Is Reform as bad as the BNP?

[Silviasilvertoes]

Off the back of another thread, how does Reform compare to the BNP? I loathe Farage and haven’t taken much notice of his manifesto (contract!) as I don’t want his nonsense in my head, but DM keeps telling me what’s ‘good’ about him. She has previous form for voting UKIP and thinking Johnson was much maligned and a generally nice chap. She reads the Heil every day, so I generally let discussions about politics go over my head otherwise I’d lose my cool.

It really is laughable isn't it? And the fishermen fell for it hook, line and sinker (no pun intended), despite the fact that 40% of the fish that are favourite in the UK coming from foreign waters that they would no longer have access to. And then that there would be additional red tape on the fish they did catch to export.

I have a modicum of sympathy that the deal that was eventually signed further screwed things for them, but this is balanced by the fact that they should have looked at the facts more closely in advance.

This is a shame. It's one of the most deprived areas in the UK and you know he's going to screw them over.

@cupcaske123 That's an interesting argument. Lots of deprived constituencies elect Labour MPs for decades with stonking majorities. And guess what, they're still deprived.

His position on the Fisheries Committee should have meant he would understand extremely well the issues with exporting that the UK industry would experience as a third country, but he never mentioned any of that. I wonder if there are any parallels to be drawn with his current ‘contract’? Just for example, how utterly impossible it is to send the small boats back to France?

Can you give an example of a Labour MP that doesn't turn up to the job and has to pay back thousands in mismanaged funds? Or one that want to take away rights from the vulnerable people in their constituency such as the disabled? What about one proposing billions in cuts to public services to a severely deprived area after over a decade of austerity?

This stuff really matters because there’s a difference in saying things that some people think are offensive or wrong, which is what Farage says he’s doing, and outright lying, which is what Farage is often actually doing.

This. And also Parliamentary debates in the UK and EU are televised and recorded so voters - the ones who ostensibly hold the politicians accountable - can see what they’re saying and their demeanour while doing so. No show, no accountability.

Farage lying? What do you mean? He says he's going to take the asylum seekers back to France. France haven't actually agreed to this but what's consent amongst friends?

Societies with greater equality have less crime and we were returning more failed asylum seekers pre-Brexit. So by your logic you should give your vote to an economically leftwing party that wants to rejoin the EU.

JurassicClark · Today 06:36
BNP in tweed

Indeed. Nothing new. Mosley, Edward VIII, etc.

Jaywick in Clacton is the most deprived area of the country. It has voted Tory for decades.

I think the whole concept of "kicking out illegals" is an interesting one. By definition, they are illegal, so we don't know they're here, or where they are, otherwise, they would have a different status, i.e. asylum seekers, economic migrants etc.

Has anyone said how they intend to locate all these "illegals", how they're going to kick them out, and where they are going to kick them out to?

If anything, it’s worse, having many identically bad qualities but primarily being a vehicle for Farage’s grift.

They can promise anything as they won’t be held to account as they’ll not get in power. Don’t forget the £350m on the side of the bus and Farage has never been held to account for Brexit. Their reasonable policies about limiting immigration are also unrealistic as the Conservatives promised to “stop the boats” and yet have been unable to as the issues are so complex.

If you haven't "got over it yet" there's a problem. It is now 8 years ago. You cannot change what happened. People on here keep saying that, thread after thread. I have no idea what your situation is, or if you are an activist of any kind, but thinking about practical solutions is possibly better.
Focusing with regret on something you can't change is pointless.

We are all living with the consequences of it. I don't see why we have to "get over it"

So who would you say?

Biden, who seems to be increasingly unable to keep awake in summit meetings? The Chinese One Party leader? Macron? no, wait, he’s had to call an election because he’s been trounced in the French Euro vote. Cyril Ramaphosa, no, he’s been effectively rejected by his electorate as well. How about Khamenei of Iran, although his view on women and gays might give you a bit of a pause. Netanyahu hardly counts as human being on this forum, so he’s out. I don’t know who currently claims to be the ‘leader ‘ of Hamas, but that’s aren’t really players on the world stage anyway (; yet). Trudeau 🤥? Midi. Hmmm he’s got a reduced majority, and there are some problems with extreme Hinduism. The Saudi King ?

Suu Kyi might have fitted the bill, but the Guardian turned against her because of the Rohingya……

The Pope? Maybe a bit anti contraception and anti abortion for some tastes.

Can you name the Swedish Prime minister? Or the current New Zealand ?

There are a poor bunch to choose from, really. I’m interested in your nomination.

Because it stops people moving on. Just moaning or feeling upset over the result does nothing.
"I'll never get over it" just sounds very helpless. Perhaps become a campaigner or an activist, join the Lib Dem party, whatever, but this keeps appearing on these threads and I find it a bit pointless really.
I agree it's been an utter mess, but sadly we can't turn back time.

Modi, obviously, I apologise for my insular spell check.

Giles Watling is the MP for Clacton. He's a Tory. They're still one of the most deprived areas in the UK.

You can’t turn back time which is why we need to move towards rejoining. Which win’s happen if nobody is talking about it. That’s not ‘not getting over it’ it’s solving a problem which is currently negatively affecting the country.

Very good points, @Allthegoodnamesarechosen . Just out of interest, is there a world leader you rate well?
It's given me food for thought!

If I were a politician standing for election in a democracy and my opinion on this mattered, I wouldn’t choose a dictator as my model for leadership.

A lot of democracies are in crisis right now. It’s scary stuff.

Errrr I'm going to go for someone who currently has an arrest warrant out on them for war crimes and crimes against humanity. I admire someone who knows how to torture their citizens and rid them of basic human rights.

An interesting selection to put forward.