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Labour isn't working - Thread 14

1000 replies

TheNuthatch · 21/10/2025 08:54

A chat thread for those who don't like this Labour government.

The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.

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https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5427475-labour-isnt-working-thread-13?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share

OP posts:
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42
Nolletimiere · 24/10/2025 13:51

Watch Starmer try to stymie this….

Giorgia Meloni has told EU leaders to prepare for a first political debate on reforming the European Convention on Human Rights in the “coming months”, in what would be a major step forward towards changing the international rules on migration.

The Italian prime minister spoke to heads of state and government before a European Council summit meeting in Brussels on Thursday morning.
The Telegraph understands she set out a plan to reform the ECHR so that it can meet modern-day challenges over illegal immigration, such as people smuggling gangs.

It should lead to a first political debate on reforms in the Council of Europe, which is based in Strasbourg and is not an EU body but a larger human rights watchdog.

The roadmap was drawn up in coordination with Alain Berset, the secretary general of the Council of Europe, she told leaders from Denmark, the Netherlands, Germany, the European Commission, Austria, Belgium, Bulgaria, Cyprus, Germany, Greece, Latvia, Malta, Poland and Sweden.

They agreed that senior officials would meet in Rome on Nov 5 to continue discussing international conventions and illegal migration.

Access Restricted

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/05/26/tories-signal-they-are-ready-to-pull-out-of-echr/

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat · 24/10/2025 14:02

AbsentosaurusRex · 24/10/2025 09:54

It’s rather embarrassing for Labour that they’ve lost a 100yr old stronghold so heavily, and the labour luvvies aren’t saying much about it. But they Are proclaiming how amazing it is that Wales didn’t vote Reform. 😂🙈 They’re happy that a party who campaign on the basis of Welsh independence wins. We’ve all seen how well that works out in Scotland.. But yey!!

Again strong cognitive dissonance in action. Historians will have a great time writing about this period, in future.

Meanwhile I think Labour voters need to accept that they’ll have to vote Conservative at the next GE. 👀

It's a bit like Brexit.

They are supporting and they are voting tactically for a party that campaigns for independence to save their own skin.

Which is bizarre in the light of their blaming the Conservatives about how it came to Brexit.

Pearlyjam · 24/10/2025 14:52

Just seen a video of Starmer saying that digital ID won't be mandatory but if you dont have it you'll have to pay £85 every time you have to prove your identity. Another attempt to blackmail people into taking it up. He will just keep pushing and pushing won't he. It'll never be 'mandatory' but our lives will become increasingly difficult to live without it, so we'll be forced into it against our will.

Kier Starmer and his government has made me so depressed and anxious. I'm so scared about the future, losing our freedoms, total government control.

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Parsley4321 · 24/10/2025 14:55

@Pearlyjam hes just clutching at straws he’s saying nonsense

EasternStandard · 24/10/2025 15:08

Pearlyjam · 24/10/2025 14:52

Just seen a video of Starmer saying that digital ID won't be mandatory but if you dont have it you'll have to pay £85 every time you have to prove your identity. Another attempt to blackmail people into taking it up. He will just keep pushing and pushing won't he. It'll never be 'mandatory' but our lives will become increasingly difficult to live without it, so we'll be forced into it against our will.

Kier Starmer and his government has made me so depressed and anxious. I'm so scared about the future, losing our freedoms, total government control.

Edited

Wtf they should just drop this nonsense already. So glad they’re tanking.

CaveMum · 24/10/2025 15:13

justasking111 · 24/10/2025 13:31

In Wales we've suckled at the state systems tit for three generations now when the mines went, labour didn't have a backup plan like the Irish. Labour didn't fight for any industry just let them fail. The latest big one being Port Talbot.

We had the Welsh development agency who wooed overseas investors, successfully , we had the Welsh tourist board who wooed overseas tourism again successfully. The Senedd swallowed them both up and shut them down.

Banging our drum business wise is an anathema to them. Westminster lost patience years ago and sidelined us as lazy grifters. And I don't blame them.

The only way for anyone to make money is to be on every benefit going and augment income using the black economy. Like Greece there's two prices for a lot of things. The market price and the cash backhander.

