Is it possible to have a sensible discussion about disability benefits?

[Pjnow]

According to Google 10% of working age people are in receipt of PIP and 6% of 0-15yos receive DLA.

I'm a proper lefty who believes absolutely in the welfare state, a safety net and that we should care properly for those with disabilities. A society should be judged on how it cares for its most vulnerable.

However 10% in receipt of disability benefits can't be sustainable. I know many people receiving PIP also work, it's not about that.

I'm just wondering what (if anything) can be done to make sure those who need support get it, without paying it to 10% of the population. I know not all disabilities are visble etc, but 10%?!

If you didn't think you needed it, why'd you apply for it...?

If you did not need it then why did you apply?

The Age of Diagnosis. I've recently listened to it on Audible. Very interesting.

I actually see this alot over on the dwp sub on reddit, 99% of the posts are about anxiety. I had a cousin that was like that, she was morbidly obese so was "too anxious" to leave the house incase anyone looked at her, she died at 32 from a heart attack.

I spent thousands on going back to uni in my late 20s and juggling all the needed qualifying exams around my 4dc to be completely ignored for months on end by the NHS when I became suddenly ill 5 years ago, I had sudden paralysis down one side. That "ach yer a woman, must be anxiety", "oh you have kids, it's hard" has cost me my humility, my fierce independence, my career, my social life, and I've aged like fuck.

I actually never even finished filling in my ADP form, only the first part, I found it too embarrassing and degrading. My GP must have gone to bat for me.

Absolutely.

My pain & concerns were ignored by my GP for so long and by the time action was taken, the damage was done and it was permanent. I no longer trust the NHS. Yes, 9 times out of 10 it might go away, but for the 1 in 10 whose life might be ruined, it’s not acceptable.

My employer, it was obvious, was sick of my recurring and sometimes long absences, my failure to get anywhere near productivity targets. And, as for quality scores, forget it. Yes, I got the obvious adjustments but these things couldn’t solve my issues. I can’t have been far from the sack when I resigned. I was humiliated in front of the whole office daily because of my ‘failings’ and it left me with horrible anxiety on top of my physical and cognitive problems. Employers don’t want badly disabled people. All this government push into getting employers to take us on will fail, at very least for the people who will be cast aside as useless.

@MrsLizzieDarcy agree with this. I’ve no idea why so many people are suffering from mental health problems. I’ve been teaching 25 years & we used to have one or two who had to do exams in a different room. Now it’s probably 25% of students with special access arrangements in place. Lots of students with anxiety, ADHD, autism diagnosis. So the generation who are late 30s seemed to just crack on with life & it’s children of gen X who are anxious. I’m not sure what went wrong.

I also think the mindset should be that we support our family & I can’t see how extra money helps someone who is anxious or has ADHD.

Okay fine. This is an example of why a sensible conversation is hard. My comment wasn’t directed at you and it wasn’t directed at disabled people in general. There is no need to take it personally. In my opinion, the people who are massively entitled about benefits and those who are massively entitled about ‘their’ taxes paying for benefits (sometimes they are actually the same people) are two sides of the same coin. I think it’s a damaging mindset that doesn’t help anyone. In your case you’re responsible for your son, it must be very tough. You have every right to expect help from the government. But nobody should be labouring under the delusion that the government HAS to do anything or that they are automatically entitled to anything. For the vast majority of history and even today for vast swathes of humanity, this kind of support was nonexistent. It’s important to remember that.

Look OP - the responses are going to be either those who firmly, despite any and all evidence to the contrary, believe people get PIP for anxiety and/or depression and they could and should work their way out of it, or people who are justified in being angry because everyone targets those lower on the rung when things appear to be getting bad (oh income tax rises .. possibly.. let’s target the vulnerable!).
One pp above clearly doesn’t understand sarcasm by pretending (I hope) in being offended that they have to pay their tax bill while others are joking about burning money from
the mega disability bucks (as if!).
That’s literally the level of understanding you get from people who think there’s too much money given to disabled people and/or too much disability.
I could tell you what my life is like with a severely disabled child - but you won’t and you don’t care because.. money. Empty purse etc.
Im not going to play your game of is my child disabled enough but let me tell you this - if a government wants to reduce welfare costs it could try not giving contracts to private companies that rinse them (for OT/PT, taxis, carers etc). The government could try having a GP system that works where people aren’t shocked away from obtaining treatment early on by not being able to get appointments, unsympathetic doctors, and by not having ludicrous salaries for management in NHS facilities, by controlling NHS Resolution spends (look it up), by employing or facilitating access to counselling and therapy instead of telling a person presenting with anxiety or depression that its medication or nothing.
As for ASD/ADHD - stop believing shit about “self-diagnosis” leading to PIP - read the fucking PIP forms and tell us how that works exactly. You can’t.

