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All these people taking weight loss appetite suppressant drugs?!!

388 replies

OnHerSolidFoundations · 20/04/2024 06:29

Is it me or is this a bit sinister?

OP posts:
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12
LadyWithLapdog · 25/04/2024 06:19

easylikeasundaymorn · 24/04/2024 15:43

After 2 years most people will have adapted to the "new" way of living though. E.g. if you are used to eating huge portions then suddenly eating much smaller ones is going to be really hard. These drugs limit your appetite so you get used to smaller portions without feeling hungry or getting cravings. After 2 years of eating small portions, for most people that will become the norm and a big portion like they used to eat will be too much for them, exactly as it is for people who don't use drugs to aid their weight loss.

If you've got to a healthy weight, its much easier to cut back again the moment you notice you're a few pounds heavier or your clothes feel tight. Say you stop using wegovy at ten stone. Its a lot easier to get back to ten stone from 10 stone 5, than to go from 18 stone to 10 stone...

Plus having lost weight gives you a greater impetus to keep it off. If you've been overweight a long time/forever you might not remember or know exactly what you felt like at a healthy weight. You might have a vague idea that you think you might look "better" or that you'd be able to do more exercise or not get as sweaty, but you wouldn't KNOW. Whereas if you've recently lost weight you know exactly what its like both at your new weight and how you used to look and feel.

I appreciate for people who think of it as a magic wand it might not work long term but that was never the intention- the idea is to use it to kick start weight loss ALONGSIDE general and sustainable lifestyle changes.

I like this and I want it to be true. I think it “makes sense” and is logical. But I also think a lot of it is wishful thinking. I don’t think anyone is under any illusion they absolutely need bigger portions or to eat more often. Many times it’s actual hunger and urge to eat. I’ve just come off Wegovy (after 2 months, not 2 years, I didn’t have too much to lose) and it’s difficult. I tell myself all the things you’ve written there, but it’s tough. I’m bloody hungry and it’s diet, exercise and willpower again. I think overall it’s too early to tell what the results are long term.

ILoveMyCat23 · 25/04/2024 07:42

easylikeasundaymorn · 24/04/2024 15:43

After 2 years most people will have adapted to the "new" way of living though. E.g. if you are used to eating huge portions then suddenly eating much smaller ones is going to be really hard. These drugs limit your appetite so you get used to smaller portions without feeling hungry or getting cravings. After 2 years of eating small portions, for most people that will become the norm and a big portion like they used to eat will be too much for them, exactly as it is for people who don't use drugs to aid their weight loss.

If you've got to a healthy weight, its much easier to cut back again the moment you notice you're a few pounds heavier or your clothes feel tight. Say you stop using wegovy at ten stone. Its a lot easier to get back to ten stone from 10 stone 5, than to go from 18 stone to 10 stone...

Plus having lost weight gives you a greater impetus to keep it off. If you've been overweight a long time/forever you might not remember or know exactly what you felt like at a healthy weight. You might have a vague idea that you think you might look "better" or that you'd be able to do more exercise or not get as sweaty, but you wouldn't KNOW. Whereas if you've recently lost weight you know exactly what its like both at your new weight and how you used to look and feel.

I appreciate for people who think of it as a magic wand it might not work long term but that was never the intention- the idea is to use it to kick start weight loss ALONGSIDE general and sustainable lifestyle changes.

This sounds great but how is it different to any other diet? Especially the second two points about it being easier to lose 8 lbs than 8 stone and knowing how it feels to be a healthier weight. That's no different to any other diet and it doesn't stop people regaining the weight and yo-yo dieting.

