Thread 21. Sunak. How many more will be deserting the sinking ship?

[Roussette]

Here we go. Previous thread.

www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4735780-thread-21-sunak-return-of-the-numpties?page=20&reply=124466839

We had a teacher who was very open and approachable and it was more us students who were embarrassed
(secondary in the 80s Holland)

But then the shower adverts on TV were more revealing than anyting on British tv.

Our sex Ed teacher was so embarrassed by it all that she couldn't even say "masturbation"
She called it "auto eroticism

That wasn't even mentioned when I were a lass! Far too shameful.

Sex is fun? What is this? It is for the sole purpose of procreating, that is all, that is all anyone should be taught

Quite.

I went to a Catholic school (for a while...it didn't take 🙃)
No sex Ed and the only reference to periods was to describe them as "tears of a frustrated womb"
No
I'm not kidding
Early 1980s not 1880s

"No sex Ed and the only reference to periods was to describe them as "tears of a frustrated womb"

Wow 😮

There was a programme on telly maybe 10 years ago tat showed ads from other countries. It was both a highly amusing programme and quite the eye opener.

@DuncinToffee me too! I vividly remember sex ed in our school because it was so sensible and there was actually a lot of good debate in class. But then our biology teacher was also our form tutor and we had bonded as a class.

Needless to say I haven't made the mistake of trusting the UK system to teach my kids about sex, I've done it myself.

Ours was the French teacher. But yes lots of good debate in class.

There are good reasons to be concerned about some aspects of sex and relationship education, the safeguarding of children in schools and undergoing certain treatment under the NHS, as anyone who is familiar with the Cass report will understand.
Having such concerns doesn’t make one a right wing Tory by any means.

I was at school in the 60s, no sex ed. The only detention I ever got was because I drew the male sexual organs out of proportion when copying it from the blackboard

This article wipes the floor with Sunak
www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/mar/08/rent-a-gob-rish-plays-to-the-tory-echo-chamber

Sex education for the ladies in my class consisted of a film of frogs mating. So far, it hasn't made Nigel Farage any more attractive to me.

No, it doesn't. But Sunak is deliberately using contentious, divisive subjects as a diversion. The result is that everyone becomes even more entrenched in their views and the possibility of open and fair debate drowns in toxicity.

My mum used to teach sex education. In the 1980s. (I've probably mentioned this before).

There was massive pushback from the Tory government, it was supposed to be left entirely to parents. However, we had very high rates of teenage pregnancy compared to other countries. My mum was a marriage guidance counsellor and then a social worker for what were termed "unmarried mothers". It was a time when plenty of girls were chucked out of their homes by their parents for getting pregnant and often had to go to mother and baby homes. This was in England by the way.

Sex ex in my school (early to med 90's) was very basic and they also split males and females separately.

We then spent the entire rest of the week day telling the opposite sex what we'd learned. For us girls it was mostly about periods and we were determined the boys would understand it too.

So glad we've move on from that.

I agree. The Tories have jumped on it as a diversion and are giving the impression dodgy RSE is rife in schools, when it actually isn’t. No need for a Tory Crusade about it.

It's quite instructive to watch the programme about the outing of George Michael on C4. the rhetoric about gay sex being unbiological and unnatural is awfully familiar.

Here is a good article, I think

www.theguardian.com/education/2023/mar/08/sex-education-review-is-politically-motivated-say-teaching-unions

Sex ed is essentially shit in my school. Miriam Cates makes things up at will and I wish she would be called out on this , instead of put on a pedestal. RSE needs massive improvement- mainly because kids barely get any and lessons are aught by teachers who don't want to be there, with a bunch of misogamist male students dominating lessons. That is the biggest of the problems.

I don’t agree with the force-teaming of LGB with T, so we’re not going to find common ground there and that’s fine. This is not the thread for it.

RSE at my school is fine, even within the faith framework it has to be in (although I would prefer it not to be in a faith framework for any faith!). It’s the basic biology, taught separately, but boys and girls cover the same topics. We lead into it by having Plant And Animal Reproduction as a topic for the same term.

It’s another cynical Tory ploy. IMMIGRANTS! BENEFIT CHEATS! LEFT WING TEACHERS TELL YOUR KIDS ABOUT RIMMING!
Utter nonsense.

I only realised that Sunak stood at a lectern with 'STOP THE BOAT PEOPLE' plastered across it... was real, when it was on breakfast news this morning. I saw it on Twitter and thought it was a parody up until now.

Just read this on the old thread. I honestly thought the writing was photoshopped on to make Rishi look bad.

The lectern really was beneath contempt. But I think Sunak will live to regret it. That photo will follow him around for the rest of his life.

The result is that everyone becomes even more entrenched in their views and the possibility of open and fair debate drowns in toxicity.

Well yes. But the answer isn’t to try to shut down the debate, ignore inconvenient facts or deride those who hold views non-aligned with one’s own, thereby promoting the toxicity. It does seem to be a particular feature of this issue.

I agree. I am just gobsmacked that he stood behind that. I spent a whole day thinking it was a photoshopped pic.

I want the Tories to burn themselves out on this awful stop the boat people thing (which is actually stop ALL immigration unless you are Ukrainian or an Afghan) because I think, despite it appealing to their worst of the worst... I think it will burn itself out, and come the GE the optics will look awful.

Especially is there is no chance the Bill will get through.

Fiddling while Rome burns.

p.s. If you want a laugh tonight, idiotic Richard Madeley is on BBC Question Time. He is going to have a battle against Yasmin Alibhai Brown who I love and who usually wipes the floor with the worst of the worst. And Ken Clarke, the voice of reason! Robert Jenrick has slipped in there somehow. I usually only manage 10 minutes or so

I may agree or at the very least be interested in some of Miriam Cates views.

But I've not forgotten her support for Braverman as PM last summer or the fact that she is part of a Government that has run down the education system (particularly SN - the new SN report is a disappointment, not ambitious enough and too bloody slow).

Which then makes me reflect on the sudden speed of a review in to Sex Education the week before Teachers Strike - thus garnering a few headlines from newspapers that seem to have missed commenting on the SN report.

www.childrenscommissioner.gov.uk/report/29723/

Here is Yvette Cooper explaining why it can't work.

twitter.com/KayBurley/status/1633394341090664448

John Crace keeps on delivering - don’t know how he does it so quickly

He is on fire.

I don't know how my spellcheck managed to make up the word misogamist!

To be clear, what I mean by MC making things up is that she garners things from various fairy unreliable sources without checking their veracity. She was called out for this during the pandemic by teaching unions on several occasions and yet she continued.

I, too, don't want the debate about issues on here, as I have said before - that isn't what I meant at that point. Although every single student is equally entitled to RSE and should feel included by it , of course.