Ukrainian house guest doesn't want to leave!

[reallyneedmoresleep]

We've had a Ukrainian house guest for the last six months via the Homes for Ukraine scheme. When she came to live with us, we said it would be for a six month period and at the last welfare check we confirmed that she would need to move out by mid-May.
She doesn't want to leave. She has asked several times if she can stay, we have said no. She says our house is much nicer than where she can afford to move to.

I have visited estate agents with her who advise that to rent privately, she either needs a guarantor (we are not prepared to do this) or to pay six month's rent plus the deposit up front. She cannot afford this.

What do we do?

I know the situation in Ukraine is appallling and I am writing from a position of immense priveledge but we have found it really difficult having someone else in our home. She is not an easy person to be around, does not work, has refused all offers to be taken to support groups and frequently just hangs around us when we are in the house when we are trying to work or just to chill. Our son is home from uni in a couple of weeks and we need the room back.

There has been radio silence from the council Homes for Ukraine scheme.
How can I help her to move on?

@thegirlwithemousyhair

And any people on here are giving anecdotes about something they’ve ‘heard’. This is what I object to.

Of course, those with first hand experience of hosting situations which have sadly not worked out are absolutely right to share their experiences, however this jumping on the bandwagon by others without this experience, to vilify Ukrainians over here, is simply unacceptable.

I wouldn't say that sounded awful - more realistic
It was always obvious that appearing to be doing something but with others bearing the load was too great a temptation for government to resist, and the assurances of "support" have been heard too often to have any credibility now

Add to that the predictable central government's and LAs' complete lack of accountability and endless blaming of each other, and that's why some of us preferred to give in other ways

Get Boris to give her a home.
This war had nothing to do with us from the beginning. Why did we think it did? Putin would have taken over, been dead in 15 years and this corrupt country would return to their corruption independence. How many countries are puppets of ours? Many in the middle east.
All this has achieved is many lives lost and many disabled Ukrainian and Russians.
We cannot even sort out our own country and we are pouring fuel everywhere and the common man has to put up with influxes of people who didn't need tobe here
What makes Ukrainians more deserving than Afghans who helped us fight the Taliban
Apart from colour we have nothing in common with Ukrainians

HfU is unusual in that they have a 3 year visa. I know two women who were English teachers in Ukraine who have been employed as TAs with school funding their DBS check and training. We hosted two mid 20s women. First stayed 6 months and then moved to private rented. She worked remotely throughout and her employer (US based) switched her to being formally employed in UK. She’s since managed to convert to a different visa type to work towards settled status. Second was with us 15 months and moved to a council flat. She’s working as an admin in the offices of a local hospital. We know some people who had problems with expectations around moving out dates and in all cases they were resolved by contacting the council to formally share cut off dates.

That makes me quite angry. It's so hard for young people to afford rents these days as it is. We keep being told there is so little housing stock for people, Green fields sites are build on relentlessly. So how can we as a country find accommodation and how can the government pay rent for people who aren't even citizens? It beggars belief. The whole system is crazy. No one can get appointments with the GP or get surgery they need, yet we can enable refugees to use the NHS free. I have every sympathy with their situation in general, but we are a small island nation and we can't manage our own facilities as it is . A whole hotel has been turned over to refugees near where one of my adult DC live.

And any people on here are giving anecdotes about something they’ve ‘heard’. This is what I object to.
I have given anecdotes.
However I live next door but one to my friend, I go to her house most days, I met her guests and saw them round the small town we live in nearly every day. I saw my friend interact with them and how one would just wave her hand to dismiss her when she couldn't be bothered with her.
My friend is very gentle and tries to see the best. She can be a bit intimidated and struggles to stand up for herself at times. She was definitely taken advantage of by the two women who stayed. They had strong over bearing personalities and wore her down. She tried to do a good thing but the expierence has changed her.

Also, we have a massive homeless problem in this country.

Can you really not see the bigger picture here? Not to mention The Budapest Memorandum?

People on here are giving anecdotes about something they’ve ‘heard’. This is what I object to

And that's fair enough if you're also prepared to discount the endless hearsay about what folk have allegedly suffered unless it's a first hand account

IME this doesn't often happen though, and when it's in reverse we're expected to accept every last tale as if it's written in stone

It depends entirely on the people.

I bumped into and made an acquaintance of a lovely mother with a 5 year old child last winter, who works as an accountant, and lives with her DM over in London. Her ex-DH is a soldier in the Ukrainian army and she said she had to leave as her flat was being bombed/guns firing and they were scared for their lives.

Her English is good but she has no idea of what's best or makes judgments (as you would) about schools. The primary school where my DNephew goes is right next to her house/flat and is excellent but her son is Russian Orthodox and she sent him to a Catholic primary school not near but not that far away as she thought this would be better, religion wise. She didn't know much about the school next to her house/flat. Her DM can't or won't go out as she knows hardly any English and doesn't know older people her own age locally who speak her language. The younger woman wants to return to Ukraine, but only when it's safe, which right now, it isn't.