The only way I could see it being effective is for someone to restart the medication as soon as they see the scales start to creep up. But I don't think it would necessarily be that easy. Presumably if it was as easy as saying "oh I'm gaining weight, I'd better cut back" then everyone would do that with whatever diet worked for them in the first place, but they don't. Unless ozempic makes it so easy to lose weight that it's no hardship going on it? If you can identify the underlying cause behind overeating and address it then great but knowing what a healthy diet and lifestyle looks/feels like probably isn't enough to do that.

soupfiend · 25/04/2024 07:50

Most people are not overweight because they are 'hungry'. Its because they feel hungry. they have cravings. Drugs like Ozempic (much like WLS) end the feeling of cravings, so thats what people mean by the food noise shutting down, you just turn into a normal person who eats reasonable portions because they eat when they're actually hungry or when its meal time

There is also in many posts this concept that all fat people have some sort of unhealthy 'lifestyle' if only they were to make the 'lifestyle changes' they need to make it would all be ok. But many of us simply ate too much, not necessarily of burgers and pork pies, just of normal every day meals, portions were too big, things like Ozempic mean you're not craving that enormity anymore.

Its very hormonally triggered, these cravings, thats why WLS and these drugs have the effect they do, because they end that. These are not sensations that people have who are not overweight to that degree.

BeretRaspberry · 25/04/2024 07:50

PineappleTime · 25/04/2024 05:45

Ugh, such fat acceptance nonsense. You know that study that said 95% of people regain weight is flawed and inaccurate right?

You know that study that said 95% of people regain weight is flawed and inaccurate right?

I do. I belive most newer research shows it to be around 80%.

JudyBlumesBlubber · 25/04/2024 07:59

Danfromdownunder · 25/04/2024 05:49

This is also in today’s Times for anyone with access. Quite an interesting read.

AhBiscuits · 25/04/2024 10:07

I'm so, so determined to maintain my loss. I've got rid of my old clothes and spent a lot on lovely new ones so I'd have nothing to wear for a start 😄

Bridgetta · 25/04/2024 10:35

Some people almost have a moral objection to these things. I really don’t get it. It’s like telling people they shouldn’t brush their teeth, as they wouldn’t get cavities if they simply stopped eating sugar 😂

PineappleTime · 25/04/2024 11:48

I know there is no real difference between maintaining weight loss after traditional methods and after wegovy. For me the differences are a) I'm perimenopausal now and haven't weighed this light since I was 30. I am acutely aware that I am heading for more weight gain and harder losses at my age. B) I spent a lot of money on the medication and if I backslide I will be furious with myself and c) as I said I've not been this weight since I was 30 and I look and feel brilliant. I forgot what it feels like to not be obese. I still have weight to lose but can't afford more wegovy for now. If the costs come down in a couple of years I will 100% go back on it.

silverneedle · 25/04/2024 14:50

The Zoe podcast last year interviewed Dr Robert Kushner who has done research trials on semaglutide (ozempic etc). He believes you have to take the injections for life as otherwise when you come off the injection your body will be fighting to get back to its set point at a higher weight through increasing hunger hormones and suppressing satiating hormones. So he doesn’t believe it works well as a way to kickstart weight loss as, as said, you have to be on it long term if you don’t want to re gain the weight.

It’s worth reading the transcript for full details. https://zoe.com/learn/podcast-can-ozempic-semaglutide-solve-weight-loss

ZOE Podcast: Can Ozempic (Semaglutide) Solve Weight Loss?

Jonathan speaks to Dr. Robert Kushner, the lead investigator of a huge recent trial, about whether semaglutide really is a game-changing treatment for obesity.

https://zoe.com/learn/podcast-can-ozempic-semaglutide-solve-weight-loss

silverneedle · 25/04/2024 14:56

wldpwr · 21/04/2024 11:55

In the interests of being well informed, I just listened to the Dr Mark Hyman "truth about Ozempic" podcast from Diary of a CEO. This was referenced by a PP as evidence against weight loss medication. He is an advocate for fixing health problems with food/lifestyle.

