“Karen” is a misogynist term.

[Bleuuuughhh]

i just would like to get an idea of how other women feel about this term.

It seems deeply unfair there is no equivalent term for badly behaved men. In my eyes, the phase appears to be a new insult to add the huge list women have had add to put up with through the ages.

Women being sexually active is now more acceptable so the terms “Jezebel”, “slag” are not used as widely. Similarly there is an aging population “crone” and “witch” aren’t acceptable . Now a woman who complains, or doesn’t tow the party time is called a “Karen”.

Has anything really actually changed at all?

It's a misogynistic insult. It's another way of shutting up older women. Plus, for any women called Karen, it's really unpleasant that their name has been co-opted in this way.

Anything to shut down a woman who dares express an opinion, eh? Especially a middle aged white one. Ageist and racist.
Luckily I couldn’t give a stuff, and use my voice with gay abandon.

Dick.

I agree with you op. I’ve seen it used many times to tell women of a certain age ( whatever is deemed over the hill 40?) to stfu. Any opinion expressed by an older woman and she is called a Karen.
I don’t know why people defend the term. Probably the same people who refer to women as mutton dressed as lamb, hoes, slags, sluts, whores, bitches, frumps, mumsy etc etc yet laugh along with the menz.

As many, many people have said, it’s origins were NOT calling out racist behaviour. I absolutely know this - at one point I did a whole piece of research, looking at dated usages and posting a history of its evolution with pictures. I really can’t be arsed to do that again, but it has ALWAYS been misogynistic.

It absolutely is sexist in that it is used to shut down any woman (by women and men) who dares to have an opinion or voice a request against something she is unhappy with, whether her request is justified or not.

It’s not a few Incels. It’s a term in common use. It’s used on here. And when I’ve seen posters using it, it’s in terms of them wanting to (with good reason) talk to someone about their behaviour but then holding back for fear of being called a Karen. So the term is working in real life in the way it’s intended. To deter women from standing up to themselves. And when other posters object to them using the term, the poster is surprised and says all their friends use it.

I’ve seen it used on local Facebook pages around here. And we are pretty much the land that time forgot in terms of keeping up with the times. So if it’s used here you know for sure it’s become totally mainstream.

So yes a term that is used to make women feel ashamed of standing up for themselves has gained common currency. And yes, women use it to police each other as misogynistic terms often come to be used.

Kevin.... And it is used to describe a particular subset.

I don't Karen think is particularly mysogenistic but it is unpleasant.

@Bleuuuughhh assuming you're a woman, once you've had it unfairly levelled at you for voicing a legitimate concern or opinion, you will clearly and instantly understand why it is misogynistic.

Of course it's misogynistic. A way of shutting up women.

Yep sexist, ageist and designed to shut women up. I particularly hate hearing women use it themselves.

I am a manager in a school. During the pandemic I had to speak to a group of sixth formers who were in the canteen outside of their bubbles allocated time. Whatever you thought of these rules they were imposed on us by the government. One mother rang in to complain that this woman ‘we think her name is Karen’ had dared to challenge her daughter. It was such a passive aggressive way for a middle aged woman to have a dig at a middle aged woman … and no if I had been a man there wouldn’t have been a male equivalent they’d have used

Yes it's a horrible term and I hate it. See it often online. It's a way to dismiss and demean women.

I hate it too. I got called it when calling some male teenagers out for causing some trouble. I felt ashamed and embarrassed which is what it’s supposed to do. To shut me up.

Would they have spoken back to a man? What would they have called him?

@MinnieL i didn’t know the origins of the word so thank you for that. I’m off to read up on it properly now. Mumsnet really does provide me with an education sometimes. Thank you.

the problem is that I suspect 99% of people who use the word against women don’t know either and don’t use it correctly in that sense. It’s just morphed into a horrible general insult for women.

This. Its misogynistic and ageist.

@MinnieL is there a right reason ever to use derogatory language towards someone? So if someone behaves badly we call them names rather than calling out the poor behaviour? Aren’t we just perpetuating poor behaviour and using language to help that? Surely explaining to someone that they are being racist or entitled will allow them to learn more than telling them to “shut up Karen”?

“Karen” is a pejorative term that is now used to tell women to STFU. If you can’t see that it’s sexist, ageist and discriminatory then that is a problem.

Ageist, sexist and just bloody horrible. I really feel for women called Karen, having their perfectly nice name turned into an insult.

A gammon I think? Although that may be more for grumpy brexit voting men

I hate it. It's sexist and awful.

For all those posters saying the male equivalent is ‘insert word of choice here’, the mere fact people need to ask what the male equivalent is, the mere fact different terms get suggested, just shows there is no male equivalent. I have never, ever heard a man referred to as Kevin, unless his name actually is Kevin. I have frequently heard women being called Karen ( usually by other women 🙄).

’Karen’ has taken off as an insult for women. ‘Kevin’ , and alternatives, have not. And that is why there is no male equivalent and why we can see the deep cultural misogyny the term Karen reflects and captures.

Not the same. No man has "Gammon" for a name.

It's designed to silence middle aged women who try and assert themselves. It's ageist and misogynist.

I need a word for hairy arse crack showing, sneering, sexist, racist, white van man driving louts. Any ideas?

Karen was a useful term for privileged racist women, but has been appropriated into a misogynistic way to shut up middle aged women. We are hated for standing up for ourselves these days.

Just like how “woke” was used in the African American community to show a political understanding and awakening…now means twats who insist in 4388 genders and the like.

The worst is when young women use it, wow, give it time girls and you too will be hated. Sad.

It is not only sexist but ageist as well as most women with the name Karen are in their fifties or sixties. Even if the male equivalent (which I've never heard of) is Kevin, the ageist comment is still appropriate for the same reason.