I may be misremembering but wasn’t it the Senedd who drive away the Game of Thrones production team? They wanted to film in Wales, given the beautiful scenery, and asked for a tax break to do so. The Senedd said no so they went to Northern Ireland instead where they got what they asked for and are now reaping the benefits of fan-based tourism.

38thparallel · 24/10/2025 15:17

Just seen a video of Starmer saying that digital ID won't be mandatory but if you dont have it you'll have to pay £85 every time you have to prove your identity.

What will happen to those who can’t - or won’t - pay?

AbsentosaurusRex · 24/10/2025 15:32

CaveMum · 24/10/2025 15:13

I may be misremembering but wasn’t it the Senedd who drive away the Game of Thrones production team? They wanted to film in Wales, given the beautiful scenery, and asked for a tax break to do so. The Senedd said no so they went to Northern Ireland instead where they got what they asked for and are now reaping the benefits of fan-based tourism.

I know they refused James Bond access..

‘We have the Chuckle Brothers in the Senedd on a weekly basis - why can't we have James Bond? #007’

😂😂

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2015/mar/13/welsh-assembly-refuse-james-bond-licence-to-film

Welsh assembly refuses James Bond licence to film

Tories criticise decision to deny request by makers of new 007 movie Spectre to film in debating chamber of the Senedd

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2015/mar/13/welsh-assembly-refuse-james-bond-licence-to-film

justasking111 · 24/10/2025 15:33

Parsley4321 · 24/10/2025 14:55

@Pearlyjam hes just clutching at straws he’s saying nonsense

He's lost the plot

justasking111 · 24/10/2025 15:35

CaveMum · 24/10/2025 15:13

I may be misremembering but wasn’t it the Senedd who drive away the Game of Thrones production team? They wanted to film in Wales, given the beautiful scenery, and asked for a tax break to do so. The Senedd said no so they went to Northern Ireland instead where they got what they asked for and are now reaping the benefits of fan-based tourism.

Total arrogant idiots.

AbsentosaurusRex · 24/10/2025 15:36

38thparallel · 24/10/2025 15:17

Just seen a video of Starmer saying that digital ID won't be mandatory but if you dont have it you'll have to pay £85 every time you have to prove your identity.

What will happen to those who can’t - or won’t - pay?

Edited

I assume - I hope - that will be all of us. People power. Do fck off kier.

Nolletimiere · 24/10/2025 16:24

Pearlyjam · 24/10/2025 14:52

Just seen a video of Starmer saying that digital ID won't be mandatory but if you dont have it you'll have to pay £85 every time you have to prove your identity. Another attempt to blackmail people into taking it up. He will just keep pushing and pushing won't he. It'll never be 'mandatory' but our lives will become increasingly difficult to live without it, so we'll be forced into it against our will.

Kier Starmer and his government has made me so depressed and anxious. I'm so scared about the future, losing our freedoms, total government control.

Edited

He is such a reprehensible little shit, really.

Nolletimiere · 24/10/2025 16:27

DO IT REEVES.

Rachel Reeves has been warned off raising income tax and breaking Labour’s manifesto pledge.

The Treasury is considering increasing income tax in the Budget, despite promising in its 2024 manifesto not to “raise taxes on working people” through increases to “National Insurance, the basic, higher, or additional rates of Income Tax, or VAT”.

But experts have warned the Chancellor she risks stamping out tentative signs of economic recovery if she launches the first increase in the headline tax on workers in 50 years.

The Telegraph understands several Cabinet ministers are also worried that breaking a manifesto tax pledge would be difficult to sell to the public while support for Labour continues to plummet in the polls.

TheNuthatch · 24/10/2025 16:39

This week's FON polling

Labour isn't working - Thread 14
OP posts:
TheNuthatch · 24/10/2025 16:42

Nolletimiere · 24/10/2025 16:27

DO IT REEVES.

Rachel Reeves has been warned off raising income tax and breaking Labour’s manifesto pledge.

The Treasury is considering increasing income tax in the Budget, despite promising in its 2024 manifesto not to “raise taxes on working people” through increases to “National Insurance, the basic, higher, or additional rates of Income Tax, or VAT”.