What he actually says is:

  • they work
  • they are probably a good idea for people with significantly raised BMI
  • they probably aren't a good idea if you only have a small amount of weight to lose
  • they have some side effects
  • you have to use them for life - like many medications

He makes a big deal about loss of muscle on weight loss drugs but like "Ozempic face," this is a by product of ANY WEIGHT LOSS. You would lose muscle if you lost weight the Dr Mark Hyman way. See: https://open.spotify.com/episode/0JpJ0BXrSrEwxhIoxVJHYN?si=Zz0pUD_FQM6NB4uOPtNewQ

He also complains about the cost which is much lower in the UK. I think cost IS a factor because people currently need to have a spare £250/month to buy them themselves - I think they should be available to people on lower incomes, who are statistically more likely to have obesity and poor health.

So in other words, even a doctor who is a major proponent of "fixing yourself" with food thinks these drugs can be a good idea for people with obesity.

FOR ACTUAL SCIENCE FROM AN ACTUAL PROFESSOR ABOUT WHY WEIGHT LOSS DRUGS CAN BE A GOOD IDEA (and why obesity is a disease, not a choice): https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z6bwUubBoeo

Thanks for this.

beguilingeyes · 25/04/2024 15:05

Unabletomitigate · 20/04/2024 07:19

Sinister- a medication that needs to be taken for life, with unknown consequences. Yep, sounds sinister to me. But then again the pharmaceutical industry, is an industry, and just out to make as much money as possible. They have no motivation to act in the best interests of patients.

A slight digression: type 2 diabetes is curable with lifestyle interventions. One of the largest manufacturers of insulin debated in a meeting whether 'curing' diabetes was a sustainable business model. It isn't. Pharmaceutical companies want repeat, lifetime customers, they want to manage symptoms and not cure diseases.

I have to take Thyroxine every day for life. can you cure my hypothyroidism too?

beguilingeyes · 25/04/2024 15:24

I wonder how many people who are being so sanctimonious about Big Pharma and putting chemicals into your body are quite happy to have Botulinum Toxin injected into them?

Totallymessed · 25/04/2024 16:22

silverneedle · 25/04/2024 14:50

The Zoe podcast last year interviewed Dr Robert Kushner who has done research trials on semaglutide (ozempic etc). He believes you have to take the injections for life as otherwise when you come off the injection your body will be fighting to get back to its set point at a higher weight through increasing hunger hormones and suppressing satiating hormones. So he doesn’t believe it works well as a way to kickstart weight loss as, as said, you have to be on it long term if you don’t want to re gain the weight.

It’s worth reading the transcript for full details. https://zoe.com/learn/podcast-can-ozempic-semaglutide-solve-weight-loss

Robert Kushner has also been involved in quite a lot of studies that have concluded that semaglutide has positive effects in a whole range of medical conditions though. He's not a critic of its use as such.

silverneedle · 25/04/2024 16:46

Totallymessed · 25/04/2024 16:22

Robert Kushner has also been involved in quite a lot of studies that have concluded that semaglutide has positive effects in a whole range of medical conditions though. He's not a critic of its use as such.

Agree he is not a critic of its use. He just shares you have to take the injections probably for life.

BeretRaspberry · 25/04/2024 17:30

silverneedle · 25/04/2024 14:50

The Zoe podcast last year interviewed Dr Robert Kushner who has done research trials on semaglutide (ozempic etc). He believes you have to take the injections for life as otherwise when you come off the injection your body will be fighting to get back to its set point at a higher weight through increasing hunger hormones and suppressing satiating hormones. So he doesn’t believe it works well as a way to kickstart weight loss as, as said, you have to be on it long term if you don’t want to re gain the weight.

It’s worth reading the transcript for full details. https://zoe.com/learn/podcast-can-ozempic-semaglutide-solve-weight-loss

This is also exactly why I made my point about most people regaining weight from ‘traditional’ dieting as well. It doesn’t seem to be the method that’s important thing, just that the body itself, in most cases, fights back.

This is an interesting video to explain it too. Albeit it’s quite old now.

