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Ukrainian house guest doesn't want to leave!

531 replies

reallyneedmoresleep · 20/04/2024 13:59

We've had a Ukrainian house guest for the last six months via the Homes for Ukraine scheme. When she came to live with us, we said it would be for a six month period and at the last welfare check we confirmed that she would need to move out by mid-May.
She doesn't want to leave. She has asked several times if she can stay, we have said no. She says our house is much nicer than where she can afford to move to.

I have visited estate agents with her who advise that to rent privately, she either needs a guarantor (we are not prepared to do this) or to pay six month's rent plus the deposit up front. She cannot afford this.

What do we do?

I know the situation in Ukraine is appallling and I am writing from a position of immense priveledge but we have found it really difficult having someone else in our home. She is not an easy person to be around, does not work, has refused all offers to be taken to support groups and frequently just hangs around us when we are in the house when we are trying to work or just to chill. Our son is home from uni in a couple of weeks and we need the room back.

There has been radio silence from the council Homes for Ukraine scheme.
How can I help her to move on?

OP posts:
Littlefish · 21/04/2024 23:36

@sidebirds - sorry, I mis tagged you.

Littlefish · 21/04/2024 23:37

@Thatsthewayitisnt

You're right. No one forced them to come. But if you stood at your window and watched Russian tanks roll into your town and begin shooting, as my guests did, do you think you might want to go somewhere where you knew your children would be safe?

Whether that's the UK, Poland, Germany or somewhere else, a little empathy from some people, including you, wouldn't hurt.

sidebirds · 22/04/2024 00:54

Littlefish · 21/04/2024 23:35

@sidebirds

You're right. No one forced them to come. But if you stood at your window and watched Russian tanks roll into your town and begin shooting, as my guests did, do you think you might want to go somewhere where you knew your children would be safe?

Whether that's the UK, Poland, Germany or somewhere else, a little empathy from some people, including you, wouldn't hurt.

you're replying to the wrong person 🤯

blueandsad · 22/04/2024 02:29

It is very striking that so many mumsnetters here seem to have been brainwashed by UKIP racism and anti-Ukraine xenophobia . . . . . echoing the way that The Daily Express / Mail rant about foringers and continuously fan hysteria about being overwhelmed by asylum and small boats . This discussion shows very little recognition , empathy or understanding of the appalling trauma , dislocation and confusion suffered by people fleeing a war ....and their extreme vulnerability ( Inevitably some of it is the result of direct or covert Russian operations in internet forums )

Alwaysdieting · 22/04/2024 05:00

How many people on here calling racist and Faragist have taken in a refugee? No one I guess. Stop calling people names just because people think different to you.

Sceptical123 · 22/04/2024 05:04

WinterMorn · 21/04/2024 15:17

We are over 2 years into this situation and we have avoided any use of nuclear weapons. Neither side has an appetite for that, for several different reasons. Anyway, if it ever did go that far, people having a bitch about Ukrainians going for Botox would be the least of all our worries.

I don’t think ppl have a problem with them coming to the U.K. or having botox, it’s the fact they’ve fled the country bc they feel their lives are in danger yet are returning to have non-urgent cosmetic surgery

VenusClapTrap · 22/04/2024 07:35

There are some really horrible posts on here.

notacooldad · 22/04/2024 08:11

This absolutely smacks of Pygmallion. You've removed this person from their own life (albeit very difficult and dangerous) to boost your own ego. You've shown them something 'better' and have completely displaced them in the process.
What do you mean by something better? A better life generally or better because of the war.

Thatsthewayitisnt · 22/04/2024 08:24

sidebirds · 22/04/2024 00:54

you're replying to the wrong person 🤯

I completely understand how terrifying the situation is/was for them. However if people from another country open their homes just out of kindness to them, another government is paying for them, the least they can do is behave with consideration. Offer to cook and help, look for work. Learn the language , not complain about this country or their host. There are many who do do that, and many who don’t.

Menomeno · 22/04/2024 08:28

Sceptical123 · 22/04/2024 05:04

I don’t think ppl have a problem with them coming to the U.K. or having botox, it’s the fact they’ve fled the country bc they feel their lives are in danger yet are returning to have non-urgent cosmetic surgery

As I said earlier in the thread, my guest has never been back to Ukraine since the war started, and gets very upset if it’s even suggested that she goes to visit her ailing elderly Mum. I know a large number of Ukrainians and none have been back for medical treatment or for cosmetic treatments. I know one lady who returned for a week to see her husband after a year here. She was scared, but madly in love and desperate to see him.

