Kevin Spacey

[Gotmygladragson]

Just saw the not guilty verdict. I haven’t been following it closely but from the bits I have seen, I’m surprised. Was this what was expected?

And how is that illegal?

From the media leading up to the trial I thought that he was guilty. But a jury found him innocent, and they have been given far more information than any of us.

@ThatshallotBaby - from your post I assume he was rebuffed and that was the end of it?

Some gay men are attracted to younger gay men and some younger gay men like older gay men. It doesn't mean there has been criminal behaviour.

Juries are not stupid and it's for them to decide the facts. The judge provides direction as to the law. As none of us has sat through the proceedings in court or seen any of the materials which may have been shown to the jury, I don't think any of us can or should sit in judgement, whatever our views as to the morality of Kevin Spacey's conduct.

I don’t think it was particularly pleasant @Motnight. He’s not gay.

He's been found not guilty. That should be the end of it. Anything else is "trial by social media" or "vigilante justice". People shouldn't incur sanctions of any sort (including being pilloried on social media) because randoms who have limited information decide someone has done something. We use criminal courts to decide on someone's guilt or otherwise and to dispense justice for a reason.

He put on the performances of his lifetime in that courtroom, he deserves all the acting awards for it.

And you were in the courtroom foe the entire trial?

If not, how do you know?

"foe " = "for".

You’re deeply naive if you thought it was going to be anything other than ‘not guilty’.

In sexual assault cases, there are zero witnesses.

The accused could be (usually is) guilty as sin. All their lawyer has to do is plant reasonable doubt (they believed it was consensual, for example), and they walk scot-free.

Rapists and assaultists know this full well - they have the green light to behave with impunity. 🤷🏻‍♀️

This. He had a wide spread bad reputation in the Bath Houses he frequented back in the 90s.

But I'm not at all surprised at the verdict. Victims of sexual assault very rarely get justice.

So evidence doesn't matter?

Just the accusation which must believed?

So if I was to accuse you of paedophilia I must be believed?

Not a society I want to belong to.

Right, the trusty rumour mill. I knew a girl in school who had a reputation of being the town slut, a real trollop. Fucked every bloke she laid eyes on.

None of it was true.

Kevin Spacy is a lucky man! Those were serious charges and it could have gone either way.

I have half-followed the trial. He does seem to have a hell of a lot of accusations against him - and the celebrity witnesses telling stories about parties was bizarre and didn’t seem relevant. Michael Jackson’s legal team made the same tactic - dazzle the jury with celebrities - and he got away with his crimes. I’m inclined to believe that KS is very much a predator but I’d have to read more about this particular case before I cast judgment on the alleger victims

I referr you to my response to @TooBigForMyBoots.

No, you've already decided.

"I’m inclined to believe that KS is very much a predator".

I agree with you.

Harvey Weinstein was ‘only’ creepy towards certain women. Doesn’t mean he didn’t harm others.

It’s a shame gay men are viewed so lowly on MN - if this was women accusing Spacey everyone would be up in arms.

This. Everyone is happy to F the star and then they want to dig around in what they think are deep pockets.

These hangers-on disgust me.

Historic sex crimes are near impossible to prove. Even when there are multiple victims. When he said he "couldn't remember" if he'd had sex with a particular 14 year old boy, I think I formed the correct opinion of him, and the verdict doesn't change that.

So evidence doesn't matter?

What evidence? The victims either didn't report him at the time from fear they wouldn't be believed, or did try and weren't believed. No evidence was taken. And the same thing will probably repeat itself in the USA soon enough where he has more accusers. Lovely chap.

Juries are not stupid

Jurors are regular people with absolutely no legal training and an inherent bias. The chances are a great deal of them are very stupid indeed

He’s had 40 men come forward with accusations. I think it’s unlikely that they’re all lying. Many rumours have circulated for years about his creepy predatory behaviour.

With regard to this trial and I believe the 4 alleger victims, like I say I don’t know enough to form an opinion on his guilt (or not-guilt) either way.

It’s all quite an interesting social experiment too - people cannot stand to see their favourite actor/performer being anything other than a saint. MJ, Johnny Depp - why do people jump to deciding someone being good at their job means they can’t be a bad person when they clearly are.

Are you seriously suggesting that a group of people can’t be manipulated by a highly skilled legal team or that the legal system isn’t flawed in any way

I don’t think people realise that statements ARE evidence.

The PP who said “imagine if I accused you of being a pedophile what would you do”. Well assuming you 2 have never met I imagine that accusation wouldn’t go far, the story is implausible. But these men DID know and work with Spacey, they do have plausible stories and police and CPS know what an honest story looks like.

Are you seriously suggesting that a group of 12 people can have their common sense overruled by some lwwyers rhetoric?

They can certainly have reasonable doubt planted….?

You trust every members of the public’s common sense?

You have more faith in the intelligence of random people than I do.

My brother served on a jury and said he’d be surprised if at least half the people could even count to ten let alone make a serious decision about a person’s life and In deliberations so many had a total misunderstanding of what they were meant to do or what had been said.