, knowing what he can and can't manage.

I think I’m one of the few on here who isn’t judging you. My DP has a no funerals policy and I understand it. For him it’s rooted in the trauma of attending his own siblings funeral and PTSD surrounding his siblings death, so I feel like perhaps people will give him a pass, but even so he knows people will judge but is willing to shrug that off. You need a thicker skin if you’re going to defy social conventions (which is often a bold and brave thing to do).

I have, however, told my DP that should something happen to me whilst our kids are young he is going to the funeral to support them because there is nobody else who could do that for them in the right way. He has agreed to do that for them despite his beliefs. I would hope that should your MIL or FİL (prior to his passing) asked you to attend to support her, that you would have seriously considered doing so.

Ah, but you were honest about it - you couldn't cope with the situation.

You weren't inventing a 'belief system' that made you superior for not doing so.

And to your PP - I do kind of agree about people living authentically, but if we all lived authentically (suited ourselves) all the time, there wouldn't be a society. Sometimes we all just need to suck it up for the greater good.

This is the most exaggerated brand of wimpishness I've ever seen. It's done now, so there's no need to formulate responses for people outside of - 'we find funerals traumatic and performative, so we won't attend any'.

I think you are making this belief system all abouy you. It is quite self centered, fanatical and closed minded to not accept others beliefs.
I am an athiest, I have attended Hindu weddings, Catholic weddings, baptisms, funerals of various religions and denominations, culturally centred birthdays of people from various countries, celebrated Diwali with Indian colleagues, supported and attended events with muslim colleagues and friends during Eid, respected family members who are part of Jehovas Witness by not bringing unicorn themed gifts for their child into their house.
I know some people follow a religion that doesnt allow them to do certain things, but many people of all religions also do join in with the customs of their friends and colleagues and are more relaxed. For example my Hindu friends join in with Christmas in the UK.
You sound fanatical about your beliefs and that is the only way I can explain it. It's very hardline to refuse to acknowledge your family friends and colleagues beleifs and respect them by attending a ceremony that is very important to them.

@Bluehummingbird , for most people funerals are a last expression of love and respect for the person who has died. Your ‘beliefs’ are at odds with societies across the world from time immemorial. There is something in the human condition which appears to demand a ceremony at this time and by not attending you are displaying a an astonishing lack of respect for your FIL’s widow and wider family.
Your actions whilst your FIL was alive were admirable but separate to this issue which you have in my opinion approached with monumental selfishness.

You would hope that your children would have plenty of support.

The reality for me when my husband died was that those who should have attended phoned me and said 'Do you have someone with you?' when they were the people who should have been there.

That's a problem, I think, the assumption that there will always be someone else who can step in.

They absolutely convinced themselves that they had been supportive beforehand, when the reality was somewhat different.

At least in the OP's case, her husband stayed with his mother after the funeral and that counts for a great deal.

I'm finding it really interesting that you are ignoring my repeated question asking if you would attend your children's weddings if they chose to have them in a church.

yes, I find it hard to read the posts, distracted by the same point. 'We think, We don't, We did ... we, we, we' it really seems like someone is in control of the 'we' here.

'list of things I dont want to do' = "beliefs".

Wtf ? Im gonna make my own list.

I think it sounds like you’re trying to make a point about how much you did and no one else was as marvellous as you. Oh, we did all the important, hard work. You didn’t care as much as us and we won’t be lowering ourselves to public grieving and, gasp, eating a sandwich.

I attended a simple, non religious cremation this week. The deceased was married to my mother’s cousin, so not a close relative, but we love our cousin and cared for his wife and knew he would be shattered by her loss. We wouldn’t have been any help during her short illness, but 100 odd people attended and he spent much of the day comforted and commenting on how wonderful it felt to see the care and love people had for him in his grief and for remembering her life together. Our family gathered, all in the same place, reminisced and felt renewed, which is the human point of death ceremonies. A method of some closure, a reminder of community ties and a way to show support to immediate family. You don’t believe in any of that, fine, but I don’t really understand your consternation at it being noted. Your poor mil, grieving and also having all the extra pity of people assuming your DH is callous and uncaring.

OP has said that she would attend church weddings because they are about the living.

