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Charlie Kirk dead

1000 replies

Booneymil · 10/09/2025 23:20

The last thread was taken down because of personal insults towards the man.

We should be able to have a thread about this news topic.

Report any insulting posts. Mumsnet can you please just delete the offending posts, instead of deleting the whole thread?

Thank you.

Charlie Kirk has died today. He was shot at a public talk that he was giving.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
8
MyHeartyCoralSnail · 11/09/2025 09:45

Rosscameasdoody · 11/09/2025 09:42

Ah, now you’ve added influence, which is a whole different ballgame because words are nothing if they don’t influence. But the blood of those killed in the holocaust and many more is on the hands of Hitler. What happened was due to his vision, and the deaths are attributable to him - just as he was responsible for the deaths of the 5000 men who were hunted down and killed after the attempt on Hitlers’ life. He ordered the purge. He signed the death warrants. He ordered Rommel to commit suicide to avoid his family being persecuted. These are not words. These are actions, and they had lethal consequences.

Edited

Very well explained. I’m scared that people can’t draw this distinction themselves and need it pointing out.

koolkatxx · 11/09/2025 09:45

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Chickenbone123 · 11/09/2025 09:46

Fabrikick · 11/09/2025 09:40

What he said in context:

AUDIENCE QUESTION: How's it going, Charlie? I'm Austin. I just had a question related to Second Amendment rights. We saw the shooting that happened recently and a lot of people are upset. But, I'm seeing people argue for the other side that they want to take our Second Amendment rights away. How do we convince them that it's important to have the right to defend ourselves and all that good stuff?

CHARLIE KIRK: Yeah, it's a great question. Thank you. So, I'm a big Second Amendment fan but I think most politicians are cowards when it comes to defending why we have a Second Amendment. This is why I would not be a good politician, or maybe I would, I don't know, because I actually speak my mind.

The Second Amendment is not about hunting. I love hunting. The Second Amendment is not even about personal defense. That is important. The Second Amendment is there, God forbid, so that you can defend yourself against a tyrannical government. And if that talk scares you — "wow, that's radical, Charlie, I don't know about that" — well then, you have not really read any of the literature of our Founding Fathers. Number two, you've not read any 20th-century history. You're just living in Narnia. By the way, if you're actually living in Narnia, you would be wiser than wherever you're living, because C.S. Lewis was really smart. So I don't know what alternative universe you're living in. You just don't want to face reality that governments tend to get tyrannical and that if people need an ability to protect themselves and their communities and their families.

Now, we must also be real. We must be honest with the population. Having an armed citizenry comes with a price, and that is part of liberty. Driving comes with a price. 50,000, 50,000, 50,000 people die on the road every year. That's a price. You get rid of driving, you'd have 50,000 less auto fatalities. But we have decided that the benefit of driving — speed, accessibility, mobility, having products, services — is worth the cost of 50,000 people dying on the road. So we need to be very clear that you're not going to get gun deaths to zero. It will not happen. You could significantly reduce them through having more fathers in the home, by having more armed guards in front of schools. We should have a honest and clear reductionist view of gun violence, but we should not have a utopian one.

You will never live in a society when you have an armed citizenry and you won't have a single gun death. That is nonsense. It's drivel. But I am, I, I — I think it's worth it. I think it's worth to have a cost of, unfortunately, some gun deaths every single year so that we can have the Second Amendment to protect our other God-given rights. That is a prudent deal. It is rational. Nobody talks like this. They live in a complete alternate universe.

So then, how do you reduce? Very simple. People say, oh, Charlie, how do you stop school shootings? I don't know. How did we stop shootings at baseball games? Because we have armed guards outside of baseball games. That's why. How did we stop all the shootings at airports? We have armed guards outside of airports. How do we stop all the shootings at banks? We have armed guards outside of banks. How did we stop all the shootings at gun shows? Notice there's not a lot of mass shootings at gun shows, there's all these guns. Because everyone's armed. If our money and our sporting events and our airplanes have armed guards, why don't our children?

