Overheard something quite personal

[User5653218]

I was walking along the road and I could hear someone in a parked car having a chat on a hands free speaker. She had all her windows open and the speaker was really loud.

She was a carer for a care company, logo on the car. I couldn't really make out what the person in the car was saying but the person on the speakerphone could be heard clear as day by anyone nearby. They were obviously discussing the clients they had visited this morning and the speakerphone person said "when I went into Mary at number 14 this morning she had shat herself in her chair again" then they both started laughing.

Mary is not her real name, it is a very distinctive name, so I knew straight away who they were talking about. She's an elderly lady I know quite well. She would be mortified if she knew anyone walking past that car at that time knew that about her. And the car was parked just round the corner from her house so there's a good chance that anyone walking past might work out who they were talking about.

I stopped at the car and said "excuse me, I could hear really clearly what was being said on your speaker, I know the person you are laughing about."

The woman said "oh ffs, we're just having a laugh. Do you fancy wiping old women's bums after they've been sat in their own shit for god knows how long?"

And I said "No I wouldn't, I'm glad you're able to do it, but maybe you could just close your window or not use your speaker, then no-one would hear you"

She said "oh fuck off".

So I left.

Should I report them to their agency? I don't want to get them in trouble, they do do a job many people couldn't, but I know Mary would be devastated if she knew I'd heard that. I'm so angry for her. She's such a lovely lady, she tries so hard to keep her independence and dignity despite all her health problems.

I toyed with telling her, but it would just upset her and I'm not sure how easy it would be for her to find alternative care anyway, there's not much to choose from round our way. And I don't know if she would then be too embarrassed to speak to me. She doesn't have family, if she had a son or daughter I might have spoken to them.

But it makes me so angry that these women were laughing about her and that they will still be doing her personal care. Am I over-reacting? Were they just letting off steam after their early morning shift? It is a tough job, I have no doubt it's not fun to start your day with that. But that is their job and their clients can't help it. I'm sure they don't want to be like this either.

What would you do? I'm thinking I'll tell the agency but not Mary. Or is it enough that I spoke to the person in the car and maybe they'll think about it in future, even if they were rude to me at the time?

I guess I could do a semi-anonymous report where I just say that I overheard some chat in a car and could they please remind their staff to be discreet when having conversations in a public place, rather than give details?

Please tell the agency.

Obviously don't tell Mary. That's mortifying. But ABSOLUTELY tell the employer. Don't listen to the scare mongering of "if these people leave, Mary will have no-one and she'll go into a home or die". Ffs. Care companies have extremely high turnover. This will be nothing new and will have very little impact. If these employees are fired, others will cover the visit and others will be employed. Mary likely pays for her care (even if only a proportion) so these means it needs to be reported even more so.

Report report !!! Because not everyone can / would be a carer and most defiantly a hell of a lot shouldn’t !!! This comes from me working in a caring profession and hated the way patients were dealt with ! it’s not the over hearing that gets me the most as yes they could just have been letting off steam and when in that type of job the Language is a lot less “proper”than most areas of life but it was the way she spoke to you that would worry me . That’s tells me her character , If that’s how she is to the public and doesn’t give a damn about Mary being spoken about then I feel sorry for Mary .
I wouldn’t trust her and wouldn’t want her near my family member !!

Thank you for your concern for “Mary.” You are entirely correct in putting her welfare first.

there are a number of issues here, clearly Mary’s care plan is incorrect and inadequate if she is being “left to sit in her own excrement.”

so there are two things you must do. Either contact her GP, if you know them, or otherwise the district nurse. Also context the manager of the care company and advise that unless the care improves you will report them to the CQC.

anyone needing care should be treated dignity. Please don’t tell “Mary” what the head doesn’t know the heart won’t grieve over. However, please visit “Mary” and whilst chatting to her ask her what her opinion of the carers are.

I would have reported the whole conversation immediately. I used to be a District Nurse, and this makes my blood boil. Elderly patients are as vulnerable as babies, they deserve our upmost respect

Absolutely report them!
not only was she disclosing info for the world to hear about Mary; but telling you to F off…
For all she knows you’re Mary’s relative. There are good and bad carers; and she’s exactly what Mary was sat in.
I cared for my grandparents; it’s awful; but I sure as hell wouldn’t sit in my car on speaker describing and laughing at their bowel movements…

I wouldn't hesitate in telling the company - this is the height of disrespect! My father has carers and if I knew someone was speaking about him in this way, I would then wonder what their level of care and respect towards him was like?

I absolutely would NOT speak to Mary. Mary deserves all the discretion, love and care you can muster - but absolutely speak up on her behalf. Those two should be struck off. They should be ashamed of themselves!!

Disgusting! Please tell the agency.

i definitely wouldn’t want someone like that looking after anyone that I know!

You need to inform the care agency. We all have a duty of care as I feel this could be a form of institutional abuse. If the carer responds to you in that manner I have concerns how they treat people they 'care' for especially those that don't have capacity. Don't let Mary down and speak to the manager of the care agency (you can check registered managers details on CQC website. I work in commissioning and if this was fed back to me, I would be contacting the agency and safeguarding.

