Can the parents reach closure with this?

[mids2019]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw4448xx4keo

Horrible tragedy but the driver was completely innocent having had an epileptic seizure with none previously occuring. The problem seems to be the parents can't accept this. Should they have been advised against not making a statement as it will probably exacerbate the huge guilt felt by the driver for no reason.

Some remarkably stupid and ill informed statements here.

The parents will find out more at the inquest as has been said many times but the conspiracy nutters aren't interested in facts.

About a year ago a colleague walked into work and had a seizure within 5 mins of walking in the door. Thinking about it now in the last 5ish minutes of their drive they would have passed 3 schools and numerous kids walking to school because of the time of day. He had never had a seizure before, later he said that that morning he felt weirdly tired but he had a toddler and a young baby so put it down to that as most of us would. He was about 40 at the time and hasn't had another since. If he had have had his seizure 10 minutes earlier who knows what could have happened.

Things like this happen often it was just an awful set of events, where she happened to be driving, that everyone was outside. It's awful for everyone involved but I don't see how you can charge someone for having a medical emergency.

@TheWayTheLightFalls what makes you think she is particularly wealthy? That car on lease is going to be around £600 a month after tax, not out the reach of many middle class working people. If it's a company car even cheaper.

If she was so wealthy and so well connected to fake medical evidence do you not think she would have faked mechanical evidence so she didn't get a year driving ban?

No, those aren't the optics you were referring to. You were referring to being white and a woman. That's what "made you suspicious". If you're going to "own it" then own it, say it with your full chest. Don't backtrack.

"carefully worded to avoid even a hint of culpability"

"using her financial clout to get away scot free"

Culpability? Scott free? What are you talking about?

It was a medical emergency. It could've happened to anyone. She wasn't to blame and couldn't possibly have predicted it so what culpability are you hoping for? What repercussions are you after? I have a feeling from your previous posts that I know exactly why you're so spitefully implying that she deserves further punishment and completely disregarding the poor woman's health issues. So yeah, I stand by my judgement of you.

This is what I'm thinking, it's natural for someone to seek the best legal support they can afford.
I'm dirt poor (and have no need for legal advice or support thankfully) but it's so obvious isn't it? It's not in the least bit suspicious of her.

Maybe tomorrow morning I’ll wake up and declare that I blacked out and don’t recall typing anything I said on this page due to sudden onset epilepsy. I presume you’ll suddenly be full of sympathy for my plight eh?

I maintain that it would be naive bordering on stupid to pretend that her sex, wealth and race haven’t played a part in how this has all worked out. And that’s speaking as a high earning white-passing woman with a posh car, fwiw - I’m not going out of my way to attack this woman, only, afaics, pointing out the blindingly obvious.

Of course @TheWayTheLightFalls if you're examined by medical professionals who confirm that you've had a seizure that caused black out typing, I'll forgive you for your utter ignorance.

The only thing bordering on stupidity is you maintaining that your racism and sexism is acceptable.
And the fact that you think you know better than the medical professionals who examined her ..actually you've crossed that border and are well into the shameful land of pig ignorance.

You know what they say about opinions @HerbertHoover .

"I’m not going out of my way to attack this woman, only, afaics, pointing out the blindingly obvious."

Also this is absolutely ridiculous. What happened to owning your words? You absolutely have gone out of your way to attack this poor woman. You outright called her a liar. You accused her of faking a medical emergency to get away with murder and using money to pay lawyers to get out of it. You've admitted that you're suspicious of her because of the "optics" of being white and a woman.

You know what's bad optics? Being a sexist and a racist in 2024. Imagine that. Are you devolving?

This woman needs to be left alone. The Daily Mail have published pictures of her now. It’s becoming a witch hunt.

Yet again I am convinced there is no justice in this world.
She wasn't disqualified, she voluntarily gave in her licence for a year which would have been seen in her favour.
A quick internet search and a chat with a Dr friend confirms is it's not always possible to detect a seizure afterwards.
Money can buy a lot - and these people are tough, sure she will occasionally remember but will move on with her life - unfortunately the parents won't.

Save the sympathy for the parents.

It's such an awful tragedy.

I feel for the parents. It's normal to,want to,find someone or so,etching to,blame, but sadly in this situation it really was a tragic accident. Whilst the cause is known, there in no one to blame,

And the poor driver too. She must feel wretched.

It's scary. Our friend had a seizure behind the wheel. He had never had one, or anything vaguely similar or concerning previously. It just occurred a few minutes after leaving our house. Dh was in the passenger seat and a friend in the back. Dh had to stop the car by using his hands to press the brake in the footwell. And our friend had to lean over the seats to try to steer. Luckily they were there and able to prevent the car from veering into a wall or into the pavement and houses on the other side.

Had it happened 15 minutes later he;d have been in his own and on a motorway. An hour later and he'd have need in a motorway with his young child in the back.

