Do you judge/ pity converts to Islam?

[Candyapplesandhearts]

Firstly I’m a convert to Islam. White European, so more than likely if you saw me you’d assume I was a convert, plus my name would definitely give the game away.

i live in a metropolitan area where converts are yes rare but not too too share whereby it’s shocking.

well keeping this in mind, I bought a block of sessions for a beauty treatment, and the aesthetician was visibly taken back by me firstly, fine it happens because I wasn’t what she was expecting, with my name and I show up in a headscarf.

but the questions, not only were they pretty inappropriate but also steeped in judgment. I was shocked. I could tell that she wasn’t necessarily being malicious or even hateful, but she clearly had a very pre conceived notion about my motivations and my choices. Ie several questions about my husband and how he made me convert, or as she said ‘become Islamic’, lots on clothing and how she often feels sorry for a lot of Muslim women.

truthfully MN, is this a thing? Deep down are these thoughts people have but maybe don’t voice.

in general even at work I do have questions asked but they are more diplomatically phrased- so now I’m wondering am I actually being judged/ pitied?

We're getting different views here from different posters. What is it about covering that gives you identity, which being a muslim itself doesn't give you? Genuinely interested.

I have no idea what you are arguing about then. You seem to suggest that it is worthy of judgement that women freely choose to wear a hijab because some people are not allowed to make that choice, and then go on to say that there is compulsion within the religion that takes away their choices. Perhaps for the benefit of the thread you could summarise your point.

Presumably in 600AD, Arab men didn't habitually wear head coverings that were in close proximity to secondary sexual characteristics that would conveniently hide them.

They are expected to be modest though, and not leer at women. Which is a good thing in my opinion.

I really hate to cite Wiki as a source, but it seems easiest and fastest. It's the Carvaka school of Hinduism, admittedly mostly forgotten. You can then read up more on it using the sources here. It's low on ritual and rules, high on rationalism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charvaka

There is a fair bit of scientific enquiry in conventional Hinduism, but it has been overshadowed by pointless ritual, casteism, and sexism, which is why I have drifted away from rigid conventional practice. I don't really believe in a holy book I have to live by , or rules made by men thousands of years ago. However, I am intrigued by the principle of Vedanta, which finds its parallels in modern quantum physics! I plan to read more about it. It's not easy reading!

Modesty. Men aren't valued on their purity in the same way women are.

As PP said it is an outward identifier of my faith, a reminder if you will, it allows others to know I am a Muslim woman

thats the primary objective of the verse that talks about women covering that they may be known as believing women

Your last sentence brings me back to whether a head covering is actually really a
choice for muslim women, once they begin to live a muslim life (adopting a muslim life through choice or otherwise).

As for identifying you as a muslim, why do you (or others of any religion) even feel the need to do that?

And therein lies another issue...😔

I'm not sure why you're confused tbh.

But that's the same with all Abrahamic faiths, not just Islam.

I was wondering that.

Walking down the street, why do you need an outward identifier? Can't you just go about your business.

Honestly most people in a big city either don't care or just briefly feel a bit bad for you.

That's about it.

Indeed.

Because it's impossible to follow your arguments over multiple posts over multiple pages interspersed with many one sentence replies. But never mind. Perhaps mumsnet will implement Gen AI to make summaries easier for us one day.

Other posters are managing fine.

As I shared above, I believe it is a requirement of our religion to cover, as a result we are identifiable as Muslims. It isnt a rule I came up with by myself. It makes sense to me though and I have no issues wearing it.

And it isn't a rule that all Muslims subscribe to. Certainly not all British-born Muslims.

You've decided that for yourself, or maybe your family has.

Either way my point stands.

Good for them! I am clearly an imbecile. Perhaps you could humour me....

its a reminder to myself as well, of how I should carry myself the standards I must adhere to etc.

but on the recognised part I’d say maybe for the same reasons that a Christian may wear a cross.

theres also the point that Muslims are meant to be like one big family so it’s nice to be able to recognise my brothers and sisters and have them recognise me

They may not subscribe to it, this is true. This will be for a variety of reasons. Im not sure what you mean by ‘you’ve decided that for yourself.’ I would be interested to hear from any imam/scholar/sheikh who deems it unnecessary to wear hijab. I dont see that your point does still stand.

As far as I’m aware there’s only a few like Tarj hargey and then western Muslim academics from the likes of the Deen institute

Tell us more about this. I follow the word of god as sent to prophet Muhammad pbuh through Angel Gabriel as well as the examples he gave and authentic hadith. Slavery was rife pre Islam and during that period. Muslims gave suggestions to free slaves, treat those that you have with kindness etc. There is a lot of reading that can be done on this subject from a historical perspective.

its a reminder to myself as well, of how I should carry myself the standards I must adhere to etc.

Why do you need to wear something specific to remind yourself how you should behave? If you were considering snapping at a waiter, pushing in front at a check out queue, dropping your litter on the ground etc etc, would wearing a hijab be the thing that reminded you of the most appropriate and human response?

Precisely and I’m not going to be following advice from Tarj Hargey.

those aren’t quite the examples of behaviour im referring to, as they constitute good manners (although that’s a key point to being a Muslim) I think it’s a bit larger, it’s by wearing the scarf I am a representative figure of Islam (which we’ve learned to be true from this thread where several posters have met a Muslim once and based a life time of bias and prejudice from their actions). It’s how I must conduct myself with the opposite sex, the places I visit, the language I use (naturally am I swearer) all of these things. To try my best to show tolerance and understanding and basically not rise to the bait when people try to under mine me and my faith etc