How to break bad news - 11+

[GoodIsGoodEnough]

My DC hasn't scored high enough to get into grammar. It was always going to be a long shot with much less tutoring than their peers, but I am still sad for them.

Any advice on how to tell them the news would be appreciated.

Do I give them their real score which is about 30 marks off, or do I say their score was closer (say 10 marks off)?

I hate that at 10 they're going to not feel "good enough". I never wanted the 11+, they got wind of it and wanted to do it. I feel like I've let them down.

I didn't go to grammar and I've read all the stories of people going to comps and doing well, which I'm sure she will, but just looking for some advice on how to handle this immediate situation today.

Don't do this! It's a huge lie and a con and they will blame you whichever way it goes!

I can't believe people would lie to their kids about this! Life is full of setbacks and disappointments. It's your attitude going in and coming out of struggles and the support you give and receive that counts.

Grammars are great btw for stretching the most able btw but I would rather be top of a comp than bottom of a grammar ability wise.

Those who scrape a pass in their 11 plus can really struggle to keep up and it knocks their confidence ime.

By the way don’t blame yourself for not getting more tutoring as that is why it’s such a rotten unfair system in the first place!

If the others only made the degrade through intensive tutoring, how are they going to cope with 5/7 years there? What effects will it have on their mental health?

Gently, tuition wouldn't have changed 170 into 220. Tuition can nudge a 210 up to a tentative 220, or a 220 into a secure 230, but it can't work miracles. The test is designed to be "un-tutorable". There's ways around that and tips and tricks to boost a score, but it's essentially an IQ test with extras.

that should read DONT lie 😅

I think it depends how you framed it from day one.
With DD we were very much look, give this a try and see what happens but if you don't get a place you will go here instead so its fine.
If you have built it up then its going to be really hard to manage now but you could emphasise that it was just 1 day and there are so many variables that its not a reflection of him and his abilities. There are really bright kids who are outperformed by less bright kids on the 11+ purely due to exam technique and the luck of questions on the day. DD did really well but the child who scored the highest from her school wasn't one of the top academic kids but she worked really hard on past papers and knew the exam inside and out. There were several DC much more academic than that child who did worse in the exam.
Its a flawed system

Don't lie but make sure she feels like she has done enough.

Both my girls go to grammers and there’s real pros/ cons to them.

does your daughter want to be given more homework and have less help with the work? Does she like doing dry activities or does she prefer it when the teacher makes it fun?

the kids who are happy at grammar answer yes to the more homework/ less help/ dry and fast schooling of grammar but LOADS of kids would HATE that.

sell it to your daughter as a check on the style of school she’d best enjoy.

Haha! Did I touch a nerve? Bingo!

Absolutely don’t do this. It’s not a ‘harmless white lie’ and may well need you to construct even bigger lies going forward. If the child or their friends find out, it’s going to harm their confidence, harm their relationship with you and potentially embarrass them with their friend also.

Far better to tell the truth. Don't make it feel like a big deal (I know it may be to you) but explain that grammars are highly competitive, select children on a very narrow criteria and many come from independent schools where they actually have classes in verbal reasoning to pass the 11+. And explain that is it’s NOT in any way a reflection on your daughters potential in life. Also perhaps explain that most places in the country have moved on from this outdated system. Reassure her that she’s so loved, valued and can indeed go on to achieve great things, with her own talents and unique abilities. Tell her how proud you are.

Sorry OP. When my daughter was younger, we lived in an 11 plus area and she was so distressed by the whole 11+ carnival, I withdrew her from the process. I really get the dilemma and sending love. It often seems like such a cruel and divisive process.

If it’s any consolation, one of my relatives worked at one of the top grammars in the country. It had so many unhappy, stressed and pressured kids and self harming was a huge problem.

I agree wholeheartedly with everybody who is saying tell the truth as it builds up resilience. We can’t shield our children from everything, it is a part of growing up. I’m sure if you spoke to some of the most successful people in the world they would tell you that they didn’t go to a grammar a school. This is not the end of the world.

Don't tell her the wrong mark, say you didn't quite get it, but don't say you got 200 if she got 183.

Yes, I’ve never understood the argument that you can tutor a child to pass an exam way beyond their natural ability! If they have the ability to grasp certain concepts well enough to pass the test, then they have that ability! Who wouldn’t benefit from familiarity with the types of questions they will face, knowledge about how to approach them, and the confidence that this gives?

