Apple Martin’s debut into society

[Iwanttoliveiniriscottage]

What do people think about this. I can’t believe it’s still a thing in our modern society. Being presented to society in a debutante ball. How very antiquated.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-14148249/Apple-Martin-Debutante-Ball-Chris-Gwyneth-Paltrow-Paris.html

Apple appears to be one of the worst examples of a nepo baby from what is coming out in the press - a spoiled brat. I also hate that dress with the black bow. Looks tacky.

Do keep up @Lallydallydune and follow the conversation. I did, and in response to "Americans have their own shindigs" of which I have no doubt. But I bet GP prob wet her knickers when she got that invite.

Sophia Money-Coutts in the telegraph has written a very very funny piece on it all. And pretty much says what I have below,
But better.

www.telegraph.co.uk/columnists/2024/09/07/debutante-balls/

Its Easy to see the problems in other culture's behaviour.

British people don't have a great reputation round the world either.

Our reputation in general; is that we are rude, arrogant, cold and that we think that we are better than everyone else.

That's not what we are debating. We're talking about why slebs and the wealthy from around the world are chucking their daughters into a circus that QE2 stopped in the 50s because she deemed it vastly inappropriate then! And it's 2025 now.

I think a good rule of thumb is that, if celebrities are at an event that involves them posing for photos, it’s a work event 🤷‍♀️

Thank you for explaining the global nature of the internet and Mumsnet demographics. I've been here since 2007 so I'm good thanks.

Not sure why that merited a snarky reply. You seemed surprised by someone American being on here. I answered your question in good faith, but if you want to be rude in response, fair enough.

Apple’s lips look diseased … or been in an accident.

If this “look” is deliberate, and paid for, it’s seriously unfortunate.

Wow, that's not my experience at all, I have found British people very welcoming. I'm not British FWIW. Born and bred elsewhere in Europe.

Yes of course, loads of English (i should have specified English not British), people are amazing and lovely.

However the reputation of English people round Europe, is not great.

I don't know how stereotypes start and stick.

But, the negative stereotype about Americans is that they are loud, brash and overly confident.

And the negative stereotype about English people, is that they are rude, cold, unfeeling and think they are better than everyone else

Those stereotypes are definitely out there. I'm sure we have all heard them.

I thought the British reputation was that we have bad teeth and drink lots of tea 😆

It's a completely different kind of circus.

It's not the debs presented to Court circus of London of yesteryear.

For starters, it's not held in London, and it's not restricted to members of the British aaristocracy.

You're seeing it the wrong way - the prism of the old style British debutantes and the sort of society the Queen rightly decided was outmoded is not relevant here. The line between aristocracy/ royalty and celebrity/ wealth is now completely blurred.

It's a night out with charitable contributions expected, where wealthy young women wear couture frocks and mix and mingle with other very rich and self-promoting young people, not the old-style debutante presentation of the British Court, and the parents are not "chucking their daughters" at anything. The young women who attend are well used to their public appearances being papped and to promoting themselves on social media, which is what the Bal is about.

Yikes!

You're really resisting the idea that you've got this all wrong, aren't you?

I wasn't born in the US, and I'm not American, but I've lived there for a few decades, which is why I know a lot more about America and Americans than you do.

The American social whirl exists without any reference to what is generally considered either very quaint (British) or very chic but inexplicably and suspiciously socialist (French/ Italian/ Scandinavian) societies and their norms.

Hence occasions like the Met Gala, but also big dos and galas in pretty much every city that boasts an art museum or a children's hospital or a conservatory of music or an opera house, ballet, or orchestra, etc - a lot of cities, in other words. Off the top of my head, I can think of at least eight gala events coming up over the winter in the city where I live, all of which offer the chance to wine and dine and dance the night away in the company of locally and nationally known luminaries if you care to fork over the price of a ticket.

Here's what's going on in Dallas this Autumn:
dallas.culturemap.com/news/society/dallas-galas-crystal-cattle-two/

A 'power lunch' in NYC that raised $1.5m for meals on wheels:
www.newyorksocialdiary.com/citymeals-on-wheels-raised-1-5-million-at-its-37th-annual-power-lunch/

'Young Professionals' opportunities for networking/ organising events in Chicago:
better.net/money/career/11-best-young-professionals-groups-in-chicago/

Various charity galas around the US:
better.net/philanthropy/get-involved/the-biggest-charity-galas-to-attend-all-year-round-2/

Obviously that's just a snapshot, involving only charity galas, and only a few cities.

Half British Apple Martin will probably spend her next ten years attending parties, galas, launch parties, society weddings, and other events where there are photographers. The Bal is one event among hundreds she'll clock up, the vast majority of which will be in the US, and she'll meet the same jet set crowd she danced with at the Bal at many events. As noted, she's off to a good start by pledging Kappa Kappa Gamma.

I don’t feel this quote got enough appreciation yesterday

Our late dear Queen abolished the presentation of Debutantes at court. I agree with her.

Cringeworthy in the extreme.

She isn't exactly a natural in front of the camera.

Well, unless Princess Margarets comments were the actual truth 😀

The optics are shocking. I expect she will look back on this and cringe. What were her parents thinking of? I don’t give a Cox’s Pippin for any of it.

Le Bal des Débutantes is trying (and failing) to be the coming out ball of the globalised élite.

Some of the media coverage is little more than bullying now. Looking at you, DM.

I know these things still go on, but I was shocked to see Chris Martin and Gywneth Paltrow there, two celebs who advocate equality, promoting everyone and avoiding elitism.

totally their call of course, but just doesn’t sit right with me.

Nah, it's a genius idea - you flatter people's sense of their own importance and validate their notion that they have superior genes by making a heavily publicized charity event 'invitation only' and make the criteria for an invitation known. The young women must be wealthy, intelligent, wealthy, good-looking, wealthy...did I mention wealthy?

So a lot of people want in on this and are prepared to cut a hefty cheque to support whatever charity the Bal is in aid of.

Tragic.

And there I was thinking the in thing was a great granny from Ireland... at least since the point in time when having an Irish ancestor wasn't going to be held against you in the US. Even Barack Obama visited an ancestral home in Tipperary when he visited.

It's interesting that you mention the Mayflower as a point of pride. It definitely is, but not because of the links to England that would be clear to anyone who knew their English history as well as their American. For Americans, tracing your ancestors to the Mayflower means you trace your ancestors to the dawning hours of American greatness. There is no English context to references to the Mayflower in the ancestry of prominent Americans.

Apart from all that, I think she’s a beautiful girl!