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Original poster

MIL not using correct name

240 replies

SkyBlue1987 · 20/09/2023 08:05

So I didn’t change my name when we got married a few years ago - which the in-laws definitely know and have never said anything bad about (that I know about). MIL is also on Facebook so would be reminded every time I post photos of the kids of my actual name. However, every time she posts something to us (they don’t live close by) it’s addressed to Mr and Mrs XYZ. Wondering if I should just let it go, it does bug me because I don’t know if she’s doing it deliberately or just because she’s old fashioned.

OP posts:
RiderofRohan · 21/09/2023 07:19

bigbluefish · 20/09/2023 20:24

It’s not old fashioned, it’s just normal.
Being married is about becoming a single family unit with one surname. It’s been done that way forever. It’s normal to keep your old surname on social media or for work if you are a professional eg. Dr etc. but surely you’re a family, not a collection of individuals. If you really hate his name ask him to change to yours.

It's very old fashioned and I suspect many women still do it because they do not understand the significance behind it. In the much of the western world, women were seen as nothing but property, to be passed from father to husband. However there are many places in the world this has never been done, like parts of Africa and the Middle East. Women just keep their family names and aren't expected to shed them in favour of becoming part of their husband's unit.

PrinceHaz · 21/09/2023 07:21

I think leave it bless it’s a part of general undermining.

SoupDragon · 21/09/2023 07:49

It's very old fashioned and I suspect many women still do it because they do not understand the significance behind it.

I really hate this sort of insulting sneeriness. It always appears on these threads, usually accompanied by a hefty dose of smug superiority.

TrashedSofa · 21/09/2023 08:23

Fizzology · 21/09/2023 07:12

As a teacher, I never assume that children have the same name as their parents, or that the parents have the same name as each other. Why on earth would I? There are so many different types of family, and precisely none share their marital status with me. It's irrelevent.

I would never 'politely default' to calling a woman by the name of the children's father. If I don't know her name, I ask.

Are some posters living in a 1950s subculture where all families always have the same name, and women should smilingly accept that marriage means erasure of her name, no matter her decisions?

It is rude to repeatedly call your DIL by the wrong name, because you don't respect her decision. It is an insult, and OP is not wrong to see it that way.

It's happened to me once or twice with school and I just think, have you not noticed the world around you?

It's about 50/50 kids born to unmarried parents in the UK now. Some of those will marry later, of course, but they won't all change their names. Some of those married at birth won't have the same name as each other anyway and some who do will subsequently divorce and not keep it. There really is no 'polite default' in this situation.

Fizzology · 21/09/2023 08:32

TrashedSofa · 21/09/2023 08:23

It's happened to me once or twice with school and I just think, have you not noticed the world around you?

It's about 50/50 kids born to unmarried parents in the UK now. Some of those will marry later, of course, but they won't all change their names. Some of those married at birth won't have the same name as each other anyway and some who do will subsequently divorce and not keep it. There really is no 'polite default' in this situation.

Show quote history

Not to mention all the different cultures at school, all with their own norms about names. There is no room to make assumptions.

RiderofRohan · 21/09/2023 08:32

SoupDragon · 21/09/2023 07:49

It's very old fashioned and I suspect many women still do it because they do not understand the significance behind it.

I really hate this sort of insulting sneeriness. It always appears on these threads, usually accompanied by a hefty dose of smug superiority.

Not all feminism is smug, though some people seem unable to separate the two. It's a shame we aren't taught more about the history of female subjugation so that we can make informed decisions.

Needmorelego · 21/09/2023 08:36

@Fizzology as a teacher though don't you sometimes need to just grab a parent after school for something?
For example little girl in your class Sally Smith banged her knee 10 minutes before the end of school, she was crying and you just want to let her mum know.
Now you know Sally's surname is Smith. It's on the register, her peg, her drawer, the label in her coat.....
Her mum is there in the playground - you want to grab her quick...
"Oh Mrs Smith can I grab you a second.....".
Except Sally's mum is Ms Jones. It has that on the school records of course but then minutes before school pick up you as a teacher are hardly going to have time to go and check?
Is that such a terrible thing to do?
Should it have been "Sally's Mum....can I grab you'? Isn't that worse? Being just referred to as "mum" (oh the horror😂)
(btw I expect the OPs mother in law is just being old fashioned and it's not a dig at all)

Ohthatsabitshit · 21/09/2023 08:36

I think the assumption that you are more feminist/emancipated because you choose to use your fathers name not your husbands is the kind of feminism that leaves me cold.

morelippy · 21/09/2023 08:36

A genuine question for those choosing to keep their own name... what will you name your children? Will they be double barrelled? And if you have daughters who marry what would they be?