I bought her a coffee as it was freezing, from the park cafe, and I could tell almost immediately from speaking to her, that she was worried about how I'd perceive her as a Ukrainian person, and was trying to put her best side across to me, to prove that she was hardworking, had good morals, was friendly, and a good parent.

She's lovely, sadly lives the other side of London to me so I can't see her much, but we still chat via Whatsapp sometimes.

Then one of DM's friends was telling her about a Ukrainian woman who'd moved into a flat/house/room that she owned, but was taking the piss a bit, not moving out, going back to Ukraine for holidays a lot, had met and married a new Ukrainian boyfriend quickly despite having a young child and as others have said here, not saving money, not working. I don't quite know how that ended but it was very stressful for a retired woman to deal with.

So it really is swings and roundabouts.

A local hotel has been turned into housing for refugees where I live too, not sure if they still do take tourists too.

To be fair, you see men and children mostly in the local park playing football or volleyball and they're fine. You sometimes see the men hanging around and sitting on park benches, smoking and drinking (not to excess) and yesterday when I drove past the hotel I saw a mother and young girl in the lobby (both with hijabs on) and a man coming back to the hotel with a plastic bag presumably with drink etc in it.

I do feel for them as if they can't work/study and are just waiting for their asylum claims to be processed this must be hard for them. However, I do wonder how many of these people (especially the men) are economic migrants rather than genuine asylum seeker/refugees. And as a pp said, we are a small island.

Already our local GP practice has had to change the way it operates recently as there's too much pressure on it's services. Schools are oversubscribed. All the delivery drivers look like they're refugees/migrants. I sound like some sort of racist and I'm not. I know a lot of this is our fault as a country for starting wars in other countries too.

Christ! - based on a comment above - are people actually thinking Ukraine will win a war against Russia??

🤯

Er...of course Ukraine per se is not going to defeat Russia. Ukraine, America and its allies may well collectively defeat Russia, however.

Ukraine is a proxy for NATO.

I agree.

How is that going to happen without an escalation to nuclear weapons?

I feel for you. My mum went through the same situation with two difficult guests. They finally left after she found them an apartment.

Going back to OPs initial post, I would just carry on with the plan for her to leave on the date you gave. So I would drop comments about buying paint to redecorate the room before your son comes back, getting new bed linen for 'sons room'. Talk about date son will be arriving back with all his bags, the need to clear 'his' wardrobe etc. If she doesn't show a willingness to pack, a few days before he is due back breezily tell her you're deep clearing the room today, so you'll help her pack. Just carry on with your plan, don't deviate from the non negotiable date!

To say it isn't an option is wrong. She can return. She may not want to return to an active war zone on the border but she can return to most of Ukraine, especially the West, and Kiev isn't too bad now.

Isn't that exactly the point though - that she found them an apartment?

All along hosts were assured that support would be available to rehouse guests at the end of the agreed period, or even during it if things became difficult, and for all I know some may have believed it

Pity really ...

America and its allies have been funding conventional warfare in Ukraine and until recently it was doing very well, although we are now seeing both sides becoming bogged down in a kind of stalemate. The best approach is probably to continue funding conventional warfare in Ukraine until Russia is eventually worn down and the war starts to become more and more unpopular in Russia. I agree it's not easy, but the idea that we should just lie down and let Russia take Ukraine is appalling.

Of course she could go back - She doesn’t have to go back to her home town, but can live elsewhere in Ukraine.

But being a lazy Freddie Freeloader is more her style.
She could easily get work in a Care home.

My Ukrainian guest were nice decent people (mother and teenage daughters) but they saved up £25k on the year they were here and when they had to move out of my home, they immediately got a council owned flat which a local charity then furnished with almost brand new furniture. I’m talking everything.. cutlery, white goods, beds, drawers, hoovers, sofas, dining table etc etc. when they had £25k sitting in their bank! I was furious. The daughter also had a free space at a prestigious private school.

they have now gone back to their home in Lviv with the equivalent of 8 years annual salary saved up (I believe the average annual salary in Ukraine is around the £3000 mark from what they told me)

I don’t begrudge them cos I’d hate to have to escape bombs (and yes there were plenty of missiles dropped on Lviv. Not as much as the rest of the country but they were stil attacked, and I’d also have moved my kids if I had been in the position). But my god did they have it far more privileged than lots of local people in the 18 months they were here. So I don’t begrudge them, I begrudge the system

This is very true and there is actually a government agreement between the two countries that the refugees must return after the war. Zelensky wants them back to be able to eventually rebuild Ukraine, particularly after the sacrifices of the population who stayed behind to fight

Wrong. The police have been in multiple multiple cases across the UK to remove them from their hosts homes. I’m part of a host group and I can assure you the police have turnee up when called and removed them immediately from the house. The Ukrainians have absolutely zero rights to stay in the home a minute after the guests ask them to leave