Really offended a friend. Would this upset you?

[Eastie77Returns]

Arranging where to go to dinner on a group chat with 3 friends and came up with a shortlist of restaurants. One friend (‘Sally’) said she could not afford any of those venues. The other 2 friends suggested some cheaper options but she said it was still too pricey as she has to factor in travel and babysitting costs for the evening. So we asked her to suggest somewhere and she came up with a pub that is honestly not somewhere I’d choose to eat (or drink for that matter) but by this time the group had been going back and forth for days so I said if everyone was in agreement we should go. We had a nice evening. The food was not very good and the pub attracts a rough crowd so not a great atmosphere but we sat in the garden and all enjoyed catching up.

My other two friends then messaged me separately and suggested that the three of go to one of the restaurants Sally had vetoed.

Can I ask if you were Sally, would you be upset or offended at this? She found out and is really hurt.

@Eastie77Returns Having read your last two updates, I think I should withdraw my previous comment and instead say; either Sally is batshit or the whole thing never happened making you the batshit one

I don’t think you did anything wrong but you do sure have one dim-witted mate.

I’m happy to sort it out but she cannot explain why it is one rule for her and another for the rest of us? E.g. when she suggested the cocktail bar the non drinking friend said no. Sally then separately said the three of us should go (not on the group chat). I can’t see how that differs from this situation?

Our non drinking friend fasts every year. She has never once said we shouldn’t go to restaurants between sunrise and sundown while it’s Ramadan just because she can’t. She came to the rough pub Sally chose although it was an uncomfortable environment for her (I mean all of us really but she was visibly a target in this rough crowd).

We did not treat Sally any differently to the way we have always treated each other. But suddenly she is hurt at behaviour that has never been an issue before.

Why not just meet at someone's house?

Because it’s not the same as going to a nice restaurant in London?

Well everyone is hurt by different circumstances. The friend who didn’t care about not going to drinks, might be a bit more breezy in general about these things and less sensitive. Maybe she’s really was hurt and just let it go without saying anything, who knows. Maybe she’s not super overwhelmed and stressed out by having just bought a doer upper house with young kids and starting renovations (like Sally)

Hrft .
Hi Sally, 3 of us have planned to go to Fabulosa on Saturday totally understand if you can't make it (for whatever reason) and we'll all catch up again soon and let you know if it was worth it.

Cheers
Fleabag.

On a separate note, when u was a poor mature student, my friends gave me their ironing and then paid for me at restaurants, but Sally may not have time to do extra chores so maybe not an option
.

I cannot think of anything Sally would be less likely to do than our ironing. She outsources her own to her cleaner!

Here is the crux of the matter. You don’t want to not invite your friend as that could be perceived as excluding her.

but it is also not right that the rest of you don’t get to go where you’d like to. The reason here is cost. The sand would apply if it were food allergy, food preference or something else

you all have been fair and went where she suggested even though it was not a place any of you really enjoyed, wanted to go and don’t really want to go again.

Now it is the turn of someone to pick something else. that is how you present to your friend. That you've gone to her choice if venue and now it is the turn of another person to choose. That you’d like her to come but understand if she wants to sit this one out.

we had this with a friend who is allergy shellfish. But done of us love it and our others don’t want it in the house (one for religious readings, another for smell - no fish at all at home). We love it though. We had enough of never being able to order it out - ever, with this friend.

So now the odd occasion we are going to a seafood place we tell her we’re going and invite her too, but also let her know next time it is her choice of venue.

We had similar with a vegan friend. That may have worked out but she insisted on only vegan places. That was not sustainable for a regular monthly girls’ night out when some of us would like seafood or fish some times and others craved steak. when it is your monthly outing you’re really looking forward to, it isn’t fair for one person to dictate where the group goes all the time. There has to be give and take.

Do I? Hahaha! That'll teach me to post such a pompous comment! I really should sit on my hands more! 🤣🤣🤣

Because Sally didn't want to travel to London where the rest of us live and we couldn't go to her house because it's undergoing renovations. So we met at a pub close to where she lives.

