How to tell DD no sleepovers

[NoSleepOver]

Hi,
My DD is 10 and some of the girls in her year at school have gradually started to have or go to sleep overs. One of the girls in my DD’s class has now invited 5 of them for a sleepover for her birthday.
Now each to their own but I will say that I am very much against sleepovers. I’ve just decided it’s a blanket no. The problem I have now is my DD asking me why not. I know the girls parents fairly well - they aren’t friends of mine but I’ve known them a few years, they seem decent enough and we’ve spent time together with the kids outside of school. But of course you never really know, hence why I’m just saying no to sleepovers for the foreseeable future. I know not everyone will agree, but this is the decision I have made.
DD is now asking me why she can’t go and obviously I can’t say because her parents might be p**s! I obviously don’t think they are, but you never can tell can you. And it’s easier say no to everyone than yes to some and no to others.
To DD so far I’ve said she might not like it and want to come home, that she has no means to contact me as she doesn’t have a phone - DD wants to go and obviously doesn’t understand the issue, so insists she won’t want to come home and that if she needs to speak to me she will ask the parents to contact me.
Help me make it make sense to her and why it’s ok for other people to go and not her!

Sorry but your last paragraph is very naive

Why would they be very unhappy?

I think in all likelihood, most will just accept that different parents have different rules, some will roll their eyes and think it’s ridiculous. But only a very unreasonable person would take a blanket “no sleepovers” rule as a personal attack on their character and get upset.

My DC are younger, and some parents are happy with play dates where they leave their child at the friend’s house, some parents aren't and will only do play dates where they stay with the child. I don’t think anyone is upset and insulted that a parent doesn’t want to leave their child, even though the basic reason is broadly the same (essentially “I don’t know for sure they’ll be safe”, although obviously not spelled out like that).

I'm with you op, my daughter is 10 and hasn't been to a sleepover yet, luckily we haven't had many invites yet so it's OK. As a child /young teen I was constantly allowed to sleep over whoever I was invited by, my parents had no issue, most of those sleepovers were innocent and fine, but a few stand out, I was shown a porn magazine aged 9, at 13 or 14 I had a friend who was troubled and we would attend parties with alcohol, drugs, older strangers etc her mum would drop us at these parties thinking they were innocent. At 15 me and friend(she was already sexually active, I wasn't) went for a walk late at night and ended up in some house with some older men(they were in their 20s), she had sex with 2 of them, I ended up being assaulted by one and my innocence taken. I will never forget that night and it has caused a lot of trauma for me and fear for my own daughter. Don't let anyone tell you that you aren't being fair by not letting her go and that she will miss out etc.

Agree with @TheKhakiQuail and @dubstepper about any adverse reactions from the parents or kids.

As parents, we should respect other parents’ and kids’ ways of being. Because we know jack shit about their background or needs. We should respect their decisions and choices without them having to explain. It’s quite possible a parent is a survivor of sexual abuse or that a child has hidden disabilities or health problems (e.g. bed wetting) which make sleepovers difficult.

We shouldn’t take offence. Or probe or assume the reasons. But instead be accepting.

We should also teach our kids to respect others’ needs and choices. I’d be horrified if my kids weren’t such good friends with a DC because they hadn’t come to a sleepover. That’s not being a good friend.

I think you need to be age appropriately honest with your daughter and manage this really carefully. Children can be very mean (unfortunately) and being the odd one out can be isolating. There is a lot of value in good quality and independent peer interaction for learning social skills and manage risk. And having some great experiences without parents and brilliant memories.
Start having safe body conversations with your daughter now - it’s never too early NSPCC recommends around age 3, there are good resources on their website.
The best way to manage risk with children is to educate them and talk openly- this is for everything, sex, online, consent etc etc
A side note but as someone who has worked in child protection for almost a decade most of the sexual abuse cases we deal with are within the family network - parents, grandparents, non bio partners, aunts and uncles and siblings. If you are so risk averse don’t be blind to dangers close to home.