He had two further incidents in the following months and was eventually put on medication. It's been many years now and, whilst in medication, he has never had any further issues and he is now able to drive again.

White woman in ££££ vehicle crashes into school killing two, outcome is that it’s a never-before experienced epileptic fit that she has no recollection of at all. It may be a legitimate and tragic accident but the optics make me suspicious.

Our friend is a while man, fairly wealthy. Luckily his episode didn't result in tragic results.
His was also a never before experienced SEIZURE.
Whilst dh and our other friend can recollect every second, even years in, he still has no memory of it, or a for a fair while before or after.

There is no reason why this woman's medical issue isn't legitimate.

Even wealthy white people can have their first medical issue in later life and in unexpected circumstances.

On what basis?
There was no negligence.
There was no intent.
There was no intended dangerous driving.

She had a medical episode at the wheel of her car, having no previous medical issue beforehand.

Should none of us ever drive just incase?

Because that's basically what you are suggesting.

The optics of hiring a mercenary and expensive law firm and issuing a statement that was so carefully worded to avoid even a hint of culpability so that no one could ever come after her.

So you wouldn't, if in her unfortunate and scary position, not employ the very best solicitors and barristers that you could afford? Really?

Because, I am quite sure, 99% of the population would be ensuring they had the very best legal team that they could afford working for them in such a situation.

A quick internet search and a chat with a Dr friend confirms is it's not always possible to detect a seizure afterwards.

But in this case it presumably was possible to detect it, given that the CPS was satisfied.

Culpability for the deaths of these children. I don’t believe she had any sort of fit; I think it’s far more likely that she simply lost control of her powerful car, with devastating consequences, and then used the considerable means at her disposal to avoid prosecution.

Ah - an armchair sleuth.
You know, based in social media and the red tops, much better than all the medical staff, legal teams on both sides, independent medical advisors, judges, etc what happened.

Of course you do. 🙄

Multiple neurological specialists gave evidence apparently. Do you really think she bought them all off @GlassHeart1 ? That they don't have reputations to maintain? That they didn't have to provide MRI or CAT scan evidence in order to satisfy the CPS?

Your take on this is bizarre.

You never get closure after the death of your child.
I post on here every year urging parents to make sure their children learn some basic first aid before they go to university. I have to live with the fact that some very basic first aid would have saved my child, had the person with him known what to do. The what ifs are in my head every day.
My heart breaks for those parents. I know they will live with the pain and grief for the rest of their lives. I imagine the driver will feel the guilt for the rest of her life too.

@endofthelinefinally I’m so very sorry for your loss. My DS is off to uni this autumn and you have just prompted me to sign him up for a first aid course. I will encourage him to suggest it to his friends too. Thank you.

I'm local and know some of the people involved.
The talk locally is that the drivers family have employed v expensive and aggressive lawyers from day 1. The police have not had the resources to fully investigate and fear they will not get a conviction with the shit hot lawyers. The talk locally is that she was on her phone.

People at the scene doubt the seizure story as the driver was conscious immediately after impact and got out of the car etc. They say no signs of seizure aftermath/ drowsiness etc. Driver was seen at hospital and discharged immediately, fit for interview with police. Again not really compatible with seizure.
Driver willingly relinquishes her driving licence (would have to anyway with the seizure story). CPS and police resources are stretched. All of a sudden it's not worthwhile pursuing a prosecution. The public interest is that she is off the road.

The 'talk locally' sounds like bullshit and it's dreadful that you're repeating it.

For the 'talk' to be true, medical professionals would have had to have lied and scans would have had to have been falsified. That's extremely unlikely.

Driver was seen at hospital and discharged immediately, fit for interview with police. Again not really compatible with seizure.

Our friend was discharged quickly from hospital.
Infact he turned up in a taxi at our house to collect his car keys.
The hospital hadn't even told him he couldn't drive.
We were utterly shocked at that.

Fortunately his partner, and also later his ex wife when he went to collect their child, were adamant he could not drive. His partner made him go to his GP the next day and that was when things were properly investigated.

Remember 'local talk' is simply rumour and gossip, not fact.

Hmmm. Lets unpick this shall we

You know 'some of the people involved'

So thats the woman herself, or the parents of the children. They are the people involved so who do you know out of those?

You say you are relying on 'talk locally', who is that then?

Expensive and aggressive lawyers - do you work in the courts/law/police? I think you (and everyone else who keeps using the ridiculous narrative) dont understand that this is what solicitors are like, the solicitors for the families will also be 'expensive and aggressive'.

The police and CPS have spent months and months investigating information which they will have sought out in order to bring prosecution, they dont seek out information to conclude no charge, they actively angle their investigations to try to find culpability. However, unless we want police corruption like the old days, they will put their findings to the CPS who decide whether there is a case to answer. In this case there is no evidence of culpability.

Name your source of who saw her get out of the car perfectly fit and well, being that you're so comfortable with bandying this information around on a public forum