Parenting trends that can get in the bin

[PiratesEatTrolls]

Permissive/passive parenting labelled as gentle - no, little Jimmy not wanting to play with your DC is not a natural consequence for squirting him repeatedly and directly in the face from 2ft away with a super soaker, despite being asked to 'stop please darling, he doesn't like it, oh look, he's crying'....a natural consequence would be removing the super soaker

Never saying 'no' as a principle- fair enough (not really), but if you're DC is being violent, I sure as hell will tell them no

Neutrals neutrals neutrals and no plastic tat - let them have some stuff they like! Buy it second hand of you want to be eco but let them have the odd bit of tat/character pyjamas that make them happy, why not 🤷🏼‍♀️

70s working class kid. My parents didn’t really smack. I think there was an attitude that a smacked bottom, or wrist was ok, anything more severe was not considered the norm within my peer group.
Corporal punishment stopped as I was leaving primary school, don’t remember anyone ever getting the cane from the headmaster, but playground folklore kept us in check.
We were punished in school for misbehaving by being made to stand facing the wall outside headmasters office during break times, a punishment still being used in some schools.
Earlier parenting styles may not be perfect, but parents from that era were not all abusive arseholes beating their children.

I think of myself as a gentle parent, but to me that means saying ‘no’ in a firm but not angry tone and removing/distracting the child, as well as praising good behaviour, as opposed to shouting at them or constant punishment for normal toddler behaviour like pulling things/messing about at the table. Maybe that’s not actually gentle parenting!

For me the parenting trend that can get right in the bin is obsessing over food. Constant terror over a child eating normal food like spaghetti bolognese or rice crispies and obsession over how much they eat, when they eat, when they snack. Provide three normal meals and plenty of fruit and veg and you’re really unlikely to damage your child or have them starve to death.

Empty threats. 'Do that again and we're off!' kid does it again, because they're used to toothless threats. Nothing happens.

'Right then, I'm off, BYE!' passive aggressively from the park because you cba to actually pick your toddler up and get them in the pram to go/carry them out/implement the boundary that it is actually time to leave the park. Fabulous. Either your kid knows you're full of it and doesn't care at all and merrily keeps playing, or your child panics and actually thinks you would just leave them somewhere in public and walk away. Excellent parenting that, destined to produce secure and healthy adults.

Violence. Still seen as acceptable in some places. And screaming at your child. Saw a parent say to a toddler the other day 'if you don't fucking shut your mouth now I'll do it for you' in a crowded park. Imagine the abuse they mete out at home, unseen. It's heartbreaking.

I guess the thing is that neither of these is the ideal. Small babies playing near older children should be supervised. If this incident did occur you could remove the toy, say ‘we don’t hit’ in a calm but firm voice, and remove the child after checking on the baby.

People seem to think there is nothing in between ‘oh darling don’t kick people off the cliff’ and grabbing the child and screaming at them. There is something in between.

DH and I have a game where we give each other the eye when we hear parents using threats like this.

Once in a queue we heard a woman threaten "No McDonald's for tea", "Going straight to bed when you get home", "No iPad" AND removal of toys. Children took no notice to the clearly false threats. She then plonked an iPad on the child in a pram and declared it was time to go to McDonalds...

Parents who never say 'no' / never put their foot down about anything

Parents who make empty threats

Parents who shout at their 2 or 3 year old to 'be careful'. Your child has no idea what that means! If they're heading towards something dangerous then get off your bum and move them!

Long explanations/ far too many options for young children

Totally agree about children being semi permanently attached to a screen, or parents with ear buds in while pushing child in buggy. It's downright sad

I've just out of interest looked up what Sarah Ockwell Smith says about toddler hitting and it wasn't really long explanations of feelings. It sounded more like you start with 'we don't hit people, that's not kind', and then having prevented the hitting you move on to 'I think you hit X because you were cross'. I reckon my toddler could understand that. Actually we did do more or less what she says about biting - DS was biting us quite regularly and we could see the signs, so we'd just say 'do you want to bite me?' and he'd say 'yes' (toddlers can't lie!) so we'd say 'well you can't do that but you can bite this towel instead'. After a few times he'd ask for the towel, and the problem was solved.