He also said that about empathy followed by stating he thought sympathy was preferable.

I don't agree with what he said necessarily, but these cherry picked soundbites to try and prove a point are ignorant.

It’s interesting because I don’t agree with this viewpoint. But equally you could just flip that and say some unnecessary abortions are the price of women being free and having bodily autonomy.

I don’t think he would agree. But I think he would shake my hand and say actually that’s a really good point. He did seem fair and warm as a person. I have kids the same age. So sad.

Zebedee999 · 11/09/2025 09:47

MyHeartyCoralSnail · 11/09/2025 09:36

Now I’m sure i have actually heard those views somewhere before in a context the left fall over themselves to support

Yes I can never understand why the left have allied themselves with an anti gay misogynistic religion. They must have a common hatred in common... Jews maybe?

Fabrikick · 11/09/2025 09:47

WellThisIsFranklyDreadful · 11/09/2025 09:43

You think that was the ONLY time he discussed it? Now who is cherry picking….

This is where he discussed the quote banded around about some deaths being the cost of gun ownership that he believed was worth it, yes. Do you have a clip or quote of him saying what you said he said about school shootings? Ill wait...

BananaPeels · 11/09/2025 09:47

Anonentity · 11/09/2025 09:43

It’s not about reconciliation of thought or feeling between UK and US. Or even if he was far right or not, he is telling people that the gun deaths of their loved ones are worth it to have a gun availability. The statistics speak for themselves. And sadly now he is one of them.

Just because use of guns has become ingrained in cultural identity for many Americans, it doesn’t mean it’s right and shouldn’t change.

But who is to say you are right? That is the point. I don’t like guns, I find it baffling but to many in the US society they feel the same way that Charlie Kirk did.

I absolutely would have debated hard with him on the issue. But ultimately the US is an independent country with strong views on this. His was not a minority view necessarily. You just don’t agree with it, as I don’t. But he has the right to have it.

WellThisIsFranklyDreadful · 11/09/2025 09:48

TheCatsTongue · 11/09/2025 09:40

I think you're messing the very obvious point that Hitler was a ruler who had control over his nation's policies and armies.

Hitler just used words? He used military force.

And how did Hitler get the military force? How did a middling student, failed painter, and former undecorated private in the trenches come to be in that position of power? Rhetoric. He used his words to gain influence. To give orders. To have people follow him into doing terrible things.

He didn’t just wake up one day in charge of Germany. He talked his way there.

InvisibleSockLady · 11/09/2025 09:48

Chickenbone123 · 11/09/2025 09:46

It’s interesting because I don’t agree with this viewpoint. But equally you could just flip that and say some unnecessary abortions are the price of women being free and having bodily autonomy.

I don’t think he would agree. But I think he would shake my hand and say actually that’s a really good point. He did seem fair and warm as a person. I have kids the same age. So sad.

I think he'd argue that the deaths of women as a result of abortion bans are the acceptable collateral damage, rather than taking the point the other way, honestly. That's the 'pro life' stance - women's lives don't count.

WellThisIsFranklyDreadful · 11/09/2025 09:49

Fabrikick · 11/09/2025 09:47

This is where he discussed the quote banded around about some deaths being the cost of gun ownership that he believed was worth it, yes. Do you have a clip or quote of him saying what you said he said about school shootings? Ill wait...

For obvious reasons, I will not be googling video clips of anything mentioning Charlie Kirk and guns at present. 🙄

Zebedee999 · 11/09/2025 09:50

Chickenbone123 · 11/09/2025 09:46

It’s interesting because I don’t agree with this viewpoint. But equally you could just flip that and say some unnecessary abortions are the price of women being free and having bodily autonomy.

I don’t think he would agree. But I think he would shake my hand and say actually that’s a really good point. He did seem fair and warm as a person. I have kids the same age. So sad.