The problem is when people hear of some idiot going back for Botox, and then suddenly start spouting that Ukraine is safe and they all go back for Botox.

When you’ve listened to two young kids describing a raid, and how they hid in a wall cavity for three days while there were explosions, their whole apartment shaking like an earthquake, you might have a better understanding.

Our media has stopped reporting on Ukraine. They’ve got bored and moved on. It gives the impression that nothing is happening there now which couldn’t be further from the truth.

Beautiful3 · 22/04/2024 08:36

My daughters class mates from the Ukraine, went home for Christmas to visit family for the holidays. Either it's dangerous, or it's not?!

Menomeno · 22/04/2024 09:00

Beautiful3 · 22/04/2024 08:36

My daughters class mates from the Ukraine, went home for Christmas to visit family for the holidays. Either it's dangerous, or it's not?!

It’s a fucking big country. Some areas are extremely dangerous, some aren’t as dangerous. But even the ‘safe’ parts aren’t completely safe. People are taking risks to go back to see family (as I may do if I hadn’t seen my family for two years).

Kyiv is considered “safe”. In the past four weeks there have been numerous attacks on Kyiv and the surrounding area, a power plant destroyed, 17 people killed and many injured.

Lviv (near the Polish border) is regularly trotted out as perfectly safe, yet there have been about 25 attacks on Lviv since the war started, and people killed.

Just because people live in Kyiv or Lviv, or visited and haven’t been killed or maimed, doesn’t mean that these areas are safe. 11,000+ civilians have been killed in Ukraine since the war began, and the same number are missing.

Livinghappy · 22/04/2024 09:18

@Beautiful3 Russia's strategy is to cause fear by random and devastating attacks. Some people stayed in London during the war and died.

I genuinely don't know what I would do if the UK was in a similar position. London would be a target but at other times I'm sure other areas would be bombed. I can guarantee you, if the country was safe most people would want to return.

Icehockeyflowers · 22/04/2024 09:33

I think everyone knows that some Ukrainians never want to return to Ukraine permanently and have no intention of ever doing so
because they prefer life elsewhere.

Comedycook · 22/04/2024 09:37

Icehockeyflowers · 22/04/2024 09:33

I think everyone knows that some Ukrainians never want to return to Ukraine permanently and have no intention of ever doing so
because they prefer life elsewhere.

Putting the war aside, Ukraine is/was one of the poorest countries in Europe. Whenever a poor country has joined the EU we have seen huge numbers of people (especially young people) leave their country to come to richer EU countries. Of course many won't want to go back.

LondonPapa · 22/04/2024 09:42

BouncebackBetty · 21/04/2024 21:10

Nobody is shouting!

Just because you disagree with a post, you don't need to accuse them of shouting. Grow up!

Where did I disagree with you?

Icehockeyflowers · 22/04/2024 09:44

Comedycook · 22/04/2024 09:37

Putting the war aside, Ukraine is/was one of the poorest countries in Europe. Whenever a poor country has joined the EU we have seen huge numbers of people (especially young people) leave their country to come to richer EU countries. Of course many won't want to go back.

But then not under the guise of being afraid to return.

Go to other countries through the proper channels and pay their own way.

Plenty of Ukrainian men left too - it isn’t just women and children due to war.

IMO people have turned against Ukrainians because they aren’t ‘refugees’ and because they feel taken advantage of because they were taken advantage of..

It will be far harder to integrate into their new country when the tide has turned against them which seens to have happened.

WinterMorn · 22/04/2024 09:49

Sceptical123 · 22/04/2024 05:04

I don’t think ppl have a problem with them coming to the U.K. or having botox, it’s the fact they’ve fled the country bc they feel their lives are in danger yet are returning to have non-urgent cosmetic surgery

It’s quite obvious from this entire thread that a lot of people have a huge problem with Ukrainians (or “them”, by your choice of words) coming to the UK!

WinterMorn · 22/04/2024 09:51

Beautiful3 · 22/04/2024 08:36

My daughters class mates from the Ukraine, went home for Christmas to visit family for the holidays. Either it's dangerous, or it's not?!