In my experience nothing happens when you complain about so called carers.

I shudder at the treatment being meted out to our old people.

Report them to the company, I certainly would. I know they do an under paid undervalued job but nobody deserves to be spoken about that way. If they can’t do it without complaining and being disgusting about their patients they don’t deserve to have a job. Hopefully that will leave open the door for people that are more caring, the kind of people that do the work for the love of the patient/client. If they have any decency, they would at least do this kind of conversation in private, not where they can be overheard. Community nurses are just the same, I worked with them and they were disgusting about their patients too. I hope I did before I ever need care or community nursing.

don’t mention it to Mary, I’m sure she would be mortified.

I'm a carer, REPORT REPORT REPORT, if a carer can talk like this to you in public just think how she is speaking to Mary behind closed doors. Disgraceful !!! lots of red flags here

Report them to the agency. Would you want someone like that looking after an elderly relative of yours? And her attitude towards you says it all really.

Tell the company, but not Mary.

I would add, when writing to the company, that you are also reporting them to the relevant regulators / writing to Age Concern / your MP about the indignity, etc. Only that way will they do something about it.

What?!?

Yeah, lets just carry on with our day whilst someone vulnerable gets laughed about for their vulnerability by the very people who are responsible for caring for her, and take pay for doing so.

Definitely report it. That was totally unprofessional of both of them. They both need a written warning from the company. I would never talk about a client/ patient outside of work. I had reason to reprimand 3 student nurses once. I was standing at the local bus stop near my hospital and they were discussing how "gross" one patient was. I knew this person as they were a neighbour of mine. So I told them to change the subject or end up in the CNM3's office. Their jaws dropped as they hadn't recognised me out of uniform. Nobody, from the kitchen assistant to the CNM3 should ever reveal patient details, they have a right to absolute privacy.

You should tell the company. If the carers are that disrespectful and uncaring towards their clients, they should not be working with them. That should be a disciplinary action. Imagine how upset the client’s family would be for her. Secondly, the caring profession needs to be upheld as one which is valuable, worthwhile, and deserving of respect. Carers such as these, if left to carry on like that, will drag it down and that will effectively affect the elderly or vulnerable clients badly. I don’t know this lady but I’m upset for her just reading your post. It needs reporting

Well, there's no doubt the girl in the car is a foul-mouthed jerk. Unfortunately, that's very common these days. But the person on speaker who made the comments might be the one you dealt with at the agency or company, hence not interested.

Regardless of how the company handles it, you should never, ever, ever tell Mary or anyone else what you overheard, especially other neighbors. You took it where your conscience led you, now drop it.

I have a friend who's a nurse in a hospital. She's very caring and sweet, and would never think of saying something mean, foul, or cruel about a patient. But some of the things she's told me that other nurses have occasionally said about a specific patient are unbelievable from people who are supposed to care. Now, that specific patient might be a demanding pain in the butt, but still...

My aging aunt once asked me to take her to a store she enjoyed going to, but a little while later, I couldn't find her. Up and down aisles... talked to the cashiers... no one had seen her. I decided to check the restroom (loo). She was there, embarrassed beyond belief. She had made a terrible mess. My heart broke for her and her embarrassment as I cleaned her up and washed out her clothes. I never told ANYONE about that while she was alive, and only mentioned it to someone years later when a similar subject came up.

What those two on the phone were too stupid to realize is that they may very well be there someday if fortune let's them live long enough.

definitely tell the company no doubt.

I'd be so tempted to tell the company but not sure I would. Not because they don't deserve to be told off but because carers are in short supply everywhere.
Its not as simple as replacing the carer, there might not be any spare carers and then what?
Whatever you do don't tell Mary. She would feel humiliated and doesn't deserve that.

Also, sorry! I feel that it’s really not necessary or helpful to mention anything g to ‘Mary’. It might upset her deeply and irreparably which would be such a shame. Do report the whole incident/conversation to the company, in order to help them understand how negatively this staff member is representing them, and also to support your feeling on it.

Light relief banter between colleagues to let off steam is one thing. Doing it loudly in such a way that any passing member of the public could hear the conversation clearly, and saying stuff that identifies the client is a gross breach of confidentiality.

Would you be happy if your GP was sat in your street broadcasting your medical history to your neighbours? It's no different

Absolutely have a laugh. I work in healthcare with regular patients and there were ones who we used to dread for whatever reason. We would discuss it together. Never would we discuss it in earshot of the general public, this is a breach In confidentiality especially since the passer-by knew the patient in this case.

Would you consider it banter if it were your parents being spoken about like that?

Report her for one breaking confidentiality talking like that and swearing at you that is not ok when representing a company you work for while in uniform or company car etc. If she so happily and easily swore at you she maybe doing this to the vulnerable people she cares for and definitely needs to be looked into. Imho