The system needs a massive shake up. I say this as someone who has worked in benefits for eight years. I'm genuinely shocked at some of the people who manage to get PIP for years on end.

The Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) provides benefits to nearly 24 million people across Great Britain, including 3.7m on Personal Independence Payment (PIP).

The latest DWP report discloses that £330m was lost to fraud and error in the PIP system last year, a substantial increase from £90m in 2023/24.

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/uk-news/new-dwp-powers-crack-down-32624284?int_source=amp_continue_reading&int_medium=amp&int_campaign=continue_reading_button

Medical certificate.

What medical certificate?
I have been seeing a psychiatrist for years and never had a medical certificate. What is on it?

Me neither and I’ve been an inpatient!

I think a starting point is capping disability benefits. I don't work in benefits but do work in the public sector (housing) where I was recently astonished to come across a family with 5 children who are in receipt of more than 10k a month in benefits, including Pip, carers allowance etc. All but 1 of the 7 family members claim disability benefits. The 2 adults claim carrs allowance fir each other. The family have 2 mobility cars. This seems like absolute madness to me.

We are now in a situation where we are frequently having people whose income is solely benefits, excluded from the housing register due to being over the income limit. Again, those relying on welfare benefits should not have an income so high that it excludes them from social housing!

This.

I worked for a prison charity and now a health charity, and in my experience the support from employers just isn't there to pick up where health/social/prison services leave off.

Employers just aren't, for want of a better word, imaginative enough to create solutions that keep good staff in work.

Me too. All I have is care plans. No certificate.

DS1 was diagnosed with ASD aged 3. We were proactive he had a Statement of SEN to start school. Secondary we got him into an ASD hub within a mainstream. He crashed in Yr9 and has never fully recovered. I started claiming DLA again then (had let it lapse age 7ish). Antidepressants have kept him alive. We've tried various therapies, but he's only now at the point of being able to engage, and even that is really difficult.

Walesonline is full of clickbait shit.
That article said there will be checks on PIP claimants bank accounts. Why is that? It is not a means tested benefit.

I know two women personally (not close friends) who get PIP (anxiety and adhd). Work for cash in hand but on the paper too disabled to work.

I just wish people would stop defending ALL PIP receivers. Ofcourse some need it. And noone is saying anything about them. I'm happy to live in a society where disabled people can get benefits. I just want the benefits to go to those who are truly in need. I don't see how anyone can think that it's sustainable that people who aren't disabled can claim benefits. Maybe childfree people should start claiming child benefits as well then. Where does it stop? And NHS needs funding- there is no magic money tree - it's our taxes paying for fraudelent benefits.

Why shouldnt bank accounts be scrutinised. If you have nothing to hide you are golden.

It’s not always treatable. Or becomes less treatable with age. Look up the kindling effect.

I worked for 35years with medicated anxiety and depression, but just got worse and worse. Ended up getting ill health retirement. I claim PIP although not for anxiety and depression. Most PIP applicants have 2 or more illnesses.

Also my dd is ADHD. She went into burnout and was severely depressed. Became mute and wouldn’t leave the house. The only thing that helped with that was time. Medication did nothing. So it’s not always treatable.

If you claim you can't work because of your condition and still have regular money coming in to your bank account maybe that means that you are actually working...

They can scrutinise mine. But it’s mainly cash withdrawals made by DP to pay carers etc.

PIP is not an out of work benefit and is not means tested. What is the purpose of checking the claimants bank accounts? What would show fraud?

How old is he?

My dd was in burnout age 14. Just starting to rally now age 19. He will recover x