Taxes to rise to fund PIP 2

[Viviennemary]

I saw the other thread was full. Still I look forward to the vote which is on Tuesday. Sky news called him two Tier Keir. Most unfair thing ever if this passes.

There are obviously people who need support and can’t work but so so many people can and don’t.

the country can not afford to fund a bottomless benefit pot

I remember PP saying about the autistic student using a PIP back payment to go on holiday before.
PIP can take ages to get, especially if you have to go to tribunal, so some people can end up with back payments of a couple of £grand.
You can't retrospectively pay for any care you needs you had. Before the student was awarded, any extra costs would have been paid for by them or their care needs just not met.
And when they get a lump sump from backpay... they can spend it on what they want. I hope the student had a great time on holiday.

Well the answer is that all employers (not just the few) need to be more disability friendly, but the infrastructure isn’t there yet. The goverment have openly admitted this.
Also if people got the surgeries etc they needed instead of 3-4 years waiting lists, a lot of these people would not be claiming PIP.

People who can work, but don't, are on job seekers (or the UC version).
The changes Labour wanted to bring in was to actually pay that group more.

Well said.

Where has anybody disputed that a large number of the working population don't have health issues? Of course that includes disabled people, and non disabled people.

Ah, are we heading into deserving disabled vs the undeserving disabled territory? Oh goody.

Which made sense!😕

Well, it only took 6 pages to get into the "but I'm a GOOD disabled person who still works, not like all these horrible lazy ones stealing your taxes" bollocks.

Such a classic.

Love this reply!!

The social contract mentioned here is the thing to watch. Labour can't push everyone too far and expect all the funding to hold up.

@Ohthatsabitshit no why should the higher bracket households shoulder the burden for the great good of society? What do we get out of it?
We earn enough to support our family and we are not living some well off comfortable life that everyone on mumsnet seems to perceive.
We are not reckless and tired of hearing this rhetoric. We don’t qualify for child benefit but that’s okay because we planned the children we wanted and should be able to support them right? The children didn’t choose us as the parents so why do they not get their child benefit? The same children that will be expected to become tax payers in the next 20 years?
I have two autoimmune conditions but no we should be paying more tax for others.
Tax now, then tax the pensions then tax assets. This hatred for people who earn a little more is tiresome.

How about MPs live in their constituency and travel to Westminster as required without claiming second home expenses and solely living off their already tax payer funded salary. Just like the rest of the workforce in this country that has to decide if they can do the commute to work on the compensation they receive.

If expenses were taken away I’m sure a lot of money would be available to the public purse.

I also agree that mental health conditions such as depression and anxiety should not be under long term PIP. I say this as someone who has PTSD, and likely bouts of depression. I have found that working has assisted my mental health and supporting individuals through alternative channels might be more effective.

Further if we continue on this greater tax trajectory more tax payers will emigrate and then we will have even a high tax burden with more going out than can be covered. Yet these people will no doubt be back when they’re older and the countries they emigrate too are not willing to cover their long term chronic conditions.

Perhaps we should make it so tourists who come to London have to pay a greater tourist levy to enter attractions to generate tax or a higher NHS levy for those who work in the UK without citizenship. Students taking out health insurance when coming to study in the UK, families also having to pay a levy towards the schools, until they obtain their ILR.

These practises don’t seem to be a problem in any other county but god forbid it’s suggested in the UK there is an uproar.

But hard no on the increased taxes.

Most people who claims pip knows this. I was born disabled but worked full time up until about 3 years ago when my conditions had deteriorated to the point I couldn't anymore I just kept ending up hospitalised. I now work part time and claim pip

That’s interesting never heard anything about that. Are this Labour gov just a useless bunch of idiots?

I'm open to have my mind changed but if someone is completely unable to work due to health issues then the sum of their welfare money they get should be enough to sustain them. Food, water, heating, utility bills etc.

No one is entitled to luxuries. There are working people who can't afford passports and can't afford to go abroad.

Imo someone who cannot work due to their health deserves enough to have some basic standard of life provided but the taxpayer cannot needlessly subsidise.

Exactly. I work. I'm lucky enough to have a good employer who does their best to meet my access needs. Many workplaces would not be able to accommodate me because of the level of specialised equipment and medical support I require and because, with the best will in the world, there are a limited range of job types that are suitable for a blind woman with restricted mobility to engage in. It takes a great deal of time, money, resources and, above all, goodwill to make a workplace truly accessible for those with severe physical disabilities and most employers will sadly lack some or all of these things. I do wonder where all these jobs are going to come from for all the disabled people who are apparently being encouraged to rejoin the workforce, but if I'm wrong and this is going to herald the dawn of a new era of true workplace inclusivity and a welcoming of disabled empployees then I'll be delighted to eat my words.

Tax evasion is already illegal, i.e. not declaring income, over-declaring expenses, etc - basically lying on tax returns.

Tax planning is perfectly legal, i.e. complying with all relevant laws.

Basically all governments bring in reliefs and exemptions for their cronies and paymasters but cry foul when "normal" people use the same reliefs and exemptions.

Eh? Er, how would you fund our public services with no income? And no, pensioners have paid forty years, no more.
Now a tax on the wealthy would be very welcome and solve a lot of problems.
Regarding PIP, I am beyond relieved that current recipients are going to continue and I would hazard a guess that future applicants will not face the grilling, interrogation, horrendous ordeal that we did and the limits will be reduced from 4 to 3, which is fairly reasonable.
Starmer and co have restarted and generally got going literally 100’s of different stuff that is making all our lives a little bit easier. Far too many to list here. His Achilles heel is immigration and no one seems to have the answer. If you think anyone else could do better with the pile of rubbish Labour were handed on 5th July, I’d like to know how. We were told life would be difficult short term. I’m sure by 2027, if we’re not all fried or flooded out of our homes, things will be better.

There's only one criteria with 3 points so moving the goalposts from 4 to 3 won't make any difference to many people

Oh really? I know no one of working age who chooses to stay at home and do nothing. I do know several like myself who quite rightly claim PIP and work.

@TigerRag they are currently working on changing the questions & points system, but this will take time.

Some people on benefits can budget... cut back on some things, and be able to spend on some luxuries. We need some nice things in life, otherwise what is the point?

I would imagine that the criteria is also going to be tweaked, which is long overdue. I am sure that a lot more thought is going to be given to this. Kendall needs to go tho, and Rayner for her hashtag #Dyingtowork. Things will change, I’m sure of it.