And doing this at the dining table!

(Additional needs excepted)

Screens at the table are rude.

To be honest this is not a kid issue. I think this is a trickle down of an adult issue. Quite a few times when out with SIL or friends I’ve been a bit annoyed by people checking their phones. To me if you’re sitting eating dinner with someone you should be chatting together, not scrolling your phone. Obviously sometimes you may need to take an important call but do you need to check instagram and WhatsApp every 10 minutes?

I don't doubt it works for some children. These are the types of things my friends say though, and they haven't worked. Why should my child have to endure a friend screaming next to them because friend's go on the swing ended? Meanwhile mum is saying 'I know your feel cross'. Honestly, I don't think there's anything wrong with telling a 4 year old to stop being so silly, there's no reason to be upset. In school, there's not time to individually deal with tears for every tiny little thing and the children cope just fine. But I know parents who subscribe to gentle parenting will generally disagree with me. That's fine, but don't tell me (not you specifically, in general I mean) that the problem is I don't understand what GP is.

@226GramsOfTuppenyRice yeah, I was more thinking of the stereotype that GP is massive long, boring, non-age-appropriate explanations! Based on that I was actually surprised to see that the examples given were very short. SOS also says somewhere that you can predict what is likely to cause the behaviour and just avoid getting into that situation in the first place, which it sounds like your friends could maybe be doing more of. My DC is only two though so I think it's fair enough that he thinks it's upsetting when thwarted. I might be a bit annoying at the playground cos (a) I'm not going to let him hog the climbing frame by just sitting on it when another kid wants it, so I'll move him away but (b) I'm also not going to tell him not to cry about it if he feels sad (plus he'd still cry anyway).

(I don't actually describe myself as a gentle parent, btw, as I think it sounds really tedious)

How could you avoid getting in the situation of a preschool age child having to take turns though? And would it not actually be detrimental?

To me the way to deal with it would be to tell my child ‘we are going to play on the park, and we need to share the swings and slide. If you tantrum, scream, or cry, we will leave and go home right away.’ And then as soon as they scream or cry you leave. Sometimes children should be validated in their feelings and supported with that, but sometimes (screaming because it’s not your turn) they must not be validated in that feeling and told it’s not acceptable.

Well, al feelings should be acceptable. It’s acceptable to be pissed off as a small child that you have to share a swing or slide. All actions are not acceptable, though.

Personally, over my 3 kids, I’ve only twice had to completely remove a tantrumming child from a situation. Both those times they were totally shattered and tbh it was my own fault trying to push them to do too much in a day.

Normally I’d take them somewhere off to the side a bit quieter, validate their feelings, and that would completely diffuse the tantrum. It’s kind of magic actually. And that doesn’t mean long age inappropriate explanations. It just means ‘you’re really upset/disappointed etc. it’s ok to feel that way. It’s not ok to scream in the playground so we can go back once you feel calm and ready’ or similar.

How could you avoid getting in the situation of a preschool age child having to take turns though? And would it not actually be detrimental?

I wouldn't - but I'd know what the likely sources of frustration would be so I'd have done some prep. For my 2-year-old, it wouldn't take much - just a quick chat about how we were going to have to take turns at the park. Then maybe if there were kids waiting while he was on the swings, I'd say 'lots of children want a turn so we're going to get off in 10 more pushes' (rather than just yanking him off with no warning). If he did have a little cry about that, in my experience it wouldn't last long (about 15 seconds) and then he'd be happy again. By the time he's four (as in PP's example), I'll be surprised if he doesn't know how to take turns without getting upset!

(I might be back in 2 years to eat my words).

