11 YO lied and put himself in danger

[Discombobulate48]

I have a fantastic relationship with my kids, we are very close and they’ve always come to me for support if needed however today I’m at a loss and so disappointed that I need some advice about this situation.

11 YO was out with his friends today, called me and asked whether he could go fishing with 2 of them, I told him that it was fine as long as he doesn’t go too near the water or go into the river under any circumstances (he cannot swim) He agreed.

when he got home I asked how his time was, he told me that he didn’t go into the river but his friends did and that he told them it was dangerous, I said how proud I was that he listened and that he was safe.

Not long after I noticed that his clothes were wet up to his torso, he lied 3 more times before admitting that he did go into the river.

I am so disappointed, I’ve told him he is off consoles for the week, he’s going to watch river safety videos and write about why what he did was dangerous. He’s also got to earn my trust back because he’s lied to my face.

He gave me attitude and was rolling his eyes while I was talking to him.

I’m at a loss, so disappointed that he’s done this but just want some advice how to handle the situation and if I’m doing the right thing.

I agree with this, don't be too hard on yourself Op.
I too grew up in the 70 s, near one on England's big rivers, also surrounded by golf courses with ponds. I never asked my mum if I could go near, because it would have been an emphatic "no". So I didn't ask, we just did it anyway. Everything from fishing to rafting.
At least your DS asked you.
Being a swimmer is irrelevant, being able to detect danger and avoiding it, is a life saver. Your DS practically learned a bit of that this week. It s not the end of the world.

That's unfair. Lots of people who can swim drown. Would you say to a 11yo who could swim yeah go knock yourself out, get into any body of water you fancy?

And teaching children to swim is very expensive and therefore a privilege.

My 13yo DC has some mild SEN that makes swimming harder for him, we've spent £££ on swimming lessons over the years and he's still a weak swimmer.

I honestly think you expect too much of an 11 yo. They feel invincible when they're that age.

If you allow him to spend time near a body of water with friends and without adult supervision, you're accepting that he might somehow end up in that body of water. Falling, jumping, getting pushed...

I wouldn't allow him to go fishing with friends (and no adult supervision) as long as he can't swim.

I think we have too lax an attitude with allowing kids out with their friends in this country. Mine are adult, at uni etc so can do what they want now. But allowing them out alone at age 11 - I just didn't. I know what my kids' peers got up to aged 11-15ish and it was risky, stupid and criminal. They have no direction (ie an organised activity) when they are just "out" and they make their own fun - which can involve anything they can get their hands on. The devil makes work for idle hands really applies to what I've seen over the years. Climbing on dangerous rocks, taking drugs, throwing large stuff in rivers - essentially unsupervised and feral. I was never allowed to just go onto the streets with no purpose, neither was DH and neither were my kids. I just don't get why we normalise this behaviour. I did let them out with friends when there was a proper agenda. But not just to be feral.

The bottom line is that your DS is too young to make safe and sensible decisions. He has proved this. He shouldn't be allowed out with friends unsupervised.

She’s not being hard on herself at all! She’s being hard on the unsupervised 11 yo, for being an 11 yo.

I think it also develops confidence in what you can do. The other week for example I was at a customers premises, secondary school, they had a loose bit of concrete dangling on its re-bar from a window casement on the second floor.

Clearly it needed pulling off before it fell - lots of discussions from the staff about scaffolding, ladders not being tall enough etc.

Meanwhile myself and my colleague had gone up to the floor in question, I'd popped out of the window, moseyed along the ledge, cut the re-bar, safely dropped the concrete and made a brew, job done.

I agree @BUMCHEESE
As I said in my previous post my DC swims at club level and the scenario in the OP would still receive a flat out No from me.
Even on holiday, we still make sure one of us is out there in the water with him.
Even the strongest adult swimmer can get into difficulties in open water.
It is a world away from a still, calm swimming pool with coaches and instructors aplenty.
I refuse to take chances when it comes to water safety.

You told an 11yo child who can’t swim he could play near a river without an adult. You were totally in the wrong to do that. And then when, because he was a child playing with friends on a hot day he did go into the river.
I’m not sure what you’re asking, but you’re the adult and he’s a child who has lied to avoid getting into trouble. You’ve come down quite harshly, so it’s no wonder he lied. He’ll learn to cover his tracks better in the future.

This.

Little bit confused as to how all the flat out 'wouldnt let my child out playing anywhere near water' crowd think we manage in areas where you can't walk more than a mile without meeting a river or lake

Yeah I couldn't give a flat out ban on being unsupervised near water where I live because its everywhere (but its still water rather than a river so a lot safer), especially not once they get to upper school age because the school sends them out to collect water samples from the different lakes and not entirely supervised either, and in PE they get sent running/biking round the area including to the lake completely unsupervised. So instead I have to make sure water safety and danger awareness is firmly engrained in them.

And the OP starts with ‘11 YO lied and out himself in danger’.

The lack of parental responsibility is staggering. And blaming a child . How unbelievably naive and stupid.

I mean unless you live in a very small island it’s easy enough surely?

I live in a seaside town, the beach is about half a mile away; it doesn’t surround the town though, so my kids were allowed to play out, but not at the beach.

The lake is just a few hundred metres from our house, some of DS's friends live right on the shore so playing in their gardens will mean playing right next to the water. And as I said, they get sent by school to the lake unsupervised so even if I banned them they'd still have to go. And fishing is a popular hobby for kids here so that's going to come up - better to prepare them than ban them and have them go anyway, as kids often will do if they're the only one banned.

