If you want your kids to feel comfortable in middle & upper class environments now & when older what would you do to help them?

[Treetops11]

My parents instilled an inferiority complex in me when I was young. We lived in an undesirable estate & they always spoke about people getting ideas above their station , referred to people as "the lawyers son", "doctors daughter " etc... opportunities were never for people like us.

I now have my own kids 13, 11 & 8 , I never want them feeling lesser. We are comfortable but I always feel embarrassed in
middle class company as if I'm an imposter.

How can I equip my kids to fit in anywhere with all walks of life? It truely is an amazing skill to have.

Build self esteem, confidence and basic indicators such as good manners, cleanliness etc. Ensure they have basic skills like cycling, swimming that they can socialise through. Teach them to debate issues calmly, and respect others' opinions.

Introduce them to as many environments as possible, local theatre, local art centre, sports, cooking etc. And encourage reading widely.

The idea is that they should always be able to find something in common with others and put them at their ease.

All the people pouring scorn on the OP and giving trite little pieces of advice just don't get it. They haven't grown up being told certain things weren't for the likes of us, or hearing comments about certain things being la-di-dah, or being told not to get above your station and that the middle/upper classes were the enemy.

My parents were both from very ordinary working class backgrounds and were the first in either family to have any sort of post-16 education. Met at teacher training college, first people in either family to own property or have professional jobs. My sibling and I were definitely brought up thinking some things were not for us. Even though I got top grades at school there was no question of applying to Glasgow/Edinburgh/Durham/Oxbridge - our "sort" of people most definitely did not go to that sort of university. Friendships were discouraged with kids whose parents were felt to be "posh". It can be subtle or not so subtle and it has taken me a long time to shake off the feeling and realise that I have every right to be places as other people.

So what can you do about it. It's more about telling your kids that they absolutely do belong anywhere rather than dripping poison about how it's not for them. Let them see you enjoying nice things or going to museums/gallery/ballet/opera or other pursuits - nothing off limits. No friendships discouraged. Aim high, no careers or hobbies out of reach because we consider it "not for us". It's not about the money, it's about the attitude.

Teach them manners, decency, honesty, how to eat at a table and to never be ashamed of where they come from.

That's my advice to parents, regardless of class.

I personally find MC obsession with "culture" just another type of consumerism which is typical of MC.

True artists are rarely MC because being MC is essentially about propriety in a broad sense (look at the vast number of comments about manners! 😂 ) and you cannot really be creative if you constantly think about "norms" and "rules" and where exactly you stand as a pillar of society 😂

So it's all very well for sinking lower middle classes to clutch at "culture" as the last straw of their social differentiation, but I'm not too sure it will ultimately work.

I also find it really weird how MN cultural capital is always reduced to "art galleries and museums" .

There are so many different ways to be interested into the world, whether it's a particular sport, or reading prolifically. If you are really desperate for your children to be social climbers it doesnt have to mean endless Saturdays in art galleries unless that's your thing*

I competed at a high level in a sport that is notoriously middle /upper class for instance. But some of the best people in it were definitely not from those backgrounds but we all got along whatever our background because of a real love for the sport.

*I actually do love art, and opera. But i go to galleries and operas because that's enjoyable to me, not to perform being middle class

I've found things like lamda have helped my DD with confidence talking to people

Manners. Know how to use a knife and fork and wait to eat until the host starts.

And while I do not approve of this one learn how to speak without any working class twang. It shouldn't but it affects how others judge you.

Also teach your kids money isn't all that is success. Being kind and honest and fair typically don't lead to loads of money from career choices. And being a good parent is valuable.

My well off middle class relative died not so long ago. They would have thought they were better than the carers who came in to help in the last days. I made sure my kids knew those people were fucking saints and had a very hard and emotional job just as valuable as the well paid jobs of the people they care for

Most of that seems to describe being poor, it’s hardly a class thing. Lots of working class people aren’t living in straitened circumstances.

But it was ingrained in them because by the time they were born I was 99% proficient in Middle Class-dom.

They have only ever known those stereotypical middle class signifiers and mores.

I grew up with a 'similar but different' scenario, where my very politically active parents toed a relentless 'we, the proletariat' line, and so ruled out lots of things which only 'middle class toffs' would do, say or like. Quite good humoured, but definitely with a 'they don't know they're born' kind of inverted snobbery vibe. They were working class and both accessed education through evening classes, adult education and unions. We had friends and neighbours with more MC backgrounds and professions with whom we socialised a lot as they shared similar political leanings, and I never felt out of place or 'less', but that may have something to do with the fact that there was a deeply felt connection through values, and, as we were -by UK standards‐ pretty far left, also decidedly anti-materialist. For my parents, education, sobriety, atheism and definitely what would now be termed cultural capital, were the tools with which workers would inhabit all of society's spaces and wage a subtler kind of class war. As a result, I feel comfortable anywhere and with anyone.

DP would be the first to describe his upbringing as 'trailer trash'; dirt poor and almost entirely disengaged from societal norms for a variety of reasons. He's unapologetically 'unpolished' and this has the slightly uncomfortable effect of endearing him immensely to many of his very posh clients who enjoy his company in a weird 'diamond in the rough / My Fair Lady' kind of way. Our DC are growing up with a solid class analysis and as their schools straddle boundaries of sink estates and £1mk leafy burbs, they have friends everywhere.

If it’s a thing in your head it will be a thing for them. Just let them be themselves.

Good manners in the old sense (as in making the oeople around you feel comfortable), being interested in other people and have something to say for yourself. But don't ram your opinions down people's necks. Smile, listen and contribute to whatever scenario you are in. Have interests in life. Be supportive of yourself. Then you can hold your own in any situation with whoever you meet as people will want to engage with you. I do think a good education is also handy but not essential if you didn't have that opportunity.

Just work on mannérs, kindness and empathy and don't fixate on class, it's outdated

Interesting thread

Atheism excludes you from the church so you wouldn't be able to wage class war in all spaces )

What exactly are they practicing for? Inauthentic people are rarely happy for long periods of time. pages of solid advice? Should we teach our children that the norm is for someone else to decide if they are an equal?

I grew up in a council estate and went to a school that wasnt any better. I rember being out one night and had missed my friends so joined another girl who had been stood up.
At the end of the night i asked if anyone was going my way and wanted to share a taxi. A guy asked where i was going and he looked at me and said" do we look as if we come from there".
I vowed no one would ever make my children feel the way i did that night.
We bought a flat in a nice area, sold it and bought a house in a really nice area and had a son who we sent to private school.
From then on all the inferior feelings i had just disappeared. We had the right address and our children went to the right school.
My son was into sports and competed for our country, he is now a multi millionaire. My daughter went to a top drama school. Both have been accepted and also my husband and I. I doubt any of them realise that both DH and I came from our background. Really nice people dont judge.
Before anyone says it, this is not a boast, im proud of everything we have achieved and it was done by hard work and study.

Totally agree with you. A classic like Kate or Henry & all the names you mention will help rather than hinder them.

Get really good at skiing. Or riding. Preferably both.

@Treetops11

getting them reading versus staring at screens

@Frowningprovidence anyone making anyone feel uncomfortable about a fish knife isn’t truly well bred ;)

surely they should be socialising and mixing with peers in a social setting instead of screens?

It's being adept at social interactions, the ability to express yourself and exchange ideas with others that gets you on in life.

UMC is quite different to MC but the best way to feel confident in most situations is to have money.

Elocution lessons! (I know accent shouldn’t matter but it can feel like it does).