And in case anyone thinks I’m anti any of these interventions, I am absolutely not. As a now fat person, I have considered all options myself, including these injections and surgery. If I could wave a magic wand and be slim again, my god I would. Not because of the ‘health’ myth but because I would be ‘acceptable’. I’d not be ridiculed, I’d not be thought to be responsible, with my fellow fatties, for the downfall of the NHS, I’d not be thought of a greedy, or lazy. Not that I actually care what people think of me individually but as a whole, it’s tiresome and damaging to hear/read those messages all the time.

I’ve posted before to say how I became fat. I literally dieted myself fat. People may not believe that, but it’s true. I had my eldest son at 20, prior to which I’d always been slim, bordering on too slim at times. My family are all the same. We ate a well balanced, and well varied diet. We kids walked everywhere and were active. While pregnant with my son I gained a lot of weight. So when, at my 6 week post natal check up, the doctor gave me a Slimming World leaflet, I thought it was the done thing. I lost about a stone and half quickly. Then put it and a bit more back on. Then continued the cycle over about 20 years, until I ended up fat and with an eating disorder. So, like I said, I have nothing against peole taking these injections.

Why dieting doesn't usually work | Sandra Aamodt

In the US, 80% of girls have been on a diet by the time they're 10 years old. In this honest, raw talk, neuroscientist Sandra Aamodt uses her personal story ...

https://youtu.be/jn0Ygp7pMbA?si=s_jY2SqvJolBV1I0

LoserWinner · 25/04/2024 23:38

Whether it’s using a weight loss drug, following a reducing diet of some sort, joining a slimming club or dealing with the effects of weight loss surgery, in the end, it boils down to having the self-discipline to lose weight and maintain weight loss. The common thread running through much of this discussion is that many people either don’t exercise the self-discipline to lose weight without aids, or they don’t have the self-discipline to maintain the weight loss. Perhaps what is really needed is therapeutic support to develop the necessary skills to ignore or overcome ‘food noise’ and spurious sensations of hunger.

Danfromdownunder · 25/04/2024 23:40

Did you read the thread? It’s NOT about willpower or self discipline.

LoserWinner · 25/04/2024 23:44

Danfromdownunder · 25/04/2024 23:40

Did you read the thread? It’s NOT about willpower or self discipline.

Yes, every single post. I wouldn’t have commented if I hadn’t.

BeretRaspberry · 25/04/2024 23:46

LoserWinner · 25/04/2024 23:44

Yes, every single post. I wouldn’t have commented if I hadn’t.

Did you watch the video I posted where a neuroscientist explained it’s nothing to do with willpower and self discipline then?

LoserWinner · 25/04/2024 23:57

BeretRaspberry · 25/04/2024 23:46

Did you watch the video I posted where a neuroscientist explained it’s nothing to do with willpower and self discipline then?

Yes. I disagree.

BeretRaspberry · 26/04/2024 00:06

LoserWinner · 25/04/2024 23:57

Yes. I disagree.

😂

LoserWinner · 26/04/2024 00:43

BeretRaspberry · 26/04/2024 00:06

😂

Sandra Aamodt makes a lot of money telling people they can’t control their weight, but it’s ok just to eat mindfully - telling people what they want to hear.

BeretRaspberry · 26/04/2024 03:18

LoserWinner · 26/04/2024 00:43

Sandra Aamodt makes a lot of money telling people they can’t control their weight, but it’s ok just to eat mindfully - telling people what they want to hear.

And again.

😂

Bookworm1111 · 26/04/2024 10:38

LoserWinner · 26/04/2024 00:43

Sandra Aamodt makes a lot of money telling people they can’t control their weight, but it’s ok just to eat mindfully - telling people what they want to hear.

As a neuroscientist she's got the nous and actual evidence to back up her stance though. She's not spinning an untruth.

VictoriaSpongeForBreakfast · 26/04/2024 11:31

How are people getting the drugs once they hit BMI 26. I cant buy it anymore as all the sites want to contact my doctor and I managed to loose enough weight to hit the BMI threshold. I'm still fat with a chubby ring around my belly. I'm exercising, eating less but I'm stubbornly staying the same weight.