But experts have warned the Chancellor she risks stamping out tentative signs of economic recovery if she launches the first increase in the headline tax on workers in 50 years.

The Telegraph understands several Cabinet ministers are also worried that breaking a manifesto tax pledge would be difficult to sell to the public while support for Labour continues to plummet in the polls.

She might as well. Labour don't seem to care what was and wasn't in their manifesto. It was a book of lies.

OP posts:
Nolletimiere · 24/10/2025 16:43

TheNuthatch · 24/10/2025 16:42

She might as well. Labour don't seem to care what was and wasn't in their manifesto. It was a book of lies.

Absolutely.

Anything which accelerates the demise of these liars and charlatans, is to be embraced.

EasternStandard · 24/10/2025 16:44

Nolletimiere · 24/10/2025 16:43

Absolutely.

Anything which accelerates the demise of these liars and charlatans, is to be embraced.

Yep. Just get them out.

Pearlyjam · 24/10/2025 16:53

Nolletimiere · 24/10/2025 16:24

He is such a reprehensible little shit, really.

@Nolletimiere I agree - the man's a devious, arrogant, immoral, machiavellian lizard.

This might sound dramatic, but I feel unsafe with him as PM - it feels like he's trying to harm us. I feel under attack. I also wish that equally vile creature Tony Blair would just piss off. He's always lurking in the background, like a Poltergeist who won't go away.

MantleStatue · 24/10/2025 17:00

So Reeves promised not to hit 'working people' by raising VAT?

What does she think private school parents are? We each have a magic money tree in our gardens and it just yields disposable income for school fees?

aaah, I get it. Not those sorts of working people or that sort of VAT. Gotcha.

Nolletimiere · 24/10/2025 17:11

FT

Apols for the formatting.

Labour’s trouncing in the valleys town of Caerphilly was the biggest drop in support for the party in a Welsh by-election — although its strategists have taken some solace from the failure of Reform UK to capture the seat. In an area that Labour has represented for more than a century, the party was humiliated. Its vote collapsed from 46 per cent to 11 per cent as Plaid Cymru, the Welsh nationalist party, took control.

The Conservatives were, meanwhile, eviscerated in their own worst by-election performance in history, receiving just 2 per cent of the votes. Yet it was Sir Keir Starmer, the Labour prime minister, who was feeling the heat on Friday as commentators reached for their thesauruses to describe the scale of the defeat. It points to Labour losing control of the Welsh Senedd next May when local and regional elections are held across the UK.

Labour’s best hope of wielding power in the Senedd beyond next spring now appears to be as a junior partner in a Plaid-run coalition. With Starmer’s popularity sinking to fresh lows since his landslide general election victory in 2024, next year’s elections could be a moment of acute political danger, with some MPs already speculating about a change of leadership. But it is not clear whether appointing a new Labour leader could reverse structural changes in British politics, fuelled in part by social media, which have seen the decline of the old duopoly of Labour and the Conservatives.

Rhun ap Iorwerth, Plaid Cymru leader, said this could be “the start of a reset for Welsh politics” as he had “no doubt” his party could soon be running Wales. “What it shows is that the two-party system is dead,” said David Bull, chair of Reform UK. “It’s pretty indicative of what is going on in the rest of the country.”

On the face of it Reform UK, Nigel Farage’s populist right-wing party, should be feeling energised after coming second with 36 per cent of the vote. Reform only picked up 2 per cent when the seat was last contested in 2021. Farage’s party appealed to many older voters, soaking up large numbers of former Conservatives along with other people who have not voted for years. And yet some Labour MPs have taken solace from the fact that Reform was still trumped by Plaid. One minister on Friday said the result showed the existence of an anti-Reform majority in Wales and the UK. “It reminds us that while 30 per cent can be an election-winning tally against a fragmented opposition, it is not enough against, as in Caerphilly, a strong competitor,” said Sir John Curtice, professor of politics at Strathclyde University.