That’s absolutely not the case, as MenoMeno states. Do you honestly think it’s that black and white?

WinterMorn · 22/04/2024 09:53

@LondonPapa there is no reasoning with that poster, even when like you, you are of the same mind.

Icehockeyflowers · 22/04/2024 09:54

It’s quite obvious from this entire thread that a lot of people have a huge problem with Ukrainians (or “them”, by your choice of words) coming to the UK

Why do you suppose that is?

WinterMorn · 22/04/2024 10:00

Well, you would have to ask them wouldn’t you? What’s quite clear is that there is some serious ‘othering’ going on.

Menomeno · 22/04/2024 10:15

Icehockeyflowers · 22/04/2024 09:33

I think everyone knows that some Ukrainians never want to return to Ukraine permanently and have no intention of ever doing so
because they prefer life elsewhere.

Our guests had a much better standard of living in Ukraine than they do here. Yes, wages were very low but so was the cost of living. She had a good job. They had a lovely apartment, holidays, the kids did loads of extra-curricular activities. Life was good.

Now she’s stuck in a mouldy flat on UC, while studying and learning English. Even once she gets her qualification she’ll still be on minimum wage and UC.

She’s been staggered by the state of our public services and the high cost of everything (although she’s very impressed with our schools). Believe me, the UK isn’t the pinnacle of aspiration that you seem to think it is.

namemane · 22/04/2024 10:28

We took on our guests because we felt it right. Payback into society time. our turn to do something rather than just talk about it.

Strangers had taken in my MIL and her brothers in WW2 when they, as pre 10 Year olds, were evacuated from London. Were they in mortal danger? Who knows but it only takes one bomb.

We had the space - being empty nesters. We should have downsized but covid, illness to two parents (and one death) put moving on the back burner.

It's worked well for us. Some of the stories - some true, some exaggerated, some spread by others, some fictional - are not typical of what I've heard from council support meetings. Not at all.

It was a gamble for both sides. We were roughly matched and had chats on zoom, initially with an interpreter from the charity. If it really hadn't worked, for either side, there were get outs. After a couple of months we said stay as long as you need. The inconveniences are far outweighed by the advantages.

For many I can understand the reluctance of letting strangers live in your house. In more rational moments it does seem odd!

We have 4 split over 3 generations. Grandmother has gone back for essential dental treatment - no NHS dentists near us, far too expensive to go private. Back in a week. Grandfather came over at Christmas. (Men under 65 generally not let out, he is 70) He looks after their other grandchildren back home.

Those coming are from a wide selection of Ukrainian society. Rich, poor, all but European to those more Russian in their upbringing, fluent English speakers to those who struggle, those who want a fresh start to those yearning to go back, those who have been bombed out to those who are, understandably, scared of being bombed and were 'safe'

All have come here like rabbits blinded by headlights with just a few suitcases with a life, relations, houses, pets, and cars left behind.

Sadly they're seen to be a few Faragian comments - what about British people etc Others complaining about botox trips etc as if every refugee is going back for a lip plump.
I think they are all living under a degree of stress. All are in our house except the toddler - she left Ukraine when 4 months old for a year in Poland and then us.

Some will complain. It's been quite hard, frustrating and time consuming working with various government bodies, schools etc. The easiest was Cubs - 'come along tonight'. There are some who'd always like more - we see many English people like this.

How are they supposed to behave? It's a bit like when someone is off sick from work - are they allowed to go out of the house, smile, see others etc. We for our part are trying to help the children have as normal an upbringing as possible.

In my other, unrelated, unpaid work I mostly see those on Universal Credit. Some might, with help, return to work but the majority can't/won't.
I'm minded that there but for the Grace of God go many, if not all, of us. A couple of ill-informed decisions, illness, infirmity.

I think a few posters on here need a period quiet reflection and think how they might like to be treated should they fall on hard times or if their country is suddenly at war.

Icehockeyflowers · 22/04/2024 10:31

WinterMorn · 22/04/2024 10:00

Well, you would have to ask them wouldn’t you? What’s quite clear is that there is some serious ‘othering’ going on.

When talking about a particular group of people how do you suggest people refer to them other than ‘they’?

I can understand why people have a problem with Ukranians. I’m
surprised you don’t seem to have a clue why this might be though?

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