@Gloriia why would anyone prioritise that over their child’s safety? Why would anyone try to browbeat another parent with perfectly valid concerns into doing something they are not comfortable with? What’s wrong with you? 😕

I have a friend who doesn’t let her children sleepover (but has had friends stay over hers for a 2 day sleepover). She is open about the reason and feels an overall ban is less offensive than a one to one one! I do find the logic though of then letting the children sleep in a garden room that has a door that backs onto the alley odd and nonsensical but hey it is her choice.

Thst said her DD is 14 and pushing back because she is starting to feel she wants to make the choices herself and that is the balance that is needed.

mine hate sleepovers DS has done one and one residential and DD did a lot but prefers her own bed - she is 16 so expecting sixth form may change that!

This is a really realistic assessment of the difficulties. It IS hard to explain to a ten year old that you worry they are at risk of SA in their own friend’s house without instilling a lot of concerning fears. It’s far easier to teach children sboug these things at a more abstract level, without effectively implicating parents or siblings of their friends. I think some posters are being too quick to dismiss this difficulty.

At the end of the day, parenting is a responsibility not a popularity quest. If op feels it is something she is not comfortable with, she can just say no.

I am totally with you. I think at 10 the truth is the age appropriate response to her. One of the best protections for abuse is having a truthful language around this stuff. There’s an Instagram page called something like ‘consent parenting’ - it’s American and will totally freak you out but I have got lots of useful tips on how to talk about this.
As a social worker in child protection services I can always say to parents “oh I am super paranoid and cautious because of my job, I see all the worst of what happens”. That’s a bit of a cop out because actually the extent of what happens on sleepovers is not paranoia at all! To my child I’ve explained what sexual abuse is, how prevalent it is and how it influences my rules and decisions. She’s a mature 7 year old.
I do play dates and sleepovers at my house and yes I’ve thought that’s messaging “I’m safe and you’re not” but I don’t care…it’s not what I’m saying and people can decline the invitation if they want.

No, neither of us did, although obviously she was unaware the same happened to me. I thought I'd be called a liar, his sister and dad were in the house at the time and I didn't think I'd be believed. Obviously as an adult I can see that there was plenty of evidence all.over me but as a child I was just terrified of being blamed, of being called a liar. It's great that posters on here have told their children what to do if it happens to them but it's different in reality. I often consider reporting even now however no one irl knows and I am not prepared to turn my life upside down.

@IridiumSky

Is it an unreasonable fear? Read some of the stories on here. As parents we should be supporting each others decisions when it comes to our childrens safety. If I was told by a parent that they had a blanket no sleepover rule, I would respect this without judgement. As a PP mentioned, we have no idea what trauma or experiences parents have been through. This also means extending understanding to the children who aren't able to go to sleepovers. We have explained to our child that some parents don't allow sleepovers and it doesn't make your friendships less valuable.

Yes no one has suggested we don't teach them life skills and going into a house with strange men is not a good idea. Sorry for what you experienced .

Sleepovers are a great way for them to learn how to socialise, for us to meet their friends and you very quickly pick up who are the dodgy ones without any boundaries so perhaps decline invites from them going forward.

It is a way for them to be supervised but to also be included in friendship groups. To say no at 10 is absolutely unreasonable. This is the easy bit when you're probably friends with all their parents, wait til secondary school when you've no idea whose house you're dropping them off at.

This is a disgusting and immature thing to say.

Read the messages from those of us about children who’ve been raped at sleepovers. Then come back with your hilarious Nazi quips.

And the risk of sexual violence isn’t the only issue at sleepovers. I went to one at 11 where they played inappropriate scary things and I was terrified. Then they bullied a girl who fell asleep first. It was awful and I hated every second.

As a teacher, who has done residentials, please make sure your child has had some sleepovers before this.

I have done many residentials and the kids whom have never had a sleepover have a really hard time. I have literally been up until 1am/2am comforting kids who are having their first night away from home.

At least if she had a sleepover with friends she can be prepared and if overwhelmed you can put things in place to help her.

