Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Chat

Join the discussion and chat with other Mumsnetters about everyday life, relationships and parenting.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
8
SouthernFashionista · 14/09/2023 14:49

It’s a pretty sad reflection on the community then @Lndnmummy Outright racism towards the shop owner and gleeful support of someone who has committed a crime. Seriously? I suspect many Peckham residents have a different perspective. I don’t think the shopkeeper has covered himself in glory here but the things that have been said about him are abhorrent.

Lndnmummy · 14/09/2023 15:00

Nemesias · 14/09/2023 13:45

You’re just flat out making things up now - nobody is baying for her blood - nobody has said anything about it “being warranted based on her demographic”.

pointing out that this woman is not the innocent some people wish to make her out to be doesn’t make us racist - the man has been almost unanimously denounced by everyone for his actions, there has been no outpouring of love for him - absolute rot for you to suggest there has been. on a par with the poster who confidently said the man used a chokehold on her when it’s patently not true

Show quote history

Couple of things to explore here.

  1. Do you think this thread would have gone like this had the woman been white?

  2. Her innocence (your words). Can you really not see that this rhetoric very much plays into what @DeeCeeCherry is saying about (black) victim blaming and her metaphorically speaking of 'baying for her blood'.

What does this woman's 'innocence' have to do with anything? If YOUR daughter has a disagreement with a shop owner, are you happy for him to choke her?

The majority of this thread put us white people to shame and the endless whataboutery is this week's 'i'm not racist, but....' on mumsnet.

parameciumparty · 14/09/2023 15:07

Lndnmummy · 14/09/2023 15:00

Couple of things to explore here.

  1. Do you think this thread would have gone like this had the woman been white?

  2. Her innocence (your words). Can you really not see that this rhetoric very much plays into what @DeeCeeCherry is saying about (black) victim blaming and her metaphorically speaking of 'baying for her blood'.

What does this woman's 'innocence' have to do with anything? If YOUR daughter has a disagreement with a shop owner, are you happy for him to choke her?

The majority of this thread put us white people to shame and the endless whataboutery is this week's 'i'm not racist, but....' on mumsnet.

Show quote history

It wasn't a 'disagreement' she was physically attacking him.

I'd be saying exactly the same about the woman if she was white.

PiIlock · 14/09/2023 15:11

She plainly attacked the guy. Why lie and downplay her behaviour? Genuinely, why?

parameciumparty · 14/09/2023 15:11

Don't you think it's racist not to hold black people to the same standards as white/Asian/Chinese/Hispanic people?

People shouldn't shoplift or commit violence regardless of their ethnicity.

PiIlock · 14/09/2023 15:12

Does it make her less of a victim on your eyes ldnmummy if she's not a perfect victim? I don't see the issue in holding her accountable for her own behaviour and him for his.

loislovesstewie · 14/09/2023 15:13

At work, I have dealt with many totally obnoxious people. They came in all shapes, sizes, nationalities, ethnicities, and as i said earlier, some came in wanting to have an argument, or couldn't understand that what they wanted just couldn't happen. So they started shouting or throwing stuff about. I would say the same no matter who this woman was, she seemed to want what she couldn't have, kicked off, tried to steal goods and then mayhem happened. There are people everywhere who do this . It's wrong in every case.
Why not take the moral high ground if you have to complain? Be polite, but accept no does mean no.

Justanotherlurker · 14/09/2023 15:16

Lndnmummy · 14/09/2023 14:47

That is exactly what it means. Thankfully, our local community is a far far cry from mumsnet.

Show quote history

Yeah, there is some very welcoming posters added there, including such highlights as 'Patel go home', the parasite one I mentioned earlier, and others that would break mumsnet talk guidelines...

inamarina · 14/09/2023 15:17

Lndnmummy · 14/09/2023 14:47

That is exactly what it means. Thankfully, our local community is a far far cry from mumsnet.

Show quote history

That is exactly what it means.