Even if you don't agree with his views killing someone is insane. I feel so sorry for his young kids and wife today.
Politicians should be able to walk the streets in safety. In the UK we have had two killed that I know of. Prescott egged years ago. Duncan-Smith assaulted (the jury let the assailant off), Farage attacked multiple times. What is wrong with people that they resort to violence instead of using their voice?

Livelovebehappy · 11/09/2025 09:50

InvisibleSockLady · 11/09/2025 09:39

There's a lot of it about - always a lot of social media celebration of migrant deaths in the Channel. The comments on those stories are full of people delighted to see children drown. Lots of people are very willing to gloat about the deaths of others online.

I've yet to see someone on MN come on here and gloat about immigrants dying. You're referencing the entire social media platform which is a cesspit of misfits and the unhinged.

EasternStandard · 11/09/2025 09:50

WellThisIsFranklyDreadful · 11/09/2025 09:48

And how did Hitler get the military force? How did a middling student, failed painter, and former undecorated private in the trenches come to be in that position of power? Rhetoric. He used his words to gain influence. To give orders. To have people follow him into doing terrible things.

He didn’t just wake up one day in charge of Germany. He talked his way there.

So what is it you’re after? People taken out if they talk in a way you don’t like?

InvisibleSockLady · 11/09/2025 09:50

BananaPeels · 11/09/2025 09:47

But who is to say you are right? That is the point. I don’t like guns, I find it baffling but to many in the US society they feel the same way that Charlie Kirk did.

I absolutely would have debated hard with him on the issue. But ultimately the US is an independent country with strong views on this. His was not a minority view necessarily. You just don’t agree with it, as I don’t. But he has the right to have it.

Edited

Most polls show a majority of Americans agree with tighter gun control. The gun lobby are extremely powerful but they don't represent the views of most Americans.

Francine84 · 11/09/2025 09:51

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

This sort of comment is mind-boggling to me. The left are not in power, and historically the UK and US have mostly been led by a centrist or slightly right-leaning party over the last hundred years. Trump is hard right, Starmer is supposedly a centrist but seems to be adopting Reform policies to curry favour with voters.

So who is this “Loony left” you’re referring to? Certainly not anyone with any political power.

And if you look at notable figures who have been assassinated in the last 100 years they tend to be people who are arguing for civil rights (think JFK, Martin Luther King, Malcolm X).

When you say “loony left” do you mean people who object to racism, genocide, violence, mass deportations without due process, corruption, climate change, etc? Because in my experience those are lovely people who want the world to be a nicer, fairer place for everyone. And they don’t go round assassinating people.

WellThisIsFranklyDreadful · 11/09/2025 09:51

EasternStandard · 11/09/2025 09:50

So what is it you’re after? People taken out if they talk in a way you don’t like?

Please do go ahead and point to ANYWHERE I’ve said that. I’ve never said anything of the sort. My whole point was that words have power and meaning and to dismiss it as “just words” is disingenuous.

Fimofriend · 11/09/2025 09:51

LondonLady1980 · 10/09/2025 23:32

I felt genuinely sad when saw this on the news earlier. I have watched countless YouTube clips of him and although I can see why he’d rub some people up the wrong way, underneath it all he just seemed your stereotypical “American Man” who loved God, his wife and his children and who wanted people (especially women) to be safe and respected.

I feel sad for his children and for the fact that just because someone disagreed with his view points they now have to grow up without their father.

The whole thing is tragic.

"Respected women"?

He wanted women to lose the right to vote. If you call that "respect" then what does disrespect look like?

MyHeartyCoralSnail · 11/09/2025 09:51

Zebedee999 · 11/09/2025 09:47

Yes I can never understand why the left have allied themselves with an anti gay misogynistic religion. They must have a common hatred in common... Jews maybe?

Historically that has been the position

Nagginthenag · 11/09/2025 09:52

I feel very uncomfortable with the rhetoric around this. Of course, Charlie Kirk had the right to say anything he wanted. Of course he shouldn't have been killed (although we have no idea at this stage who killed him or why he was killed). But some appear to be in the process of making a martyr of him. Many of his arguments were incredibly flawed, and he made some downright racist and misogynistic comments. I wonder why the uproar, the demands that flags be lowered, the presidential statement, for Charlie Kirk, but nothing for Melissa Hortmann who was also gunned down in cold blood.