Adam Langleben, executive director of Progressive Britain, a Blairite think-tank, said: “The glimmer of hope is that the public rejected Reform and clearly voters coalesced around the party that they felt was best able to stop Reform. In most places, the most viable party to beat Reform will be the Labour party.” This may sound like wishful thinking. And yet analysis carried out jointly by the consultancies Public First and Stonehaven, based on MRP polling over the year to August 10, found that tactical voting could now be sufficiently prevalent to deny Reform a majority at the next general election. The research found far more seats potentially affected than in either 2019 or 2024, with the impact particularly pronounced in the north-west, south-west and south-east and also “disproportionately” high in Wales. Overall, it concluded, the trend could benefit both Labour and the Conservatives and cut Reform’s projected seat tally from about 400 to around 210, resulting in a hung parliament. “Tactical voting is no doubt going to play a critical role in the next election and Caerphilly has demonstrated this,” said Seb Wride, partner at Public First and Stonehaven, whose polling involved 40,000 survey responses over the course of the year and placed greater weight on those received most recently. That theory holds water so long as Labour is seen as the most likely party to stop Reform, which — for now — it is in much of England. Starmer’s worst scenario would be if his party is eclipsed in national opinion polls by either the Greens, Liberal Democrats or Jeremy Corbyn’s new party. That may seem unlikely. But nobody was predicting two years ago that Reform would overtake the Tories in the polls. The problem facing Labour is that it is already hugely unpopular in swaths of the country, even before a second Budget, which will include another batch of tax rises. On Friday, a blame game erupted between Welsh Labour and the national party, with some politicians in Wales blaming Starmer for the haemorrhaging of votes. Welsh Labour has for years tried to distinguish itself from the national party through a so-called “clear red water” strategy. Ron Davies, a former Labour Welsh secretary, said the party would struggle to ever recover from decisions such as means-testing winter fuel — a policy that has since been reversed. “It was a devastating result for Labour . . . the Labour party nationally was very, very unpopular on the street, from door to door, canvassing. There was no interest whatsoever in supporting Labour,” he said. But one Labour aide in London said the Caerphilly result was partly due to mistakes made in Wales, including a controversy involving donations to former first minister Vaughan Gething. He said that next year’s Senedd elections would be even worse because of a decision by Mark Drakeford, Gething’s predecessor, to change the voting system in a way that will benefit smaller parties. “They’re drowning in their clear red water,” he observed.

justasking111 · 24/10/2025 17:23

Nolletimiere · 24/10/2025 17:11

FT

Apols for the formatting.

Labour’s trouncing in the valleys town of Caerphilly was the biggest drop in support for the party in a Welsh by-election — although its strategists have taken some solace from the failure of Reform UK to capture the seat. In an area that Labour has represented for more than a century, the party was humiliated. Its vote collapsed from 46 per cent to 11 per cent as Plaid Cymru, the Welsh nationalist party, took control.

The Conservatives were, meanwhile, eviscerated in their own worst by-election performance in history, receiving just 2 per cent of the votes. Yet it was Sir Keir Starmer, the Labour prime minister, who was feeling the heat on Friday as commentators reached for their thesauruses to describe the scale of the defeat. It points to Labour losing control of the Welsh Senedd next May when local and regional elections are held across the UK.

Labour’s best hope of wielding power in the Senedd beyond next spring now appears to be as a junior partner in a Plaid-run coalition. With Starmer’s popularity sinking to fresh lows since his landslide general election victory in 2024, next year’s elections could be a moment of acute political danger, with some MPs already speculating about a change of leadership. But it is not clear whether appointing a new Labour leader could reverse structural changes in British politics, fuelled in part by social media, which have seen the decline of the old duopoly of Labour and the Conservatives.

Rhun ap Iorwerth, Plaid Cymru leader, said this could be “the start of a reset for Welsh politics” as he had “no doubt” his party could soon be running Wales. “What it shows is that the two-party system is dead,” said David Bull, chair of Reform UK. “It’s pretty indicative of what is going on in the rest of the country.”

On the face of it Reform UK, Nigel Farage’s populist right-wing party, should be feeling energised after coming second with 36 per cent of the vote. Reform only picked up 2 per cent when the seat was last contested in 2021. Farage’s party appealed to many older voters, soaking up large numbers of former Conservatives along with other people who have not voted for years. And yet some Labour MPs have taken solace from the fact that Reform was still trumped by Plaid. One minister on Friday said the result showed the existence of an anti-Reform majority in Wales and the UK. “It reminds us that while 30 per cent can be an election-winning tally against a fragmented opposition, it is not enough against, as in Caerphilly, a strong competitor,” said Sir John Curtice, professor of politics at Strathclyde University.

