People who drop out of life

[Dappy777]

Over the last week or so I've had two separate conversations about people who've 'dropped out' of life – no job, no friends, no interest in anything.

Last night, for example, I went for a meal with a family friend who was telling us about his youngest brother. He is 30, lives with their mum, and has no life at all. He has no job, no relationship, no hobbies and very few friends. He spends all day in the flat eating takeaways and drinking, then sleeps most of the afternoon, wakes up around 8pm and sits up all night playing video games. He's never been abroad, and never even been to London (he lives in north Essex).

I had a similar chat on Christmas Day. A neighbour told me about his brother and how he's "given up on life" (as my neighbour put it). Doesn't work, date, socialize, pursue hobbies, nothing.

It isn't so much the not dating or not working that puzzles me. Plenty of people don't want a serious relationship, or kids, or even a job. I can even understand not socialising (I'm a bit of an introvert myself). What I find so puzzling is the lack of interest in life/being alive – you know, just going for a walk on a spring morning, or swimming in the sea, or looking at the stars. Is it depression do you think? I know of quite a few people like this – young people who play video games, smoke weed, and seem to have opted out of the world. I don't know if it's my imagination, but it seems to be more common. Is it just me?

The problem is that the vast majority can't fund these lifestyles, unless they happen to be lotto winners. They are a constant burden on either elderly parents, or the taxpayer.

I read that one.

I wish I'd made different choices. I love my child but I'd have saved myself so much heartache if I'd have cut him out of my life sooner. Even being a single parent from the start.

I could have easily quit work and lived a small life on benefits with my child and it took a lot of fight to keep my job and eventually change jobs to be able to survive week by week. Life is not always easy. And TBH with WFH I quite often drop DC off at nursery and take to bed for the day with my laptop 😅 But I knew, if I dropped out of work (with an under 2, so UC would have covered me without sanctions) I would have found it incredibly difficult to get back into work, as the career I've made for myself is very niche, and actually got more niche... There's probably 30 people doing my job over the country 😂

But I could have quit. With the PTSD and the arguments and fighting with work it would have been so easy to do so. I had so many breakdowns, counselling, sleepless nights. Living hour by hour at times. Applying for any job that was childcare hours (not common at all in my industry, so was applying out as well) Putting up with colleagues who would trigger me and when I left they would follow me and set me off even more.

For me personally I know that I would struggle far more having time off and starting again from the bottom than I would just keeping on trucking on, no matter how difficult.

I really do feel sorry for the people who never had a chance to experience really living life and I do blame parents who are happy to let their adult children do absolutely nothing (for no good reason) I get that ND people can struggle, but playing games through the night and sleeping through the day is no good for anybody really. DC is very young and autistic so it's hard to see the future. If she cannot work, I do expect her to participate in family life if she lives with me.

You can't trust people you bump into in your day to day life, so don't allow them to be in a position in which they can cause harm. Remember that for most people (but not all, of course), probably the only people who truly care and that you can trust is your own family.

@shuggles that may be your experience, but (sadly) for many, many people their family are the least safe people in their lives, for a variety of reasons.

A lot of People don’t understand or realise how disabling anxiety is. I do.

Sending a hug ❤️

Well done for doing what you do and have done.. Determination 💪 not to quit when the going gets tough!

OP I think you need to remember that some people have mental health issue/are neurodivergent.

People who struggle with social anxiety, noisy and crowded environment will likely have to restrict their social interaction.

I have had a lot of trauma in my life starting in childhood and long term issues with depression, low self-esteem, body dysmorphia and I am neurodivergent.

I prefer my own company as I have been badly let down by too many people and have no wish to form romantic relationships.

I still have hobbies that take me out of the house but I prefer to work from home and I rarely socialise. I enjoy tending to my garden and my pets and focus on my interest in painting and craft which I can do from home.

I don't compare myself to others and I am happy with a quiet, peaceful life mostly on my own.

I really wish that people would understand that not everyone wants to have a very extrovert and social life.

Also more broadly, mental health and social services have been so badly funded for years that it now takes forever to access support, counselling or to be diagnosed correctly, so many people never get the help that could help them manage their condition better.

I have one very reclusive retired friend who is now part of the gaming community and very happy at home in her bubble. As Tony Hancock, she has friends all over the world (if not knowing anyone down her street).

I encouraged my disabled sister to get “an infernal device” because I knew that in her rural retirement, she might end up isolated. I would say that it has become her window on the world and she is a lot happier.

I know it might be different and less positive for some people who are struggling with mental health issues or who are neurodiverse, but from the outside, the world of both of them would look very small.
I think it isn't, it's just a different way of being.

I have a relative who is like this - lives with his parents, never goes out, no relationships. He does have a full-time job though.

I suspect undiagnosed autism but it was Covid and enforced wfh that precipitated the crisis. Until then, he was doing ok - went into the office every day, went shopping, lived by himself, had something of a social life with bowling and pub trips with work mates.