There is nothing that tutors do that can’t be done at home. You don’t have to go to a driving instructor before taking your driving test, and some people probably don’t. Most do, though, because it’s useful to know the test routes and have some professional input.

I have always framed the test as being not a test to see how clever someone is, or a predictor of how well you'll do in life, but a test to see which school will suit you the best and help you get to where you're meant to be. It's not better or worse to go to one school than the other. It's not better or worse to be academic and get a high score in the test. It's no guarantor of happiness or contentment or even success.

She did her best. She worked hard. She'll take those skills into her new school, which will be the right place for her. And that's exactly what the test is designed to do. So this is a win.

(Obviously I know in the real world this isn't always the case, but it's how it should be, and I think it's a useful way of framing it for children.)

This is really excellent advice, do this

Also re: tutoring: as an ex-teacher, I'm very much of the opinion that tutoring and hot-housing your kids into achieving beyond their natural ability does them no favours – they just end up struggling in a school that's too academic for them rather than flourishing in a school that's more tailored to their skillset.

Telling them they have passed is not a harmless white lie! They will need to be ready for being streamed when they get to secondary school so a lie will not help.

I feel the best way to explain the result to a 10/11yr old is to keep it simple, but factual.

I would start by congratulating the DC on the score and then explain there is no pass/fail mark on 11+ tests. However, there are limited numbers of places available at each school and their chance of securing a place depends on how other candidates did in tests. You do not know this and would know for sure only in March. There is no point thinking about it now, as this is out of your or DC's control.

You will find DC are more resilient than you think they are and they will stop fretting. However, same cannot be said about us parents!

Additionally... My child got a lower score than anyone was expecting. The schools lowest accepted score for within catchment area was 216 last year, but by the start of term they had sent offers to applicants with 200. There is very often a lot of movement between allocation day and close of Continuing Interest round 2 (end of July) and then some grammar schools keep applicants on their CI list till December. Therefor, our two top choices will remain grammar schools.

For anyone feeling a bit deflated by results it’s important to remember that grammar schools aren’t always the ‘golden ticket’. I live in an area that borders a grammar school area so a handful of children choose to take the 11+. Anecdotally, of the few children I know that went to the grammars they’ve not been a great success for them socially, perhaps partly as their catchments are much bigger? Obviously you get children that are unhappy in comps too but I know more than one set of parents who have deliberated about moving them out of the grammar school as their DC weren’t particularly happy there. Anyway, it’s interesting to see that of those i know the children haven’t wanted to stay in at the grammars for 6th form instead preferring the local comp, perhaps they are fed up of the extra travel? Ultimately sometimes children may prefer the comps.

Mine ‘failed’ their 11+, I told them they were close but hadn’t quite made it in (which was true). They had missed a section in their paper so knew this was likely. I just said I was proud of them for trying and we had a good local option with less travel so all would work out in the end.

ended up doing brilliantly at local state, top marks, found new talents we didn’t know about, additional challenges the grammar school wasn’t set up to cope with, got a top private school place fully funded for sixth form and is now on course for a first class degree in one of the worlds best unis for their subject. They only say good things about their secondary years.

We also made a very big thing of rewarding the sustained monumental effort that my child put in. The result is not rewarded here.

One of my DC’s set the tone very early, when we were considering the 11+ or not.
Very sensibly he said
“If I get this number of marks( over the pass mark) , I will go to this school as it will be the right school for me….and if I get this number of marks (less than the pass mark) I will go to this school, because that is the right school for me”

No tutoring, no mention of pass or fail. He ended up in the right school for him.

Thank you for taking time to say this. We did practice at home before the test, and I did wonder how do some kids "get tutored" as its mainly logic based tests. But I always find a way to blame myself.
My child is bright but his concentration levels are very much up and down due to autism.

DD is in year 5 and considering taking the test - a bit hesitant because we're not sure that she actually wants to go to grammar school. There are two she'd be looking at and one is particularly difficult to get into.

We are already discussing that she can put the work in but that it's not worth it if she has to work so hard that she loses out on other things, and if she doesn't get in, it's nt a sign that she's not good at school but that there were more children in her year group who are more inclined to this type of education.

Admittedly, it helps that the local non selective schools are excellent and she has a preference for one in particular.

So if she takes the test, and doesn't get in, I am not worried. I guess the only thing that would be a worry is if she flames out spectacularly, but that would involve a different conversation entirely.