Maybe maybe so many "maybes"

Here is one more - maybe Sally is controlling and selfish who doesn’t want to be left out of things so will be offended when the group does things without her but at the same time doesn’t care about ‘hurting’ her friends feelings by leaving them out of events SHE wants to do.

Maybe she’s pregnant, and hasn’t told anyone yet. And can’t have sushi. 🤷‍♀️

To everyone suggesting kind things like for paying for Sally, bartering chores like ironing😳or finding other bend-over-backwards ways to include her in expensive events - just stop.

Speaking as the Sally of my group, the only time I felt different, upset and a bit humiliated was when people tried this sort of well-meaning approach on me. After declining politely on many occasions I had to get quite No Means No. It did change the friendship and we're not as close as we were. Such is life.

The difference here is that Sally's response is to make the others feel bad about their choices. I'm sure nobody slagged off her grotty pub as rudely as she did their fancy restaurant; or would be so offended to miss out on something they didn't want to do anyway. I agree with @Yeoldlondoncheese, Sally is using her 'special' status as an excuse for emotional blackmail.

Agreed, she doesn't have to be grateful, but she doesn't even seem capable of being polite. And yes she can challenge, but it's literally pointless to ask for opinions if one has no willingness to reflect, which OP doesn't seem to have.

How is saying they can't afford a restaurant controlling. Should she say yes and miss out paying essentials.

If you informed your friends you are vegan and they insisted going to meat heavy restaurant. You replied I'm not going because vegan. Your not controlling the night either.

Here friends could of said no but seemed to want her there

Put yourself in her shoes . How would u feel if your three friends went out without asking u if u wanted to come ? You should have extended the invitation to her & because u didn’t she probably feels that u have gone behind her back , she feels hurt & left out . I would apologise profusely & explain why u didn’t ask her , then in future make sure u include her in all future invitations .

I'd be hurt if I was Sally. If you had all decided to go to this place without her and without telling her, it would likely feel like she'd been purposely excluded.

It would have been better to say that you were all keen to try the other place specifically, and she was welcome to come along. At that point it's really up to her to decline if she can't afford it.

As a one off it's fine, especially as you are compromising other times.

Edit - I can see updates that have said she's repeatedly said that she didn't want to go to this place. In that case, I would have let her know the three of you were keen to try it, and we're going to make arrangements to go.

Maybe she’s pregnant, and hasn’t told anyone yet. And can’t have sushi.

WTF so odd! 😂most sushi places don’t only serve raw fish 🙄

Maybe Sally is secretly in love with Eastie77 and is heartbroken she didn’t fall to her knees begging her to join the dinner. See I can come up with random shit as well.

I’m done engaging with you. You are too dramatic and sensitive.

There certainly is a lot of Sallys on Mumsnet isn't there?!

Here’s a radical suggestion, but have you thought about asking her why she’s upset? “I understand you’re upset, that wasn’t our intention, I was a bit surprised because [insert all the stuff you’ve put on here] and I’d like to understand it from your point of view”? I’ve done that. At face value it can do just what it says on the tin. Or, it could bring out in the open that there’s a different issue which is manifesting itself as this.

Just to be sure - she is definitely upset about the situation and there’s not something else going on and it’s been assumed it’s feeling as though she’s being excluded?

Could be she’s a bit miffed but actually there’s something else going on. As I said earlier I think I would be disappointed if I was Sally but certainly wouldn’t think twice about the others still going. You can have fomo but still accept others wishes I think.

There was a situation I was involved in (not directly), where a friend group has assumed Someone was being difficult over splitting a bill- turns out they had a lot going on and a comment in the meal had triggered them. Poor girl then got grief until it all came spilling out.

You’re being totally unreasonable, why should a group of friends not be able to go out and enjoy a meal because one doesn’t want to or can’t afford it! It’s ridiculous to think one person should totally dominate what the rest do.

This being the case I wonder why she was upset on this particular occasion, have you asked her op. maybe it goes a bit deeper than you guys going without her.

I think this is an excellent idea.