The effect of extended enforced isolation due to repeated lockdowns coupled with not having strong enough local friendships to have people to call on to say "let's go for a coffee" (many men are incredibly reluctant to admit their need for company) led to such severe anxiety, depression and other mental health issues that he had to move home to his parents and still doesn't live independently. He's a perfectly nice guy and does help around the house somewhat and pay rent. It is frustrating for his family that he still doesn't feel able to take steps toward living a fuller life again, but on the other hand his experiences during Covid were really quite bad and he hasn't really received any proper treatment for his issues. This is an adult who has panic attacks whenever he goes outside.

Are there any statistics to back up that claim? If not, I think that could be seen as scare-mongering.

Only anecdata, not actual data, but the two people I know who are living the kind of isolated lives described in the OP have both, from what I can see, chosen this lifestyle. My cousin used to work and used to quite enjoy working. Then he got hooked on the internet, stopped taking the Metformin that he'd used for years to control his diabetes and, once he'd developed periperhal neuropathy and kidney damage, claimed sickness and other benefits and now gets PIP and council tax credit and other social and financial support that enables him to stay home and 'live' online.

A friend of mine has a flat in a HA block and is woken most nights by the mysterious man who lives upstairs and plays video games all night. Apparently he used to work as a postman and was well-liked by neighbours, but got more and more obsessed with gaming, ended up being sacked because of absence from work and hasn't been seen for several years. Someone seems to visit most weeks to bring bags of food and take away bags of rubbish. No idea if it's a family member or someone from social services.

The internet has, I'm sure, something to do with this. Someone I've known for years (not someone anyone who knew her would have said was ND) got involved with someone in the ND community and is now self-identifying as ND, ASD and various other things. Suddenly everything is too much for her: her work (which she's managed for years and been successful in), her old friends, real life — everything overwhelms her. I realise that this will sound controversial, but it's as if she's joined a cult and the people she's socialising with online are encouraging her to cut herself off from normal sources of support.

There are people with medical issues which make daily life a struggle.

But there are also many entitled leeches who will expect others to fund them doing exactly what they want to do.

Grown men playing video games all day, only eating takeaway, abusing their parents so they are "scared to upset him" yet won't see a doctor, or offer to clean the house or make any attempt to help themselves? And then people are told you can't judge them because you know 'depression'. No some are abusive bullies and deserve all the judgement they get.

Have these depressed leeches tried the fucking numerous options that are all spelled out online that might help, sunlight, walking, vegetables? ADs from the GP? You don't need a GCSE for this.

Occasionally I meet one of these leeches who can manage to struggle to the pub and they think they are brilliant. Mum making dinner back home (you're a grown, using the term loosely, man). I don't know because they have abused their Mum to still do their laundry and buy their toothpaste (so a lower female because they are of course above basic domestic chores) they think they are winning at life because they don't have to work for the man. They are cruel and boring.

Why can't you judge these awful humans?
Because their feelings might be hurt?

There is a gulf of a difference between being supportive of someone who is trying to overcome whatever challenges they are dealt and enabling a lazy, deadbeat freeloader.

Very good comment.
I'm jealous of your lifestyle! 😊
Would add again, there's nothing wrong with realising that we didn't choose to be here, someone else did. I don't live this life described by the OP, but planning something similar in the future. Fortunately, I will have the funds to do so.
If given a choice before born, I probably tell my parents not to bother (only a bit of a joke).

My uncle probably falls into this category. As long as I've known him, he hasn't worked. Apparently he tried his hand at a few jobs when he was younger, but he didn't really stick at anything. He didn't marry or have kids and continued to live with his mother (still lives in that same house). He did marry late in life and his wife moved in with him and his mother. His wife worked but has now retired. He never learnt to drive - he lives in a city, so there are lots of transport options. I don't think he ever travelled abroad. He didn't grow up with computer games, so he wouldn't have been a gamer. I suspect he spent a lot of time in the pub/bookies, but I don't think he drinks now.

I didn't really think about it too deeply as a kid - he was just my uncle. It was only as I became an adult myself that I questioned it (mulled it over in my mind). My sister reckons he might be neurodivergent.

I guess my Granny could have thrown him out, but what would that have achieved? He'd probably have ended up homeless. I'm sure she would have liked to see him find a steady job, get married, have kids etc. But since that didn't happen, she was probably happy to have a bit of company in the house and someone to do maintenance jobs and painting/decorating etc. And he and his wife cared for her as she got older and more infirm. They got the messages and cleaned the house etc.

I know someone (through work) who doesn't have many friends. I think she got a bit left behind when her friends grew up and got married and moved away and had kids. She has mental health issues - seems to suffer from anxiety/depression. She only moved out of the family home because her family helped her to buy an apartment and insisted she move into it. If they hadn't pushed her, I don't believe she would have moved out. She worked (with difficulty) but she's retired now and I suspect she doesn't go many places or meet up with friends much. Because she doesn't have many friends. I do what I can, but I don't live near her and I work full-time myself.

