Young, British and Anti Abortion.

[TooBigForMyBoots]

I was half watching it last night and intend to watch properly later. The guy they featured was a misogynistic Incel type.

Did anyone else see it?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m00256p2

Wanting the best for people doesn’t excuse you the damage you cause.

Having grown up in pre-abortion Ireland, I can look you dead in the eye and say You have no clue what you are doing.

The self-satisfied good intentions you credit yourself with, as put into Irish law, were a scourge on society.

I have never needed an abortion, and your views are repugnant to me.

I am against abortion, for myself.

I believe anyone else who wants one, for any reason at any time, should be able to have one. They should be very accessible.

These people against abortions for others are ridiculous.

I've witnessed the bruised and broken bodies of children who weren't really wanted, how much worse will that be if some mothers are forced to have children they already know they don't want?

The mythical 'awful' woman who uses multiple abortions as contraception is often brought up. Based on their 'moral' standards, what type of mother do they think she would be if she was forced to have children?

Obviously for the vast majority of women it just isn't the right time, man or circumstance.

You don't care about women though. Abortion bans result in women like me dying of sepsis. I had a MMC of a very much wanted baby that needed surgical management. That is, an abortion. Nobody is having abortion for fun.

You're medically a bit wrong here. It's exactly the same procedure. This is why women are now dying in the states. And have previously died in other countries with bans.

I've always thought "if you're anti-arborion, don't have one" and that's you and your views catered for. What you don't have the right to do is impose YOUR views on other women and what they do with their bodies.

I never used the word murder: I used killed for a reason.

In both miscarriage and abortion, an individual human being dies.

We can say this and still say access is necessary for XYZ reasons in our society.

What I genuinely wonder with the pro life position is what would they propose we do for the extra unwanted children that would be born if we had abortion bans. Outcomes for looked after children are still really poor and access to child mental health services is also difficult. Would pro life group also want to campaign for more investment for this very disadvantaged section of society? It doesn't seem to be the case with US groups from what I can see.

I think it's easy to say you are anti abortion... until you are in one of those impossible situations were your own life is at risk or your baby has been diagnosed with a condition like Edwards syndrome. Or the family that is already on the bred line, living in sub standard housing not able to care for the DC already there and parents with multiple health problems.

I can't understand the cruelty of people who are against abortion.

@flagondry think again, be pro choice and anti abortion for yourself.
Keep your hands off other womens bodies!

I can’t see the anti abortion movement gaining traction in less religious countries like the UK or Australia because the belief that life starts at conception is connected with religion, particularly Catholicism. They are against IVF for similar reasons.

And many religious groups only became very anti abortion fairly recently. I have a memory of a conservative religious church in the 1980s asking a teenager to have an abortion, because the father of the baby was an older married man in the church with kids and it was considered to be bad if she had the baby. I would bet that same church is now anti abortion because everyone is a product of their environment and beliefs change with time.

I’m so sorry you went through this, and FWIW, you did the right, kindest thing for that baby. That’s being a good parent. Never, ever feel you didn’t do right by that child. 💐

They always avoid the rape question

Anti-abortionists always reveal their true agenda when it comes to what happens to that innocent life once it’s in the world.

They bang on and on and ONNNN about caring about “innocent lives” yet the Republican/right wing/Christian nationalist terrorist movement rant constantly about cutting benefits/child support etc.

They don’t give two shits about life, only control.

If they’re were truly “pro-LIFE” they’d support mothers in choosing to keep a child. Clothe it, feed it, educate it.

But nope, once it’s popped out, both the child and mother are a burden. Sperm donors get off Scott free but mum must exist in eternal penance.

Any pro-lifer who isn’t actively campaigning for increased CMS and support should hang their heads in shame because they are hypocrites spreading nothing in the world but misery. Pathetic.

I don't think it answers it, no. How can anyone think it is right to force a woman to go through pregnancy and birth when she doesn't want to? I had severe hyperemesis when pregnant. It was hard enough getting through it when I wanted my baby (and I wanted her so much, that's how I got through it). If I was raped and then forced to go through a pregnancy I would want to kill myself.

If ‘pro life’ campaigners also campaigned equally enthusiastically for abolishing guns, ending war and getting rid of the death penalty in all countries, I would have a bit more respect for them.

I was against abortion for myself too, until I needed one after finding out that my pregnancy was likely to result in a severe disability. As I live in Ireland I had to have 3 counselling appointments before getting an abortion. As I was over the 12 weeks by this time I then had to travel to the uk. It was the worst experience of my life and I cried all the way there . When I got to the uk I discovered that I had miscarried anyway, the pregnancy obviously was not viable. Honestly Ireland still has a long way to come when it comes to abortion. It sickens me so much that in my own country they wanted to force me to go through with a pregnancy which I didn’t want to. I’ll never forget the shock. I never thought I would ever need an abortion until it happened to me.

Christian and pro-life groups donate quite a lot to charity?

I’m really not sure where this characterization comes from.

I think pro-lifers are hopelessly naive and misguided, but they do donate plenty to charity.

Not to charities that support women in this situation though. They also have a tendency (not all of them) to support political parties that remove state funded support.
There's a huge difference between supporting CAFOD and SPUC and actually supporting women with babies.

“Good intentioned people who want what is best for women and children”? Such arrogance. You want what YOU think is best for women and children. Does it not occur to you that actually, women know what is best for them, far more than any stranger does?
I am and always will be, pro choice. The shaming of women for exercising their right to choose is despicable.

We have WIC in America and it’s very uncontroversial, covers all mothers and babies.

Most churches have food pantries and day care options for families, these are run entirely on donations from their congregations.

I grew up in a ‘church-y’ part of America so know a little of what I speak, these are just really lazy stereotypes.

And of course they’ll always vote Republican. Do you think they’ll vote
for the party that parks an abortion bus outside the convention? Honestly hilarious.

You need to understand your enemy tbh

I agree with you.

I'm so sorry for your loss. I think women making the best decision they possibly can given the circumstances are always justified.

When I said I'm against abortion for myself, it isn't for religious or moral reasons, it is that I have conditions that made having dc hard, so had to go through a lot of miscarriages. So personally i wouldnt have one because of a timing issue for example.

This thread has made me reconsider saying 'I wouldnt personally' though. I was basing that off my miscarriages.

But if it was to spare my baby a brief or very painful life like some of the brave women on this thread, then I believe I would have one in that circumstance.

All well and good until you think about the alternative - forcing women to do something with their body that they don't want to. How can any woman be pro that? You seriously think it's OK to put the 'needs' of a barely developed fetus before those of a fully functioning adult, who has a fully developed brain and their own ideas, beliefs, wants and needs?

The forced birthers are playing the long game like they did in the USA. I have noticed quite a lot of anti abortion posts on here in the last few years. Often starting as a seemingly innocent question about reducing the time limits.

As what has happened in the US shows, women’s rights to abortion are not a given. Don’t give these misogynistic men and their handmaids the time of day or engage in polite debate. They want to destroy our rights and give no fucks about actual living women and children.

A surprising number of young men were anti abortion in Ireland and NI. I was pretty shocked when some of my friends views came out during the referendum and the push to bring UK law to NI. Some accepted that the majority of women in their life supported the legislative changes and so voted with them or didn’t vote. That was obviously stemming from indoctrination and frankly never really having to deal with the impact directly.

Exactly this.

In some circumstances I don't think debating is appropriate. You either agree with female bodily autonomy or not, and allowing discussions which involve removing that for women should be shut down. There is no debate.