Lord help me, a child with no manners is around for a sleepover

[Rainallnight]

Good friend of DD is over on a sleepover. Both going on 8. There hasn’t been a single please or thank you from the friend. I am probably being unreasonable (hence not posting in AIBU!) but I find it very grating and it’s going to get on my nerves all the through.

Just needed to get that off my chest!

Also as a child of immigrants I would say that this comes across as really arrogant. In Britain its the norm to show politeness in this way and its not at all hard to .

I don't have children yet but would also be another in the camp of saying to said child "in this house we say please and thank you"

How lovely your DD reminded her about manners

This is why I do not allow my kids on sleepovers.

You've deemed her rude. You'll now start correcting her behaviour. All evening. If you're not happy, call her parent and ask her to be picked up.

I just couldn't get upset over it, do your kids thank you when you give them their dinner? If not why would they think to thank someone else's mum? What is the child asking that requires a please? How many times does a child have a need to say please and thank you to their 8 year old friends parent? I can only think of if they ask for a drink.

What exactly are you expecting them to say please and thankyou for? If it's when you give them treats that they don't say thank you and you don't think they appreciate it then just don't give them any, any more.

Why not just avoid putting her in a position where a please or thank you is required if it grates so much? Or do you think she needs to ask politely to do everything ie go toilet, get down from the table, go out to play....As long as they're not rude I just couldn't get upset about children not being little robots who can't just choose what to do themselves but have been trained into politely asking if they can do anything and everything.

I knew a child who had to say 'please may I' before he did anything otherwise he was hit with a wooden spoon. Wonderful parenting.

My children do, yes. They are in their 30s, admittedly. I didn't achieve this by hitting them with a wooden spoon, simply by modelling the behaviour myself. I thank my Mum for the meals she prepares for me.

I hope you bought own brands and have never had that ill mannered child back into your house.

Yes, this is definitely a thing. Some languages, the politeness is in the use of the word 'you' where there are formal and informal conjugations. In Spanish, people would fall about laughing if you said 'would you mind passing me the salt, please'. It's just 'give me salt' which is obviously rude to us.

do your kids thank you when you give them their dinner?

Of course they do!

Manners are about being generally empathic, considerate, and respectful.

Was that lost written by the child themselves or their parent?

But English people are known for being polite and having good manners.
Our language enables this.
We use "Would you mind passing the salt?" and it's perfectly natural. We don't have to grunt or be blunt towards each other. We don't need to. It feels wrong.

I remember being secretly very annoyed in my teens when my American friend would say 'sure' in response to an offer of food or drink . It always felt as though they thought they were doing me a favour. I knew I was being an arse but I couldn't help being irked

This is a really weird response - surely the more obvious thing to do is to teach your kids to have nice manners/be pleasant guests, rather than have them lose out on the experience of sleepovers?

Yes, this is definitely a thing. Some languages, the politeness is in the use of the word 'you' where there are formal and informal conjugations. In Spanish, people would fall about laughing if you said 'would you mind passing me the salt, please'. It's just 'give me salt' which is obviously rude to us.

That's because the Spanish way of conversing/word for thank you is different. No Spanish people are bursting out laughing if someone says 'can I have the salt please' in English.

Please and thank you are some of the first words anyone learns in English, along with simple sentences and greetings.

If you were in a country and they didn't do shaking hands or bear hugs, or they greeted in some other way, you'd adapt your behaviour accordingly.

Honestly, some people are just rude and don't care how they're perceived. It's not an immigrant thing or even a language thing

One of my DCs had some very rude twin friends. They asked me what was for dinner. I told them and they said "we're not having that, we had it yesterday". I bluntly told them it was that or nothing. They were rude about all sorts of things so they weren't invited again.

It’s hard isn’t it. We had a child come over - best friends with my son and I’m best friends with his mum.

yet it was STILL awkward because we realised he wasn’t a hand washer after wees or poos and his hands actually smelt sweaty and unclean.

(all the times this family have been struck down with a vomiting bug suddenly made sense. They’re by far the most vomity family at school)

I had to do a nice cheery “right boys, time to wash our hands before pizza”

and “right boys! Time to wash our hands after playing in the garden”

He was good as gold about it but omg it was so awkward! 😬

The child. He’s a teenager now and has turned out lovely. He was probably going through a cheeky phase.
Yes it was a bit rude but no children are perfect I guess 😬

Its not the main reason I do not allow sleepovers. Safety is my main concern. I have no issues when they are older teens and can hopefully set boundaries/message me to collect them.

I don't really get why sleepovers are such a big thing anyway. My kids still see their friends and have lots of fun.

Oh this annoys me too, and for exactly the same reason! Same as ‘OK’ as a response to being offered food or drink. You’re not doing me a favour by agreeing to have a cup of tea.

I think it’s ok to not say please every time, as long as your tone is polite. I do say probably say thank you considerably more than is necessary though…

In terms of culture, it’s usual to fit in with the norms of your host, whether you’re a guest in someone’s house or an immigrant.

I lived in a non-tourist part of the US for a while and I soon learned that “please may I have…?” marked me out in shops and restaurants as a non-local. And in a way that was more telling to locals than my English accent. I soon adapted to “can I get…?” in shops or restaurants, but never quite got over feeling rude when I did. And the number of queries along the lines of “you’re not from round these parts are you?” dropped off considerably when I used local phrasing and vocabulary. Eg saying “I appreciate it” instead of thank you.

Parents do their kids no favours if they don’t prepare them for life outside the home and this is one of those areas that is easy to overlook as some kids pick it up naturally whereas others need to learn and practice.

No, but can you please accept that Britain is multicultural and these (to an immigrant) are subtleties that can take years if not decades to register properly. In some people's eyes an immigrant is never good enough unless they confirm to the British standard in every possible way. How many Brits are there living in Spain who can't be bothered to learn Spanish at all, let alone its nuances.

Omg not having manners is not an immigrant thing!

If we're taking about cultures, at least be specific. Immigrants are not one mass of people, and plenty manage to learn a new language (if they don't already speak English fluently) and adapt to local norms.

What are good manners?

To me it’s about politeness in tone and actions. And showing gratitude I guess.

Stuff like no elbows on tables make no sense to me.

It’s fine to be irked; it’s taking it upon yourself to comment that’s rude.

Set expectations and stick with them. explain to the child you say please and thank you in your home and she will need to ensure she’s following them too

I have always corrected and said things like “thank you” and they’ve slowly learnt. I’ve been nice about it and when friends come round I always compliment their manners.