A better example maybe is the first time DC had a friend round for a playdate he couldn't handle the friend holding any of his toys and had to take himself off to another room for a meltdown. We'd not anticipated this as it was the first time. The next time we talked about it beforehand and said how friend might play with his toys, and he could play with them too. Then he could cope when it actually happened. So I'm not saying 'don't teach to share', more suggesting that some parents are just doing too much of the 'let the kids have the emotions' without doing enough groundwork to teach them how to deal with the situation.

Same could be said when people are drinking really 🤷‍♀️ don’t agree with this - family places shouldn’t require children to be “seen and not heard” 🙄

But in the case of that poster’s experience this is a four year old ruining everyone else’s experience by screaming every time she isn’t being prioritised. I’m sorry but some feelings simply aren’t acceptable. Feeling like you should scream because your friend wants a turn too isn’t acceptable. It’s selfish. It doesn’t do kids much harm to hear that they aren’t number 1 in the world - being angry and screaming that you’re not able to take things from your friends isn’t acceptable! And honestly I think it’s ok to tell a preschool/school age child that. I don’t think that needs to be validated.

Ha same! He eats so much crap now 🤣

Second child I wasn't so strict

@goodkidsmaadhouse

That’s great that your kids have very very rarely tantrummed. In the case I was responding to the four year old (preschool/school age) screams whenever she has had her turn and has to allow someone else to have a turn. I do consider myself a gentle-ish parent but part of that for me is teaching children about proportionate response. I think if I was quickly spiriting my screaming child away whenever they didn’t get a turn of the swing and softly saying they are angry and they’re right to be angry and mummy validates their feelings then I’d be giving them the message that they are correct to react with rage/anger and spoil things for others when it is someone else’s turn. I’d much rather teach them that everyone has to take a turn and part of being a sharer is not spoiling it for your friend!

Maybe I’m not a gentle parent as such, but a more balanced one.

'I’m sorry but some feelings simply aren’t acceptable.'

Separate the feelings from the actions. Feeling angry because it's not your turn is understandable, screaming about it is not acceptable

'So I'm not saying 'don't teach to share', more suggesting that some parents are just doing too much of the 'let the kids have the emotions' without doing enough groundwork to teach them how to deal with the situation.'

Spot on, and really well explained

Ah, but then MN will accuse you of performance aprentibg!

*Parenting

It may be understandable to an extent but I do not think it needs to be validated. Screaming in anger because you enjoyed the swing and now your friend wants to doesn’t really merit the response of being hurried away to be validated in your feelings. Sometimes it is ok to say ‘stop being silly otherwise you won’t get a turn at all, because you’re spoiling Emily’s turn.’

@Kanaloa I'm not sure we actually disagree. I'm saying that the parents of the four year old could have done more, and earlier, to teach their child how to interact with others at the playground. Then she wouldn't be tantrumming and ruining it for everyone else at age four. She'd probably be having a nicer time too.

I actually think the reason gentle parenting might get a bad press is that, if it's done well, you wouldn't see it happening.

@Kanaloa I didn't say they'd very very rarely tantrummed, just that IME I've found that if I genuinely empathised with the feelings causing the tantrum then it would diffuse it almost straight away.
I'm talking more age 2, maybe 3 at a push here by the way. My youngest is 4 now and I'd be extremely shocked if he started screaming because he had to share a swing. So I agree with you that in that example something has gone very wrong!
I've just always found that validating kids' feelings allows them to move on from the feelings. I mean it's the same with adults, isn't it? If I burst into tears and my DH said 'don't be silly, there's nothing to cry about' I wouldn't feel better. But if he gave me a hug and said 'it's ok to be sad' then I probably would.

Yes, possibly. As I said, I would have prepped my child in advance about acceptable/unacceptable behaviour. But I do still disagree about such tactics as taking the child away to validate their feelings - I think that just gives the child the message that this is a normal and proportionate response which it isn’t! And rather than hurry my child away to tell them they’re right to feel angry, I’d simply tell them to stop spoiling their friend’s turn or we’d leave! Which maybe makes me a ‘harsh parent’ instead of a gentle one.