This

They have grown up around the ocean and all done junior surf lifesaving and two of the four have bronze surf lifesaving certifications and one of them does competitive surf lifesaving. I don’t mind them swimming without me in the ocean as long as they swim between the flags. Which I suppose is still supervised.

River swimming would make nervous though, not at 11. Maybe 16 years plus, bearing in mind they are strong open water swimmers already.

Also - there are risks, and risks,

Shallow lakes with clear water, a sandy or gravel bottom and no waterfall into it, such as many tarns in the Lake District pose much less of a risk than a lake with steeply falling edge into dark and very cold water - e.g the middle part of Ullswater or Wastwater.

Moving water is wholly different. Rivers such as the Trent or Thames may look as if they move sleepily along but they are riven with really strong currents , cold depths, unseen hazards etc

And anything tidal can be lethal. Terrible tragedy years ago on the N Norfolk coast - two children washed out in a channel on a popular beach, with the parents convinced they had been abducted from the sandhills because they could both swim and the water was 'only knee deep'. Knee deep water running fast is plenty to knock children off their feet. Their bodies were washed up a couple of weeks later, miles along the coast.

Moving water is a force. a strong force.

'Never forget you' - funeral held for Freya Tobin https://share.google/gcxs2vBZ0KyvtqX17

12 years old in our local river last week. She could swim.
There would be a huge consequence for his lying and stupidity.

A friend of mines 15 year old competitive swimmer, cousin, drowned a few years back, his parents had put all of their children in swimming lessons from babies, it was an absolute non negotiable and they had extremely strict rules around water, he was a stronger swimmer then most adults but slipped in the river, hit his head, got caught in the current and was unable to get out. He drowned.

Why on earth would you let your 11 year old non swimmer go and hang near water (he's FISHING! he was quite obviously going to be near water) with no adult supervision? This is on you.

The rivers here have been very high and fast over the past few days - I'm a good swimmer but I don't think I could get myself out of trouble in them the way they are right now - he needs to appreciate that.
Swimming lessons are a good start but you need to address his attitude as that is unacceptable. Every heatwave there are stories of young people getting into trouble in open water - perhaps show him these stories online.

Yes I also have a small lake a couple hundred metres from the house.

A river runs through the local own - you walk down by the banks to get to the school and cycle passed a small lake on the way home (to my home at least but many others too!). People said upthread about the cinema and shopping etc and yes there are areas further away, but to navigate the area to get to those things whilst banning time unsupervised close to the water would be completely unmanagable.

As someone mentioned upthread though, of course fishing IS different than just hanging out by the water (even sitting on the banks, because you don't have kit that gets pulled under or dropped!) and that's why I gave a list of mitigations I would follow for that activity.

But a few people have said they just straight out wouldn't allow their child to be out playing near open bodies of water unsupervised - but unless you are collecting your year 7 child from school and back that's just not feasible.

I don't think there's inherently anything irresponsible about allowing an 11 year old to go fishing. I really don't. I think it's a good activity for them actually. But to let them go unprepared is irresponsible. It should be allowed - but with measures.

This was on my Facebook memories today, from 2021. It can happen to anyone.

"Twelve people have drowned in England in the last four days.

We know it’s boiling hot in the south west at the moment, and we’re all desperate to cool off.

The water might LOOK appealing but you won’t know the temperature until you’re in it.

🙏 Please - never jump straight into water. Your body will have a shock reaction, and…

1. You will gasp
2. If you’re under water, the water enters your lungs
3. You will drown.

If you want go into water, please go in slowly to allow yourself to get used to it.

These are the 12 people who have sadly lost their lives. Our thoughts are with their loved ones.

💜 A 50 year old man drowned in the river Ouse in York
💜 A 19 year old man drowned in Salford Quays
💜 A teenage girl died after getting into difficulty in Ducklington Lake, Oxfordshire
💜 A 20 year old drowned in Crooke Valley Park, Sheffield
💜 A man died whilst swimming at Pugneys Country Park in Wakefield
💜 A 49 year old man who got into difficulty when swimming at Ardingly reservoir in West Sussex
💜 A 16 year old teenager drowned in the River Eden, Carlisle
💜 A 61 year old woman at Croyde beach, North Devon
💜 A man died in a disused quarry in Buxton, Derbyshire
💜 A 29 year old man from Bolton was recovered on Rossal Beach, near Blackpool

#BeWaterAware #RespectTheWater

Read more about cold water shock https://orlo.uk/pkeAE "

I was certainly fishing alone at a younger age than 11, certainly by 9, but mostly it wasn't in any dangerous spots - if I fell in I'd have got wet but was easily able to get out again but I did fish at a deep river a few times unsupervised and I wouldn't feel comfortable with my children doing that until I was very sure about their sense of safety - I wasn't even comfortable with my mum fishing there but at a different spot to me, out of sight, this summer! Had a bit of a panic when I went to see if she had caught anything and couldn't find her.

YABU for letting a child get to the age of 11 without being a competent swimmer.

2 years ago my dc lost a mate who followed his best mates off a pier ... Nobody knew he couldn't swim. Didn't find his body for a week....
Be very thankful you have gotten the chance to put things right...

Amazed you aren’t taking any responsibility OP. If I knew my child couldn’t swim I’d say he can’t go.