You are going against accepted practice - society tends to work on shared practices, values etc and choosing to stick to something which is not the norm like you did is a bold move, because it marks you out as not conforming.

I'm sure that lots of people don't want to go to funerals but they put the wider issues above their own personal needs.

My father died recently and we were comforted by the attendance of people who attended the funeral. None of my cousins came and I found that upsetting. It would also have been an opportunity for us to reconnect together.

Imo sometimes you need to go with the traditions to keep society going and not just do what you like.

This, plus the ‘belief’ that saying ‘it’s my belief system’ apparently seems to be a get out clause for not wanting to do something!
pay a bill? Noooo it’s my belief that I shouldn’t have to pay for anything….

Sorry I wasn’t ignoring them I am struggling to keep up. I’ve already said we have been to weddings and yes I would go to my children’s weddings if they were in a church

But you couldn’t do it. It wasn’t that you’d decided funeral attendance was against your personal belief system. Some people are terribly squeamish about dead bodies because they’re never encountered any. I get that. One of my friends fainted at a Hindu funeral for another friend’s dad in our student days, because we were circling his body laid out at home before the cremation — incredibly, as she’d lost both parents young, she’d never seen either of their bodies. Whereas it wasn’t a big deal to me, as I’m used to it.

You showed up and gave it a go, before deciding it was too upsetting. And that’s fine. And your presence at all will have been appreciated by your boyfriend and his family, especially when they knew you were way out of your comfort zone.

I think that’s a very different thing to what the OP describes.

You may be right. I did have lots of support at my own husband's funeral and I hope my children would have at least one friend or family member to stand next to them, that's if anyone is still having funerals by then.

Millions do not live in the same country as their parents, and many cultures have a very set time period for burial, so two days or so, for Muslim, Jewish and other faiths, so I think there will be lots of people who are not able to attend their parents funerals, lots of parents who will not want funerals and some, like the OP, who cannot or won't attend due to beliefs or personal distress or whatever. Or just not bothering.

I don't see the point in further distressing the OP's husband at this time, he's grieving too and people texting them and being judgy by text is not on. They are welcome to say how strange/odd/they wouldn't behave like that in the privacy of their own homes, but not to impose that on him in his own grief.

I think people love to judge and people love to be angry when someone has died, sadly death seems to bring out the worst in everyone in our culture and that's one reason I think most people are not fond of funerals or see them as important so much any more- it's a social norm and not something profound or sacred and I think the practice will drift away more and more in the next couple of decades or so.

My belief system is that ironing is a pointless activity and people should and can wear unironed clothes.
However, I respect the fact that society requires ironed clothes, especially at school. So I regretfully partake in this activity. Even though it goes against my very strong world view that ironing is a patriarchal construct to keep women busy and confined to household chores.

People are weird about funerals, as you can probably tell OP.

I'm with you. People who can't be arsed with the living tend to rock up when there's some grub in it for them. We're all direct cremation here.

It's an outdated ritual and needs to be left in the past imo.

See, I don't iron and if someone texted me to tell me I should, I'd be pissed off. I don't care if they judge me at the school gates.

Society doesn't work best when everyone has the same social norms, or if it does, that's not our society now, where there are multiple faiths and families spread out across the globe, and most in the UK are atheist or at least not practicing Christians.

It works best in a highly diverse culture when people are pretty accepting of different ways of doing things, including attendance at very emotionally difficult events.

I also find some of the remarks on ND on this thread offensive, as if being rather thoughtful and thinking through how they live is a Very Bad Thing. I saw a report this week which showed that nearly 1/3 of people report having suffered abuse in their childhoods. Save your judgement for that.

So you are willing to compromise on your belief system that means you don't go to places of worship but not when it means going to a funeral. You do allow yourself to pick and choose which parts of this "belief system" you've decided on when it suits you.

But would you attend your own child’s funeral? That’s the real question here and it’s been asked repeatedly.

If by some unfair tragedy you lost your own child would you refuse to mark the occasion in any significant way? Would you have no getting together of family, no burial or cremation, and no moment to share grief with your loved ones?

Similarly if your child died over a certain age and their own spouse held a funeral or wake/cerimony/family gathering to celebrate your child would you also sit that out entirely? Just not go?