Adam Langleben, executive director of Progressive Britain, a Blairite think-tank, said: “The glimmer of hope is that the public rejected Reform and clearly voters coalesced around the party that they felt was best able to stop Reform. In most places, the most viable party to beat Reform will be the Labour party.” This may sound like wishful thinking. And yet analysis carried out jointly by the consultancies Public First and Stonehaven, based on MRP polling over the year to August 10, found that tactical voting could now be sufficiently prevalent to deny Reform a majority at the next general election. The research found far more seats potentially affected than in either 2019 or 2024, with the impact particularly pronounced in the north-west, south-west and south-east and also “disproportionately” high in Wales. Overall, it concluded, the trend could benefit both Labour and the Conservatives and cut Reform’s projected seat tally from about 400 to around 210, resulting in a hung parliament. “Tactical voting is no doubt going to play a critical role in the next election and Caerphilly has demonstrated this,” said Seb Wride, partner at Public First and Stonehaven, whose polling involved 40,000 survey responses over the course of the year and placed greater weight on those received most recently. That theory holds water so long as Labour is seen as the most likely party to stop Reform, which — for now — it is in much of England. Starmer’s worst scenario would be if his party is eclipsed in national opinion polls by either the Greens, Liberal Democrats or Jeremy Corbyn’s new party. That may seem unlikely. But nobody was predicting two years ago that Reform would overtake the Tories in the polls. The problem facing Labour is that it is already hugely unpopular in swaths of the country, even before a second Budget, which will include another batch of tax rises. On Friday, a blame game erupted between Welsh Labour and the national party, with some politicians in Wales blaming Starmer for the haemorrhaging of votes. Welsh Labour has for years tried to distinguish itself from the national party through a so-called “clear red water” strategy. Ron Davies, a former Labour Welsh secretary, said the party would struggle to ever recover from decisions such as means-testing winter fuel — a policy that has since been reversed. “It was a devastating result for Labour . . . the Labour party nationally was very, very unpopular on the street, from door to door, canvassing. There was no interest whatsoever in supporting Labour,” he said. But one Labour aide in London said the Caerphilly result was partly due to mistakes made in Wales, including a controversy involving donations to former first minister Vaughan Gething. He said that next year’s Senedd elections would be even worse because of a decision by Mark Drakeford, Gething’s predecessor, to change the voting system in a way that will benefit smaller parties. “They’re drowning in their clear red water,” he observed.

Drakeford destroyed labour in Wales not Starmer imo. The odious toad is still obviously controlling the party from behind the curtain.

Rivalled · 24/10/2025 17:39

How can anyone be comforted by a collapse in main stream voting - we’ve got nationalists vs reform. That’s really not a great outcome for the tories or Labour at all…whether reform or Pc (or reform or the snp) wins any seat is neither here nor there for the collapse in mainstream party support.

its worse than I thought…

EasternStandard · 24/10/2025 17:39

justasking111 · 24/10/2025 17:23

Drakeford destroyed labour in Wales not Starmer imo. The odious toad is still obviously controlling the party from behind the curtain.

Maybe. But I also think Starmer is so thoroughly loathed and Labour doing badly generally it turns even Wales off them.

I also agree with @Pearlyjam

I think it’s because he’s utterly craven but so bad that he goes for control, which is the scary nasty part.

justasking111 · 24/10/2025 17:40

Reform came second in an area where there's little migrant problems as in most of Wales. We read about it but it's happening in England. We read about it in Cardiff, Swansea, small beer compared to England. We're just bloody angry with the Senedd.

justasking111 · 24/10/2025 17:43

EasternStandard · 24/10/2025 17:39

Maybe. But I also think Starmer is so thoroughly loathed and Labour doing badly generally it turns even Wales off them.

I also agree with @Pearlyjam

I think it’s because he’s utterly craven but so bad that he goes for control, which is the scary nasty part.

Edited

It's like Davros. You will obey or I'll double down. Starmer I am a Dalek repeats endlessly.

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