That’s what you assume, and some people will agree with you, while others might not.
In the end if the day, none of us knows what users on a anonymous forum really think.
FWIW, I personally don’t think it’s even relevant whether what the shop owner did was technically choking or not, because it looked quite aggressive and intimidating in any case, and was definitely wrong. That’s what most people on here are saying.
But you @Lndnmummy , do you see any issues with how the woman was behaving at all?

DeeCeeCherry · 14/09/2023 15:31

Lndnmummy
Thankfully, our local community is a far far cry from mumsnet

Thankfully indeed. It wasn't just Black people at the protest, its people who are part of the community and know its history and background and arent standing for this. The nasty parts of this thread are meaningless in the face of that. The most important thing - shop remains closed. Black Women and supporters made very clear we'd no longer be spending money there. & thats that.

Justanotherlurker · 14/09/2023 15:40

Thankfully indeed. It wasn't just Black people at the protest, its people who are part of the community and know its history and background and arent standing for this.

What is the history and background that warrants the reaction of some of those posters, it sounds awfully close to the rhetoric from the likes of the far right with regards to 'others' moving in.....

Nemesias · 14/09/2023 15:41

Lndnmummy · 14/09/2023 15:00

Couple of things to explore here.

  1. Do you think this thread would have gone like this had the woman been white?

  2. Her innocence (your words). Can you really not see that this rhetoric very much plays into what @DeeCeeCherry is saying about (black) victim blaming and her metaphorically speaking of 'baying for her blood'.

What does this woman's 'innocence' have to do with anything? If YOUR daughter has a disagreement with a shop owner, are you happy for him to choke her?

The majority of this thread put us white people to shame and the endless whataboutery is this week's 'i'm not racist, but....' on mumsnet.

Show quote history

I don’t think she is innocent at all. Other posters seem to think that the man’s one action of a hand on the woman’s throat immediately absolves her of any wrong doing even though her prolonged aggressive assault on him could objectively be seen as worse than what he did. And what he did was WRONG and he shouldn’t have done it and he should be arrested for it. What if he hadn’t put his hand on her neck and had only restrained her by the arm? What would your view be then?

i would readily condemn aggressive violent behaviour from a white woman - I don’t know why you think this is some sort of gotcha

AmIAutumnalNow · 14/09/2023 15:47

This thread is crazy

Double standards all round.

inamarina · 14/09/2023 15:49

Lndnmummy · 14/09/2023 15:00

Couple of things to explore here.

  1. Do you think this thread would have gone like this had the woman been white?

  2. Her innocence (your words). Can you really not see that this rhetoric very much plays into what @DeeCeeCherry is saying about (black) victim blaming and her metaphorically speaking of 'baying for her blood'.

What does this woman's 'innocence' have to do with anything? If YOUR daughter has a disagreement with a shop owner, are you happy for him to choke her?

The majority of this thread put us white people to shame and the endless whataboutery is this week's 'i'm not racist, but....' on mumsnet.

Show quote history

If a white woman started physically attacking a shop owner because they refused her a refund and tried to stop her from shoplifting, and they consequently grabbed her around her neck, I would criticise both of them, yes.
If my daughter started pushing and shoving a shopkeeper, and bashing them around the head with a basket, because she wasn’t getting what she wanted, I would question my parenting skills.

AmIAutumnalNow · 14/09/2023 15:50

SouthernFashionista · 14/09/2023 14:49

It’s a pretty sad reflection on the community then @Lndnmummy Outright racism towards the shop owner and gleeful support of someone who has committed a crime. Seriously? I suspect many Peckham residents have a different perspective. I don’t think the shopkeeper has covered himself in glory here but the things that have been said about him are abhorrent.

Now the reaction of the "community" is definitely racist

Calling the shopkeeper a parasite. Very uncomfortable parallels

I wonder why these posts aren't deleted for "minimising racism"

Hestia2023 · 14/09/2023 16:40

Yes some of the posters plastered on the shop front in Peckham are definitely racist. The parasite ones in particular are very uncomfortable. The sign saying ‘it’s not just this shop, it’s all of them’ - so basically judging all Asian shops for the behaviour of one man? Alongside BLM signs? Can nobody see the irony in that?

