Confused about Trans and NonBinary

[CactusMactus]

I am going to get terminologies wrong here... soz in advance.
Friends gown up daughter-at-birth has recently had top surgery to become trans. She has used pronouns 'they/them' for a while and continues to consider themselves non-binary.
I don't understand how that works. Surely if you are trans you have changed from she/her to he/him not she/her to they/them.
Does one transition to non-binary?
Genuin question...

Don't feminists often ask critical questions when women are ending up feeling that their bodies are wrong and need changing in painful ways?

Foot binding, corsets, female genital mutilation, breast implants, buttock implants, starvation diets... and now breast removals.

I think it'd be a mistake for us to shut up and be nice about any of that.

"Be quiet it's none of your business" is how women's bodies have been abused for centuries.

Sorry, not interested in sharing those opinions. Have already said above on what I disagree with over Stonewalls approach. I don’t think my opinion on other aspects is relevant.

Im sure you don’t. Obviously you’re not willing to elaborate about why you believe it’s ok for males to force themselves into female only spaces or for organisations that exert as much power and influence as Stonewall do to believe in acceptance without exception regardless of what that actually means for women (and by women I don’t mean males). It’s hard to justify either.

Sure, ok.

Stonewall's stance on 'acceptance without exception' is very clear.

Stonewall supports any male in female spaces. Paedeophiles included.

Without exception.

A young woman has had her tits cut off and thrown in the bin.

She will regret it in a very big way.

@strudelcutie4427 You sound taken in by the Gender Ideology cult. Firstly, sex is not 'assigned' at birth. It is OBSERVED at birth.
Sex is assigned the moment the sperm enters the ova.
Sex is observed at birth.

'Top surgery' is Elective Double Mastectomy and self-harm. Lets speak the truth here. Evidence shows most trans suicides are post-surgery. So it does not improve anything. On the contrary, they find that slef-harm hasn't changed their sex and they become despondent and suicidal. THEY should have accepted themselves and their body for who they are.

The TQ community is OVER-represented in the community, far more than LGB and heterosexuals.

Giving children a book that tells them they are 'born wrong' is deeply abusive and irresponsible. They should be taught Body Positivity (whatever happened to that, by the way???) and to love and accept their body as it is.

Don't be so open-minded that you are susceptible to being brainwashed and your brains fall out.

They call it that because they don't want to face the guilt about what they've done, which is really self-harm/mutilation.

@Mintyfreshtulips WRONG! Elective Double Mastectomy is the correct term. Lets not lie on here. Yes, some people call it 'top surgery' to avoid the guilt of the reality of what it is. But the FACT is there is no medical term called 'top surgery'. That, is a euphemism. The correct actual medical term is Elective Double Mastectomy.

It shows how dangerous using euphemisms is. Just as the previous example does. Stop being in denial.

And also Peter Tatchell who frequently is on shows as an LGBTQ+ representative and is on record as saying adult-child sex is not harmful. His views are well-known yet he is continually to this day given frequent platforms and on panels. And no one from the LGBTQ+ community has ever called him out, or said he doesn't represent them. On the contrary. They laud him. Which means they laud his beliefs. When the LGBTQ+ community even won't call him out and continually platform him, that says that his views are representative of the LGBTQ+ community, rightly or wrongly.

Fine, let me rephrase.

top surgery is a descriptor commonly used in NHS and medical literature. I didn’t say it was the surgical definition of the procedure, but that it is very commonly used by medical professionals.

cookie is not.

it’s absolutely no different to referring to cholecystectomy as gallbladder removal. Both are used interchangeably and are correct.

i am pretty sure no one has ever bellowed “tHaTS nOt wHaT ThE sUrGeRy iS AcTuAlLy cAlLeD” when the above example has been had anywhere.

Sure, that’s what you think and both are hard to justify.

Sure, if you say so.

I’m don’t need to - you’ve already confirmed your TRA stance.

With reference to your last post, top is the equivalent of cookie. It’s so important to use the correct terminology, so cholecystectomy is to mastectomy what gallbladder removal is to breast removal. No-one would go to their GP and say I’m concerned about a lump in my top - grown women know they have breasts.

it’s absolutely no different to referring to cholecystectomy as gallbladder removal. Both are used interchangeably and are correct.

Not the same- those terms both refer to a specific procedure, the latter being a ‘layman’s’ term. To make true equivalents:

Mastectomy/breast removal/top surgery

Cholecystecromy/gallbladder removal/abdomen surgery

Or even ‘middle surgery’.

Sure, if you say so!

eveyone who doesn’t bow down and agree with the same group of posters who dominate the feminism boards are all TRA. Gotcha!

one of us!! Gooble gabba!

Yes, gooble gabba from you is correct.

🤣🤣🤣🤣

Yes, your views are funny - or they would be if they didn’t deny biological reality , align themselves to an organisation who promotes acceptance without exception and dismiss the very real dangers of women having double mastectomies as a medical response to dysphoria. Or perhaps you genuinely think they are all highly amusing.

There’s nothing to fight over - unless of course you do agree with the above. In which case, own it.

Oh the "top surgery is the official medical term!" person doesn't have an argument, just childish sneering? I'm totally shocked.

No, I clearly stated I completely disagreed with Stonewalls approach to “no debate” etc

but apparently I need to list every single opinion I have or I am a TRA who wants men in women’s spaces.

And the rest?

If you disagree with no debate, how do you propose to keep the less desirable males out of female spaces given that (according to Stonewall) they appear to have just as much right to be there as the other men? And how can women in those female spaces spot those less desirable males and protect themselves?