“Karen” is a misogynist term.

[Bleuuuughhh]

i just would like to get an idea of how other women feel about this term.

It seems deeply unfair there is no equivalent term for badly behaved men. In my eyes, the phase appears to be a new insult to add the huge list women have had add to put up with through the ages.

Women being sexually active is now more acceptable so the terms “Jezebel”, “slag” are not used as widely. Similarly there is an aging population “crone” and “witch” aren’t acceptable . Now a woman who complains, or doesn’t tow the party time is called a “Karen”.

Has anything really actually changed at all?

So what about the generation of Tracy and Sharons whose names were used to signify a certain type of female in the 80s? Women with these popular names were shamed and stigmatised by this. No woke brigade stopped it. Karen will be added to the list and Karen will plummet in popularity as Sharon and Tracy did. Another name will come along to shame women in the future, sadly it will never stop as language evolves.

Not where I live. My son refers to me as a Karen sometimes if he thinks I am one. Due to my white privilege, there are moments when he thinks I am being a Karen, my son is not white.

Never have I considered that misogyny. What it is is him pointing something out to me that I have a blindspot for, as I am white. We have different lived experiences. As heartbreaking as that is.

Yes. Aka a Karen

You would think so. But not on mumsnet.🙄

I firmly maintain that the current usage of Karen in the UK is not related to race.

Of course. Because you are white. It is not related to race FOR you. But black women on this thread are telling you it IS related to race. For them it is. Yet, you are 'firmly maintaining' that what they are experiencing is not what they are experiencing.

Does that seem right to you?

🫶🏻

I absolutely agree OP. It's used when women are standing up for themselves or others. Another way to try and shut women up. It's quite abhorrent.

This week's whataboutery 🏆

I don't think that women should be shamed into not complaining about sexist language that is used about them.
I have no problem with people saying that others are behaving in a sexist way or have white privilege that they haven't noticed but doesn't require name calling.

It takes a special kind of arrogance to comment with such certainty on a thread that someone admits they haven’t even read.

Arrogance does not make one right.

But the term 'racism' exists. And calling behaviour 'racist' brings in legal protections. Discrimination based on race is covered by the Equality Act. Using a made-up sexist term that only applies to women and is used against women of all races is misogyny.
And posters saying it's fine for black women to be called Karens by white men - well, I'm not sure how they think they're not supporting misogyny and racism. Because regardless of what they 'think'; the facts aren't debatable. The facts are that it is a term used by men to belittle women of every race. The facts are that it is a term used by men to try to undermine women's opinions regardless of their race.
And the posters using whataboutery are the ones pretending that isn't happening. They're entitled to their own opinion on whether they want to use a misogynistic term or not. They're not entitled to their own facts about it's modern usage and that it is used against women of all races.

No.
It takes someone's lived experience.
I have an enormous respect and much love for @Socrateswasrightaboutvoting . She has maintained dignified and offered hundreds of reasoned and eloquent posts on this forum. Trying to reason, time and time again, with the unreasonable.

Arrogance you say @ChardonnaysBeastlyCat ? Funny that....

I cannot believe that any woman would allow their son to call them a Karen. He doesn't respect you and you're shaping the way he treats women.

If they had any respect for the thread they would not have posted while telling everyone they gave not bothered to read it.

What that is us “My opinion more important, I can’t be arsed to read what you are writing, but I’m happy to set you right”.

I have the utmost confidence in my parenting, thanks.

Wow. Would you have felt that strongly about it if the woman was white I wonder?

Well said 👍

My dc went through a phase of calling myself and others Karens, it had nothing to do with race issues and was based around being middle aged and daring to complain about poor service in some way.
I hardly ever complain but if a food order was just plain wrong I would highlight that rather than just eat whatever I was brought making me a Karen.
My dc got fed up with me highlighting the sheer sexism of the word and stopped using it around me.
Now they are just mature enough to understand the problems with it for themselves so they have stopped using it altogether.

Eugh you let your son use a mysognistic derogatory term to you. Why oh why do parents encourage that kind of shit??? 🤦‍♀️

It's quite jaw-dropping that posters think their DS being disrespectful and sexist is an affectionate anecdote. I'm genuinely shocked that someone would have such internalised misogyny. Although it does explain why they are tying themselves in knots trying to justify the use of sexist slurs.

Why wouldn't I?

Karen has little to do with racism (that’s the American version).

To me it just means an ignorant but opinionated and bossy woman who thinks she knows it all; usually has some kind of limited power or control she is desperate to use. It’s nothing to do with someone who complains about poor food in a restaurant.

I don’t think it misogynist to classify people sometimes in broad brush stokes. That includes women!

Bossy is sexist all by itself.

What term do you use for a man who is ignorant but opinionated and bossy and who thinks he knows it all, and has some kind of limited power or control he is desperate to use?

It doesn't bother me, i'd just laugh off being called a Karen, it's not something i can be particularly bothered about.