Peckham shop incident

[Romiii]

What the f have I just watched? A female requesting a refund, then being assaulted? Strangled? Nothing can justify this treatment, even theft (if it’s eventually established that she did take something)

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/sep/12/police-investigate-incident-black-shopper-apparently-grabbed-by-throat?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

Did i watch the same video as you? He had his hands around her neck before she hit him with the shopping basket, he was dragging her back into the shop with his hands around her neck. And even if it did happen the other way round, in what world is putting your hands around someone's neck self defence???

Whether she’d shoplifted or not, grabbing her by the throat and ragging her all over the shop is unnecessary at the very least.
I think it would be instinctive human reaction to try and wallop them with whatever you’re holding in that scenario.

Thank you, I couldn't read the time stamp on the one of her hitting him.

Yep. Hands around her neck at about 12:59:46, she goes for him at around 13:00:56. The sequence is clear.

Do people not think that those protesting against the shop had the intelligence to check what happened? Why are people saying the woman was shoplifting when not even the shopkeeper has said this?

People choosing to see what they want to see basically.

Ghandi was racist. He campaigned for black people to have to queue separately because he thought they were lower.

The idea that only white people can be racist is ridiculous. Racism exists in many forms and we should not minimise it.

So what do you call helping yourself to stock?!

Maybe she was trying to walk out the shop with an armful of stuff because he wouldn't give her a refund. Maybe she was taking the value of an exchange.

Maybe she hit out first.

Either way, that's all irrelevant because he's practically twice her size and grabbed her by the throat and dragged her round the room.

My dh is bigger and stronger than me. If, big example here, I were to hit him, his response wouldn't be self defence, or attack, he doesn't need to defend himself, I can't inflict any damage. He wouldn't raise a hand in any way.

This woman couldn't do anything to that man so his response should have been to block the door and call the police if he had an issue, not start attacking the woman like that.

I hope he loses his business and gets prosecuted.

This.

But - where is the racism here? I am not seeing it, unless there’s an audio to it that I haven’t heard. Just because someone attacks someone of a different race doesn’t automatically make it racist.

I grew up in that area. I went to school about 5 mins away from that particular street. I was one of only 2 white girls in my whole school. We had so much racism directed towards us - we’d sit in front of people in assembly and they’d whisper (loudly on purpose) “nits, white hair nits” and act like they were going to catch nits from us. It was horrible and relentless. Anyway, that’s a bit off topic but I have experienced racism as a white person.

He shouldn’t have strangled her.

Just because someone attacks someone of a different race doesn’t automatically make it racist

Honestly, I don't think he would have done that to a white woman.

Do we see the whole video ie the bits leading up to it and the follow on at the end or only the bits that stir up mob violence.

The allegation is that the woman wanted a refund which is not the policy of the shop, as the items are cosmetics and hair. It quickly became verbally aggressive, from both, the woman appears to try to exchange the items herself, or 'help herself'. From there it becomes physical.

My dh is bigger and stronger than me. If, big example here, I were to hit him, his response wouldn't be self defence, or attack, he doesn't need to defend himself, I can't inflict any damage

Do you really think that you couldn't hurt him at all? Even if you continued to attack? I don't buy that.. A child can hurt an adult, look at all the threads about people being injured by their child, let alone a grown woman. An ex friend broke her husband's ribs. Of course there's a large difference in strength but you certainly could hurt him.

I also think it’s hugely worrying that his first instinct is to place his hands around her neck.

Whether she shoplifted or not, whether she shouted or not, to strangle her on instinct is very concerning.

But that’s just guesswork. You may be right, you may be wrong but you can’t call it racist on the basis of something hypothetical.

Intersectionalism- black men are above black women in the social hierarchy.

Having watched the video, he seems to be standing in the doorway ,he uses his phone, she approaches the exit carrying items , she then seems to slap/hit him when he tries to prevent her leaving. After that it becomes mayhem, with both kicking/hitting each other and he then puts his hands round her throat before grabbing her arms. I can't hear what is being said, not sure if there is audio. She seems to have been arrested and bailed. BTW, the BBC aren't showing the video 'for legal reasons'.

That appears to be exactly what happened. Should this guy have touched her neck, no.

Should she have kicked and hit him with s shopping basket before that happened? No.

She started it and was very foolish. He could have hurt her badly. But he did not.

It's Peckham Hair and Cosmetics. You won't find too many white women shopping there anyway

The media are shit-stirrers . The Guardian ends with 3racist incidents - it doesn’t mention the knives police have managed to remove from teens, the number of arrested drug dealers, the help some member of staff/nurse/ random member of the public gave to a random person on the street/ in the railway station / on the bus which probably happens all the time-Twitter is the same and the lemmings just follow with their hate. The population of London is 13 million. Instead see this incident as it is -an angry woman trying to break the law and an angry man trying to stop her.
Both in the wrong.

My dh is bigger and stronger than me. If, big example here, I were to hit him, his response wouldn't be self defence, or attack, he doesn't need to defend himself, I can't inflict any damage
Hope you're never in a jury with a male victim of DV, ignorant comment.

You can't say "he isn't necessarily racist!!!" But then say "but the police are!!!!" We don't have evidence either are. Stop finding any way to slate the police. Its a narrow minded and frankly insulting approach.

Being arrested means nothing. Its an initial reaction based on loose evidence, hence the investigation after the fact. Why are you surprised they take the word of a pissed off shop owner against a petty thief regardless of their sex/race? I imagine they would arrest a white bloke should he be the one accused of stealing from a small business owner. They presumably changed their mind after seeing the CCTV.

They very well might be racist and sexist. But you can't point fingers based on the fact they arrested a black woman who was accused of committing a crime. What's the other option? Letting all black people and women go at risk of being sexist/racist?

It's really hard to tell exactly what happened as not all videos are time stamped.

But it looks like 1st video was one where she was walking out he was blocking her, his hands raised on front off chest she had arm full off stuff (refund/stolen no evidence). She picks up basket and starts using as a weapon, hitting him over head.

Then one inside shop where he is holding her by neck and she is hitting over head with basket to point handle breaks off.

Then I think the one where she is chasing him behind till and hitting him on head with basket handle.

However video from just the guardian article makes it look very different.

We aren't talking about dv, we are talking about an unprovoked attack that some people are trying to defend using a self defense argument. So stop with the whatabouttery.

My dh is bigger, broader, stronger than me. He is stocky and all muscle. If I were to punch him, it wouldn't do anything 🤷‍♀️

The same way I doubt this woman could have hurt this shopkeeper in any significant way. She may have landed blows but I doubt she hurt him enough that he needed to use self defense. Restrain her, maybe, but not drag her round the room by her throat.

He has no argument of self defense for what he did.

Presumably the police can watch the footage in order, take statements and if needed interview the many witnesses. Given the amount of daylight on this incident they'll have the full picture in due course.

They aren't judge and jury every time they're called out, they're potentially at the start of an investigation.