I wanted us all to have our own family name and had no qualms about having the same name as my husband.. and no it's not just because I'm old and don't have any understanding of history. I happen to think 'old fashioned traditions' can be a good thing. It's not 'his' family name now. It's our family name.

TrashedSofa · 21/09/2023 08:41

Someone always feels moved to ask what will your kids do in these threads. It strikes me as such a strange question. They'll do whatever they want, just like yours will, and no parent knows in advance what naming decisions their DC will make as independent adults.

Ohthatsabitshit · 21/09/2023 08:44

My experience is that women hold the lead (on the whole) in family culture and tradition. They maintain relationships and curate the family experience. I’ve always felt the male surname thing we do in the uk was to redress that balance a little and tie men more firmly to their children/household, and to make very clear which brother you were married to.

RiderofRohan · 21/09/2023 08:46

morelippy · 21/09/2023 08:36

A genuine question for those choosing to keep their own name... what will you name your children? Will they be double barrelled? And if you have daughters who marry what would they be?

I wanted us all to have our own family name and had no qualms about having the same name as my husband.. and no it's not just because I'm old and don't have any understanding of history. I happen to think 'old fashioned traditions' can be a good thing. It's not 'his' family name now. It's our family name.

Double barrelling is common in many cultures for this very reason. I don't have kids but yes, this is a discussion I have had with my DH for the future. He's actually happy for the kids to have my name and I'm happy for them to have his, in the instance we don't double barrel. I think it's a shame that many people in modern western society still assume that a child should have a father's name with no discussion.

TrashedSofa · 21/09/2023 08:48

Ohthatsabitshit · 21/09/2023 08:36

I think the assumption that you are more feminist/emancipated because you choose to use your fathers name not your husbands is the kind of feminism that leaves me cold.

Not this whopping great double standard again.

If a woman's name isn't her own because her father had it first, then her husband doesn't get one either. She's taking FILs name. Though quite why the father gets his own name when he's very unlikely to have been the first person to hold it is never very clear.

Make whatever arguments you want about feminism, but either a name equally belongs to everyone who holds it, or it only belongs to the first person who had it. Either that, or a woman is giving up her own name to take her FILs: the principle is identical.

Needmorelego · 21/09/2023 08:50

@RiderofRohan the whole double barrel thing is fine and many cultures do that but when that child grows up and has children of their own one name has to be dropped (because they can't have four surnames) so there is presumably still a tradition as to which name goes. Do they keep the surname from their mum or dad? (I actually don't know).

Ohthatsabitshit · 21/09/2023 08:59

@TrashedSofa I think the point really is that any family name is taken from a previous holder whether that’s your DF, FIL or anyone else. There is some logic in taking your partners name, but if you’ve been named for your father then it isn’t better to keep that name.

heartofglass23 · 21/09/2023 09:03

Another reason why I didn't want to get married.

DryIce · 21/09/2023 09:05

Ohthatsabitshit · 21/09/2023 08:59

@TrashedSofa I think the point really is that any family name is taken from a previous holder whether that’s your DF, FIL or anyone else. There is some logic in taking your partners name, but if you’ve been named for your father then it isn’t better to keep that name.

But why do you call it "your partners name" vs "your father's name"?! The partner got the name from his father presumably too, why does he now get to have it assumed to be his, but a woman is just "named after her father "

DryIce · 21/09/2023 09:07

Needmorelego · 21/09/2023 08:50

@RiderofRohan the whole double barrel thing is fine and many cultures do that but when that child grows up and has children of their own one name has to be dropped (because they can't have four surnames) so there is presumably still a tradition as to which name goes. Do they keep the surname from their mum or dad? (I actually don't know).