A young family member is about to leave her job. She's on the spectrum. She struggled with school and was badly bullied. She managed to get a minimum wage job and hold it down for a while, but is no longer coping. There's been a suicide attempt a long the way. Her mental health and safety is far more important than any societal expectations.

People aren't robots. These three people are just snaphots. Some people have addictions. Some people have mental health issues. Some people are ND. Some people are more robust than others.

And watch the suicide rate increase?

@PreferMyAnimals So now we're throwing emotional blackmail into the mix? Fund my lifestyle or I'll commit suicide?

I don't think that we should be assigning mental illnesses to people who haven't been diagnosed. SOME may have a SEVERE mental illness which needs to be formally diagnosed and addressed. However, many are just lazy fuckers who would rather stay at home and play games than get a job. Of course they're depressed if they choose to shut themselves in a room and not engage with society. It's a downward spiral. Enabling them to stay at home and rot in a room playing video games isn't the solution.

Enabling plays a part I should think. Encouraging a child to think of a future that will interest them is important. One of my children didn’t seem interested in anything much when she was at school so I was worried that she would end up doing nothing. I supported her in applying for an apprenticeship, she did well and now, some years later is fully independent and a home owner. Not sure what would have happened if I’d left her to her own devices and she might have still been living at home in her thirties as the op’s examples.

Most people are basically good. There are obviously arseholes, but just don't deal with those.

This is very NAMALT. We cannot tell who's good. Some people pretend really well. Men and women. It's safer not to deal with people too much when you've had decades of bullying and abuse in different forms. I'm tired of guessing and being wrong too often, personally.

I had a very good career and recently retired. I did loads and loads of voluntary work when I was employed, was always busy working, and even won some career awards. I also was bullied by colleagues off and on throughout the years. And then I retired a few months ago, and all this activity just stopped. I am leaving the voluntary roles because I figured after 15 years of it, someone else’s turn. I’m not inclined at the moment to be out and about so much and am enjoying being at home pottering around. I’m not taking benefits for this lifestyle, never had benefits in my life. My best guess is I am high functioning autistic, had to mask a lot for my career, at the end was getting burnt out and now can just be me. My sleep is better, I feel physically better, and no more anxiety and thoughts about what I have to get done.

People might say I’ve failed at retirement because I’m not on cruises, or babysitting grandchildren (no DC for me), or taking classes, or joining groups, etc. But I’m happy being with DH, having a few friends, taking a walk or two, and just being on my own when he is at work. I never realised how much psychic energy it was taking for me to be dealing with people all the time and am frankly amazed I was able to sustain it for so long. I get now how it is for ND folks who couldn’t sustain masking and their retreat from society.

Father didn’t do any birthing…

Things haven’t changed that much from 1950 - women still do most of the child rearing too!!!

TF is that supposed to mean?

It's tricky with enabling, I think that some parents do enable as a quick fix but others are are well intentioned but don't know what to do. I think me and my parents just assumed that as long as I found a job and joined some groups a life of my own would naturally follow, none of us really knew what to do when this didn't happen.

100+ years ago, you had to get everything you needed from other human beings - all your needs were met by human beings - as well as basic needs like food and shelter, things like entertainment, culture etc. required that you interact socially. You had to get out and be around people. Human relationships were important - the lubricant of civilisation. If you didnt work, you didnt eat so not working wasnt an option. There was no welfare state until 1948. You had to be a productive member of society in some capacity.

Now you can get everything from a computer. You don't need to leave the house. You dont need to socially interact or develop the skills to form relationships with other human beings outside of your own family and you can even dispense with some of those. The result is that human relationships are not valued as they once were. Now there is a phenomenon whereby people no longer wish to interact with other people and completely lack the skills to do so. They are essentially unemployable. They only survive because they are being enabled by indulgent parents.

Added to which, their bodies are effed up from sleeping in the day and staying up all night. No exercise and crappy eating habits. Of course you're going to wind up with a mental health problem - because thats what happens when you override essential biological and physiological needs by staying up all night - month in month, year in year out. Its a recipe for major depression and degenerative disease. There's a reason why chronic sleep deprivation and circadian rhythm disruption causes you to feel depressed and even suicidal - and why they use it as a form of torture. You're basically signalling to your body you're not fit for purpose. There are going to be more and more people living like this thanks to the tech. Many will die prematurely unless they radically alter the way they live.

That there’s no bluebird of happiness in ACatNamedRobin‘s* *heart.

For good reason, it seems?

Because she ate it?

You're right that my comment was opinion and I didn't make this clear. I take your point about scare-mongering. However, your examples both sound like they're addicted to something. I'm not sure that this is exactly "choice". Actually, I think "choice" is a bit of a red herring. I think there's something wrong if a person is "choosing" to live like this.
Also, I hope you're not implying that your cousin deliberately injured himself to claim PIP?

Yes there is a percentage who have mental health problems. However for the most part.....Isn't it a lot to do with gaming ? & parents just letting young adults get on with skiving off to their bedrooms &/or smoking weed, where they interact with strangers