I thought that in this country we were trying to move past judging a whole ethnic group on the behaviour of individuals….

Museya15 · 14/09/2023 18:33

PiIlock · 14/09/2023 12:24

@inamarina agree

It's impossible to tell from this brawl whether shop owner or lady were racist here.

Can absolutely say that implying Asian people are parasites is racist. Telling them to get out of your community is nasty and racist. The irony is off the charts for whoever put that sign up

Literally no different to saying black propel should be deported when one person does something. The exact same.

But I'm willing to bet the person who did that will say they can't be racist because they don't have systemic power. I have relatives who don't like Asian people. Black people can be racist. Asian people can be racist.

This is one big tug of war

Irony is lost on them mate! I just had a conversation with someone from Uganda that lives in London, she says she and others from Uganda want the likes of idi amin back in power as he booted foreigners out that were taking theirs jobs, houses etc. I just wanted to laugh, it was so ironic.

bombastix · 14/09/2023 23:07

Idi Amin, a brutal tyrant that killed many. His supporters then and now were violent fools.

The racism in calling shopkeepers parasites. Pure envy and ready to justify violence against them. Still ignorance from 50 years ago. If that's what inspires Peckham protests you can keep it.

EasternStandard · 15/09/2023 06:58

bombastix · 14/09/2023 23:07

Idi Amin, a brutal tyrant that killed many. His supporters then and now were violent fools.

The racism in calling shopkeepers parasites. Pure envy and ready to justify violence against them. Still ignorance from 50 years ago. If that's what inspires Peckham protests you can keep it.

Agree on the term parasites

Those posters who are glad the shop is shut do you support this language?

Iwasafool · 15/09/2023 10:42

bombastix · 14/09/2023 23:07

Idi Amin, a brutal tyrant that killed many. His supporters then and now were violent fools.

The racism in calling shopkeepers parasites. Pure envy and ready to justify violence against them. Still ignorance from 50 years ago. If that's what inspires Peckham protests you can keep it.

The attitude to the Asian shopkeeper, and it seems Asian shopkeepers in general, reminds me of attitudes to Jewish business people in the past. Was it Idi Amin who said Asians were the Jews of Africa? It isn't pleasant to witness.

BethDuttonsTwin · 16/09/2023 06:38

This situation didn’t take off in quite the way The Activists who raced to protest had hoped it would did it? All gone rather quiet. You just can’t make it stick when it’s two POC, but they won’t let that stop them from trying.

AmIAutumnalNow · 16/09/2023 11:04

BethDuttonsTwin · 16/09/2023 06:38

This situation didn’t take off in quite the way The Activists who raced to protest had hoped it would did it? All gone rather quiet. You just can’t make it stick when it’s two POC, but they won’t let that stop them from trying.

Have they all packed up and taken their racist protest home?

lollipoprainbow · 16/09/2023 11:46

There's a video doing the rounds on twitter of her shoplifting before so she has form. Maybe the handwringers on here should take a look.

Nemesias · 16/09/2023 12:30

BethDuttonsTwin · 16/09/2023 06:38

This situation didn’t take off in quite the way The Activists who raced to protest had hoped it would did it? All gone rather quiet. You just can’t make it stick when it’s two POC, but they won’t let that stop them from trying.

They were probably in the first instance told the incident involved “strangulation”, “throttling” and “chokeholds” - maybe someone even mentioned murder, as inexplicably came up here. Then found out that wasn’t quite what happened?

bombastix · 16/09/2023 12:34

@Iwasafool - it's very revealing of a seam of racism against those who are "Asian".

Who benefits from this I wonder? When a mob turns up that is organized. I would not want to live around there. Suggests people are being manipulated.