I am with you OP, your decision. Just because 'other people do it' is no reason to change your mind.

I agree difficult to explain why, hope some of the other thoughts help.

Presumably by age 10 she has a good understanding of sex. She will have had teaching at school about boundaries, risks of social media, explicit photos etc. They cover that in P6 at our school. Most children that age have already been exposed to pornography.

I think you have to be brutally honest with her - you are worried that she might be at risk of sexual abuse at a sleepover. I don't think lying to her is going to help her in the long run.

This topic was discussed in my house last night. DS invited a friend but but he said no he is not allowed sleepovers because his parents don't know us well enough.

Truth is I am a bit insulted and it made me think about their reasons. He is 12 but a newish friend. Do they think they are too good for us? Have we done things that indicate we are irresponsible? Are we too liberal with Internet or devices, are we bad parents somehow? Or maybe they think DH could be a paedophile, am I supposed to be OK with this presumption on their part?

Apparently it's because they don't know us well enough but what is the threshold for them, do we need to be related or just a bit more friendly?. If for example we have them all over for dinner do we fall into a 'safe' category just because we've shared a bottle of wine? Perhaps they have super human paedophile detection powers that no one else possesses. They can be sure only people in their inner circle are good enough because of their incredible ability to judge, how bloody arrogant of them. I understand it's their right to decide what's best for their kid and I need to respect it but damn right I'm insulted and I will be thinking twice about inviting him along to anything else because I'll be subjected to their sneery judgement.

Following as I don't feel comfortable with the idea of letting my children do sleepovers in the future as well, so its good to see the ideas about how to address it.
FWIW my parents were very pro sleepover growing up, and would have said all the same things about how you have to assume the best in people and trust them and you'd know if they were dodgy etc etc
I was abused at a sleepover at age 12, my parents trusted the parents of the girl who invited me but it wasn't even at her house, it was a party at her friends house, with no parents present and we were the youngest. There was drinking, smoking, porn on the tv etc. I have never told my parents about it.
I was also touched inappropriately by a friends older brother whilst on a playdate with my mum in the house but we were all playing in the bedrooms upstairs.
When I was in primary school I went on sleepovers to friends houses who had tv's in their rooms and we watched some seriously inappropriate things for our age - with the internet now that can only be much worse.
It happens, and its not just sleepovers or adult men that cause the damage.

If you have dc and don't allow sleepovers at the age of 10 aren't you bothered that they'll feel excluded from their friendship group, all the excited chats before and after?

Aren't you worried that you aren't preparing them for school residentials or are they to miss out on those too because of parental anxiety?

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Well-Armored-Child-Parents-Preventing-Sexual/dp/1632990393

I have just ordered this book which comes highly recommended.

I think there is probably a balance to strike between limiting the situations your DD is put in, and increasing her awareness and defences. Where or what that balance is I don’t know.

I was sexually abused by a friends dad, only ever happened in the day though.
During sleepovers the mum was in bed next to him, the house was quiet and there were other girls in room with me so he never tried anything.

I can understand this but I do think you are being a bit over sensitive.

Punishing the child because of his parents decisions, the background of which you know nothing about. Your post is horrible and doesn't sound like you respect their decision at all. It's not about you or your family. It's about the parents of yours sons friend who have every right to make this decision without justifying themselves.

I have been made aware of the too many cases of abuse (due to my work) to not understand why OP is categorically against sleepovers. Only allowing them with „family friends“ / people one really trusts isn’t necessarily the solution either.

uncles, friends of parents etc. are statistically very likely to be perpetrators. I do not know what the solution is. But restricting a child to sleepovers with „trusted families“ definitely isn’t.

I suspect that children need to be aware of the dangers. So if OP‘s DD is to understand the dangers, she’s (perhaps) also too you to have a sleepover.

but I am not an expert. These kinds of questions have however been something I’ve been wrestling with now that my fiancé and I have decided to TTC.

I‘m an attorney (and primarily practice family and criminal law. Not in the UK, as one can probably quite easily tell). And I’ve just seen too much to just trust people.