Thread 34 Starmer - Conference Swanwiches and a Deputy Leader contest

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www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5411278-thread-33-starmer-gerst-monath?page=40&reply=147446478

How is English a rip off degree? I’m offended as the proud owner of half a one. (The other half was Social Policy, which I don’t think she’d have liked any more, tbh).

Both of my sons have Music degrees. Bloody wasters. 🤣

My DD has English and Education. Utter woke nonsense 😆

English a rip off degree?
I have no words.

Whereas one of my degrees is Physics and I’ve done fuck all with it in decades.
The “ban Mickey Mouse degrees” cycle repeats every few years, but nobody ever agrees what degrees are useless (arts degrees get targeted more than sciences).
Most degree courses don’t lead to specific roles, the point of university education is to study something at a high level and meet other academic people along the way.

I've forgotten a heck of a lot of a chemistry degree, over the decades.

Lol. English degree. Sociology and film teacher. My bad. Sociology is the 4th most popular A level for girls. Let us not forget they don't especially want girls at university...

Yesterday, our current government cut the bursary for English teacher training to £0.

Still get 20k for Classics.

We’re a complete waste of space - English degree (me) and my son’s is Fine Art.

We are clearly both despicable and irresponsible parents. Better not add that I have a Theology degree 🤣.

Oh they always roll out the Mickey Mouse degree stuff when they’ve got nothing else to say.

Time they said what they mean.

They mean your kids. University for their kids is fine (even English degrees).

We don’t have an economy that supports graduates.
Why is that?

The further right you go, the less respect you can afford any hint if intellectualism.

Remember how Michael Gove dismissed experts ?

Fascists do not like learning. Especially in other people.

It would actaully be really interesting to see even as a MN snapshot whether , of those who are university educated (we already know the left leaning are more likely to have a degree and PG study according to research, especially Green voters) the Conservative voters and those leaning right to Reform are more likely to be private sector employed, business owners or have a STEM degree. You can certainly spot on HE threads some familiar names deriding 'soft' A levels and 'less useful' degrees. Easy Venn diagram to more political threads (and actually FWR) to be found there. I wonder if also the more left leaning posters (such as most of us) are more likely to have arts and social science degrees and to work in the public sector or arts industries.

I suspect so.

My DS informs me that history academics are far more likely to be right wing than any others he encountered (including economists!).

I asked ChatGPT for degrees of the shadow cabinet - and history does feature highly, along with PPE and Economics.

James Cleverley stood out with hospitality management.

DD2 has a first in History and Economics and is slightly left of centre and more inclined to vote Labour. Her partner is more inclined to vote LibDem. Eta - he has a first in Pure Maths.

I have a BA in History and MA in Archaeology. I used to be right of centre but am getting more left-leaning the older I get. I do think age has something to do with it for me personally but it was definitely Brexit that swung me away from the right.

I think more science degrees or people with STEM knowledge in the government wouldn't be a bad thing. The most stereotypical degree traditionally for politicians was PPE. Which is an excellent grounding in what it is but it's a problem if everyone has that grounding and other people don't.

I don't think the politicians pushing the "Science good, Humanities bad" are usually from a science background. You need to nurture creativity in children particularly and the people I know with PhDs in science and maths were usually really into music or art as well. It's more almost an inferiority complex or a love of pseudoscience. It appeals to the same sort of people who talk about their IQ a lot, who think they are science experts because they "researched" vaccines on the internet. Or, new annoyance, people who talk knowledgeably about AI and AGI but very obviously don't fully understand how it works.

Not that it's wrong to be interested in AI or science. It's more the people who do it with a side order of patronising for people who disagree with them.

Anecdotally, a lot of my favourite knitting designers are scientists or mathematicians. They seem to feature heavily in the quilting world, too.

Yes, you could be right. I am very sure a lot of posters on MN are not actual biologists , or climate change scientists , or economists.

There are a lot who claim their DHs are....

Words fail me and they shouldn't as I am educated to Masters level and have an English Literature degree!

I think the American Writer, David Wallace's 2005 commencement speech at Kenyon College, aptly describes the purpose of a university liberal arts education, in that it isn't really there to teach you 'how' to think, it is more that it provides, “the choice of what to think about”- that your thoughts don't have to rely upon a default setting to navigate the world, you can choose the alternative.

https://www.teachthought.com/education-posts/this-is-water/

I find it truly depressing that every aspect of our life has to have a economic value. Besides, never exploring the world outside of the perfunctory will worsen our economy as we need to nurture imagination for national intellect!

When I was at uni late 90s, early 00s it was very much about an exploration of holistic education, people discussed books, Art, films, so many films, one of my favourites was Basquiat I recently recommended it to my late teen but he's not really interested and he's really bright. I'm not sure if this kind of stuff is seen as self indulgent now, which IMO is ashame!

I'm always really impressed by how much money UC mathematicians know about music, art , literature, languages and obscure history. I guess they are the real polymaths. It's cheering to see.

I agree @Piggywaspushed

DD2 is excellent at Maths but she and her partner love galleries, theatre and films. She's an excellent knitter and DD1 does fabulous crossstitch and knitting. Skills passed down from Gran to me to them.

I have a degree in English Literature and the Classics but I also love science. Plus I do enjoy quilting and dressmaking.

I didn't know there was a film about Basquiat. It is on Netflix, so will watch. I am very fond of this.

Yes, it has some great Actors in and a superb soundtrack, may have to rent it though:

https://m.imdb.com/title/tt0115632/