For those saying people should show some sympathy and respect for Charlie Kirk, where was the sympathy and respect he showed for victims of gun violence with his comments about some gun deaths being worth it to uphold the 2nd amendment?

Upstartled · 11/09/2025 09:52

EasternStandard · 11/09/2025 09:50

So what is it you’re after? People taken out if they talk in a way you don’t like?

Just the right kind of people though.

InvisibleSockLady · 11/09/2025 09:52

Livelovebehappy · 11/09/2025 09:50

I've yet to see someone on MN come on here and gloat about immigrants dying. You're referencing the entire social media platform which is a cesspit of misfits and the unhinged.

There are threads up now on Mumsnet in which people express that they are unequivocally not sad about migrant drownings. Some of the same people who are so horrified at others not being sad about Kirk's death on the grounds of basic humanity are apparently very much not sad about the Channel tragedies.

lifeturnsonadime · 11/09/2025 09:53

CurlewKate · 11/09/2025 09:45

No I haven’t. They were rightly deleted. Why do people persist in attributing the same views to unselected posters? And no I don’t think killing for political reasons is acceptable. I have said so about 6 times.
What do you think of Kirk’s statements about the acceptable collateral damage of second amendment rights?

Edited

Why do people persist in attributing the same views to unselected posters?

Mmmm I haven't done that I was responding to another persons post. You are being dishonest by suggesting that I have.

Regarding to his comments on 2nd amendment gun laws, I haven't heard them, I've only read second hand reports. I don't agree with what I've read or with his views on abortion.

He has been assassinated because he holds views that do not align with the person who assassinated him. That's abhorrent, what ever your political leaning if you believe that democracy and the right to free speech is important.

Upstartled · 11/09/2025 09:53

InvisibleSockLady · 11/09/2025 09:52

There are threads up now on Mumsnet in which people express that they are unequivocally not sad about migrant drownings. Some of the same people who are so horrified at others not being sad about Kirk's death on the grounds of basic humanity are apparently very much not sad about the Channel tragedies.

Show me one solidarity post of anyone on MN gloating over drownings.

Fabrikick · 11/09/2025 09:53

WellThisIsFranklyDreadful · 11/09/2025 09:49

For obvious reasons, I will not be googling video clips of anything mentioning Charlie Kirk and guns at present. 🙄

You posted your original post not long ago, its okay to admit you were wrong.

MyHeartyCoralSnail · 11/09/2025 09:54

Nagginthenag · 11/09/2025 09:52

I feel very uncomfortable with the rhetoric around this. Of course, Charlie Kirk had the right to say anything he wanted. Of course he shouldn't have been killed (although we have no idea at this stage who killed him or why he was killed). But some appear to be in the process of making a martyr of him. Many of his arguments were incredibly flawed, and he made some downright racist and misogynistic comments. I wonder why the uproar, the demands that flags be lowered, the presidential statement, for Charlie Kirk, but nothing for Melissa Hortmann who was also gunned down in cold blood.

For those saying people should show some sympathy and respect for Charlie Kirk, where was the sympathy and respect he showed for victims of gun violence with his comments about some gun deaths being worth it to uphold the 2nd amendment?

Have you read the full dialogue only that? Or just parroting the latest leftist social media soundbite

BananaPeels · 11/09/2025 09:54

InvisibleSockLady · 11/09/2025 09:52

There are threads up now on Mumsnet in which people express that they are unequivocally not sad about migrant drownings. Some of the same people who are so horrified at others not being sad about Kirk's death on the grounds of basic humanity are apparently very much not sad about the Channel tragedies.

Sorry but you have zero evidence unless you are cross checking posters that the two groups are the same.

I think anyone is dying is tragic circumstances is sad. They are, however, completely different scenarios.

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