I would say they have the same options as single surname couples. Take one or the other, mix them up, create a new one.

Ohthatsabitshit · 21/09/2023 09:07

@DryIce because it seemed the clearest way to communicate.

SouthLondonMum22 · 21/09/2023 09:11

morelippy · 21/09/2023 08:36

A genuine question for those choosing to keep their own name... what will you name your children? Will they be double barrelled? And if you have daughters who marry what would they be?

I wanted us all to have our own family name and had no qualms about having the same name as my husband.. and no it's not just because I'm old and don't have any understanding of history. I happen to think 'old fashioned traditions' can be a good thing. It's not 'his' family name now. It's our family name.

DS is double barrelled. If I had a girl, she'd be double barrelled too and I'd hope she wouldn't change her name if she got married but it will be for her to decide.

Maybe she'd just drop one name, maybe her partner would take both of her names or maybe she'd drop both and just take her partners name. Who knows.

Fizzology · 21/09/2023 09:11

Needmorelego · 21/09/2023 08:36

@Fizzology as a teacher though don't you sometimes need to just grab a parent after school for something?
For example little girl in your class Sally Smith banged her knee 10 minutes before the end of school, she was crying and you just want to let her mum know.
Now you know Sally's surname is Smith. It's on the register, her peg, her drawer, the label in her coat.....
Her mum is there in the playground - you want to grab her quick...
"Oh Mrs Smith can I grab you a second.....".
Except Sally's mum is Ms Jones. It has that on the school records of course but then minutes before school pick up you as a teacher are hardly going to have time to go and check?
Is that such a terrible thing to do?
Should it have been "Sally's Mum....can I grab you'? Isn't that worse? Being just referred to as "mum" (oh the horror😂)
(btw I expect the OPs mother in law is just being old fashioned and it's not a dig at all)

Why would I call her Mrs Smith though? I have no idea what her name is - I'm not just going to make one up and hope it's right. I know this is a different world than many posters live in, but the chances that Sally Smith's mother is Mrs Smith are well under 50%. And I sure as hell wouldn't use Mrs as a first guess - that's unlikely to be right.

'Sally's mum' may be reductive but it's unquestionably correct and also the role in which she is presenting at her child's school. After whatever emergency scenario has been dealt with, I can ask her name and how she prefers to be addressed, and she can tell me it's Dr Jones or whatever.

Ohthatsabitshit · 21/09/2023 09:13

In my experience midwives and teachers refer to you as “mum” and I hate it

CharSiu · 21/09/2023 09:13

Same here, all the parents did it though I never changed my name. I also returned from honey moon to find the name on my office door had been changed, they had to get it changed back :)

SouthLondonMum22 · 21/09/2023 09:16

Fizzology · 21/09/2023 09:11

Why would I call her Mrs Smith though? I have no idea what her name is - I'm not just going to make one up and hope it's right. I know this is a different world than many posters live in, but the chances that Sally Smith's mother is Mrs Smith are well under 50%. And I sure as hell wouldn't use Mrs as a first guess - that's unlikely to be right.

'Sally's mum' may be reductive but it's unquestionably correct and also the role in which she is presenting at her child's school. After whatever emergency scenario has been dealt with, I can ask her name and how she prefers to be addressed, and she can tell me it's Dr Jones or whatever.

Show quote history

I agree.

I'd much rather be called ''Sally's mum'' which is correct than ''Mrs Smith'' which isn't even my name.

TrashedSofa · 21/09/2023 09:18

Ohthatsabitshit · 21/09/2023 08:59

@TrashedSofa I think the point really is that any family name is taken from a previous holder whether that’s your DF, FIL or anyone else. There is some logic in taking your partners name, but if you’ve been named for your father then it isn’t better to keep that name.

It clearly isn't the point, otherwise you wouldn't refer to the husband and father as getting their own names while the woman doesn't. Which you do again here. It's a double standard. Why do you not think that it's a woman giving up her own name for her FILs?