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Thread 32 Starmer - Corn Moon

1000 replies

DuncinToffee · 06/09/2025 11:34

Pull up a chair for some friendly chit chat about politics and beyond

Taxes optional but greatly appreciated.

Previous thread
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5402603-thread-31-starmer-september-rain?page=40&reply=146949615

OP posts:
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85
MaybeNotBob · 10/09/2025 23:12

Probably just another paid squirrel to be ignored though.

PandoraSocks · 10/09/2025 23:12

I keep typing and deleting as I can't quite get my words right.

I think that Kirk's views were abhorrent. He said empathy was a bad thing?

I don't agree. That is why I can say that, in spite of what I think about his views, what happened tonight was a tragedy. A young man is dead and his family is devastated. If we begin to caveat that, we are at the start of a slippery slope that ends in a terrible place.

strawberrybubblegum · 10/09/2025 23:13

DuncinToffee · 10/09/2025 23:10

Maybe try reading what is actually being said

I did. "however live by the sword.."
Making an equivalence between a man debating a political opinion about guns and him being murdered.

strawberrybubblegum · 10/09/2025 23:14

MaybeNotBob · 10/09/2025 23:12

Probably just another paid squirrel to be ignored though.

Nope. Just an utterly disgusted human being.

strawberrybubblegum · 10/09/2025 23:15

PandoraSocks · 10/09/2025 23:12

I keep typing and deleting as I can't quite get my words right.

I think that Kirk's views were abhorrent. He said empathy was a bad thing?

I don't agree. That is why I can say that, in spite of what I think about his views, what happened tonight was a tragedy. A young man is dead and his family is devastated. If we begin to caveat that, we are at the start of a slippery slope that ends in a terrible place.

Thank you @PandoraSocks

DuncinToffee · 10/09/2025 23:16

And you came here to tell us that. I can't remember seeing you 12 weeks ago

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MaybeNotBob · 10/09/2025 23:17

DuncinToffee · 10/09/2025 23:16

And you came here to tell us that. I can't remember seeing you 12 weeks ago

Funny that...

strawberrybubblegum · 10/09/2025 23:19

I suspected there would be this kind of despicable nonsense over here. Probably shouldn't have come over to check. I do think it's my civic duty to tell those of you making excuses to think about you've done.

MaybeNotBob · 10/09/2025 23:20

strawberrybubblegum · 10/09/2025 23:19

I suspected there would be this kind of despicable nonsense over here. Probably shouldn't have come over to check. I do think it's my civic duty to tell those of you making excuses to think about you've done.

No. You came here to be "holier than thou" to promote your far right agenda.

We're just a bit more intelligent than you.

Please run along now...

DuncinToffee · 10/09/2025 23:22

Civic duty to tell other people what to think?

OP posts:
strawberrybubblegum · 10/09/2025 23:23

MaybeNotBob · 10/09/2025 23:20

No. You came here to be "holier than thou" to promote your far right agenda.

We're just a bit more intelligent than you.

Please run along now...

We're just a bit more intelligent than you.

No. You're just completely lacking any kind of self awareness.

strawberrybubblegum · 10/09/2025 23:24

DuncinToffee · 10/09/2025 23:22

Civic duty to tell other people what to think?

Civic duty to call out fuckwittery.

DuncinToffee · 10/09/2025 23:24

We are being watched and moderated now Hmm

OP posts:
strawberrybubblegum · 10/09/2025 23:24

But I will stop derailing.

MaybeNotBob · 10/09/2025 23:29

strawberrybubblegum · 10/09/2025 23:23

We're just a bit more intelligent than you.

No. You're just completely lacking any kind of self awareness.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

And breathe...

LlttledrummergirI · 10/09/2025 23:54

strawberrybubblegum · 10/09/2025 23:14

Nope. Just an utterly disgusted human being.

I appreciate your honesty here. Thank you.

cardibach · 11/09/2025 00:04

Piggywaspushed · 10/09/2025 17:24

Was 'Little Lies' on that album?

No, but ‘I Don’t Want to Know’ and ‘Secondhand News’ are. Apropos of nothing.

Namitynamename · 11/09/2025 05:34

LlttledrummergirI · 10/09/2025 22:41

Fucking hell. Barely a mention (no mention from Trump) about the school shooting. But plenty of sympathy from Trump for a right wing gun nut who has previously said

"I think it's worth to have a cost of, unfortunately, some gun deaths every single year so that we can have the Second Amendment to protect our other God-given rights. That is a prudent deal. It is rational.” - Charlie Kirk 2023

Where was he a few months ago when the two Democrats were shot dead?

He also said
“I think empathy is a new age term that does a lot of damage" - Charlie Kirk

Best heed the advice then and ditch the empathy.

I think the quote about not becoming the thing you are fighting is useful. The anti -empathy messaging from parts of the American right is super damaging for lots of reasons. It's easy to say "well then we won't have empathy for YOU" in response but that's firstly a trap for "the left". And secondly deliberately handicaps you - empathy and theory of mind are both useful cognitive functions.

The man had very young children (I think 1 and 3) who will grow up without a father and who are too young even to be able to understand that yet. I know a family who lost the father when the kids were about that age and it was just awful for their mother to deal with her own grief and also have to keep answering a 3 year old asking "where's daddy,". It's hideous.

His views were awful. But he was willing to debate them publicly (and they did not stand up to intelligent debate. See his recent Cambridge debate.) Political violence is dangerous specifically because it makes it harder to have those open debates, and makes it harder to close down the bad ideas intelligently. So his death is a really bad thing.

LlttledrummergirI · 11/09/2025 06:26

I feel empathy for those caught up in the hateful rhetoric being pushed by the right, not those creating it. They can fuck off.

That's like having pity because Heydrich was killed by resistance fighters.

He got what he wanted. A world with hate, a world with guns and a world here innocent people are being persecuted. Too bad, that world got him.

Piggywaspushed · 11/09/2025 06:50

Can I recommend another book? Gary Younge's 'Another Day in the Death of America' about the US relationship with guns particularly the more than daily unreported deaths of Black Americans.

PandoraSocks · 11/09/2025 07:17

@Namitynamename I agree. We have to be better than those pushing hate. This is a good tweet:

Thread 32 Starmer - Corn Moon
itsgettingweird · 11/09/2025 07:58

That’s a really strong statement and I agree.

What worries me is that situations like this only seek to inflame the hatred and violence rather than calm it.

When someone who advocates for the right to arms falls victim to the right to arms it should - imo - open questions about that right and the responsibilities that go with that right:

Instead, as we saw with knife crime here and people carrying them “for protection”, it’ll likely increase those carrying arms for fear of being the next victim.

no one should die for their political views. But the sad reality is if you advocate for the right for people carry carry weapons that can kill instantly you also increase your own chance of falling victim to that right.

it’s ironic that people are shouting about loss of right to free speech and freedom to choose - and yet that right is increasing hate and violence.

pointythings · 11/09/2025 08:21

I agree that the shooting of Charlie Kirk is a bad thing. I agree that he did not deserve to die. But what sympathy I have goes to his family. It goes to the innocent victims of endless school shootings. It goes to the victims created by the thoughtless worship at the altar of the gun. Charlie Kirk was such a worshipper. I have no sympathy left for him personally.

His murder makes the US an even more dangerous place, however.

DuncinToffee · 11/09/2025 08:27

People don't have to mourn the guy

OP posts:
DuncinToffee · 11/09/2025 08:31

Thornberry has withdrawn from the deputy leadership race.

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