If you are in the shoes off brigade

[Halfastoneextra]

If you invite someone to your house, say as an evening guest , here is the scenario:

The guest has made an effort to dress up for the evening, say a nice dress, updo, jewellery etc. She turns up at your house where you ask all guests to take their shoes off. This guest turns to a carrier bag she has on her, and withdraws a pair of very nice shoes that she wishes to wear with her dress. They are not stilettos, so won't damage any wooden floors. She shows you the soles and explains they are specially clean ie have not been worn outside and have been wiped down to make sure they are spotless. She says she wishes to wear them as they are part of her outfit and she does not wish to be discomforted by having to go barefoot.

Would you acquiesce. If not, why not?

It’s the height of bad manners to have a party - people get dressed up - then demand all shoes off.

No, the height of bad manners is to hit the hostess in the face with a pie, jump on her husband and shit behind the TV.

if someone asked me to take my shoes off like a toddler I’d be questioning my choice of friends
Don't ever travel abroad or accidentally make friends with someone from another country. You'd be horrified. Best to stay in this country and stick to your narrow circle of friends. Preferably ones who put England flags in their window so you can be sure you've not accidentally chosen the wrong friend. 😱

Precisely, its inconsistent and rude

Don’t make this a racism issue - it’s nothing of the sort and you should be ashamed of yourself for implying it is.

I always offer to take my shoes off - so culture is irrelevant.

Personally I want my guests to feel comfortable in my house - many prefer to keep shoes on. I am being a good host by putting their comfort over my floors. That is all, nothing to do with anything else.

You're saying you're a good host for "putting guests' comfort over your floors" which means you think anyone who has a shoes off culture is a bad host because they're not putting guests' comfort over their floors (though many people are far more comfortable without shoes on)

Well just come out and say that the so-called 'shoes off' cultures are bad at hospitality, then. Surely the principle as you have outlined it, about putting guests before floors, will apply to everyone?

Of course it's not racism. People of many different colours and creeds across the world are brought up to keep outdoor shoes for outside and wear either indoor shoes or plain socks indoors. Race has nothing to do with it. It is, as you have correctly identified, about keeping dirt/dust/water/mud/snow out of the house.

I'm going to throw a grenade in, because I always get a hilarious amount of shite for this...

I have a basket of machine washable slippers for guests to wear if they want!!!

I’ve said different countries have different traditions and some things that are seen as rude in some cultures are seen as polite in others.

I’ve also said this should never be an issue as polite people offer to take off shoes.

There’s nothing wrong with not giving a shit about your floor and wanting to make your guests feel comfortable.

Every house is different- many houses in this country are sadly cold and draughty. Many have stone/wood floors.

Always a fun grenade to throw into these threads. I sometimes see sets of those slippers sold round here but never been to a house that has had them.

Not necessarily. Yes some people prefer to take their shoes off. My point is - I don’t care! Do whatever you want in my house and I’ll offer to take my shoes off in other peoples.

So...what's the problem? If you've no objection to removing your shoes when that's the done thing in the host environment...what exactly are you offended about?

I wouldn’t expect someone to go barefoot in my house but outdoor shoes are not allowed.

I have slippers or shoe covers if they want to keep their shoes on, those are the options.

Are you missing the part where you said you're a good host to allow shoes on which implies that anyone who asks for guests to take their shoes off is a bad host?

Sure, just stop being patronising. If you think a certain aspect of a culture, or people insisting on that aspect of their culture whilst living in the UK, is rude, own it.

It's just strange that you seem to have this standard for good hosting to the extent that you say people who don't allow outside shoes indoors are "terrible hosts who shouldn't have dinner parties" but in the same breath say you wouldn't hold certain people in the UK to that standard. It's like you think their culture is an excuse for bad behaviour rather than normal behaviour. If it's bad behaviour in the UK, then it's bad behaviour? Right?

I think you can respect the traditions of other cultures that don’t necessarily apply to your household! There’s no ‘bad behaviour’ FFS: That’s like saying people who don’t tip in Japan are bad but in the US they are good because they do tip. Neither is right or wrong.

Then why are you objectively a "good host" for not having a shoeless house? If that's true, how can shoeless houses not be worse, whatever the reason, if your way is objectively better?

And if it's not objectively better, why do you think your way actually is superior, rather than a mere preference?

No, it's like saying that not tipping in the US is rude, but Japanese immigrants in the US don't have to because it's not part of their culture.

It's definitely the case that immigrants can't always bring all aspects of their culture with them and they may have to adapt. I think Japanese immigrants in the US probably are going to have to start tipping, to be honest.

Now, I don't think this is one of those because to my mind it's personal preference and in my opinion nobody is a bad host for a) insisting on no outside shoes or b) allowing outside shoes indoors at the guest's discretion. Whether host a has a cultural 'excuse' or not. But you clearly said that they would need a cultural 'excuse' or else they would be rude:

"I think they are terrible hosts and shouldn’t have dinner parties if they can’t put their guests comfort first.

Its rude to ask guests to take their shoes off - different cultures excepted."

It’s not that shoes off or on is better. It’s about what your guests prefer.

Now in countries such as Scandinavia and Japan this is never an issue because automatically people would just take their shoes off and they are all used to it.

I don’t wear shoes in my house! I just don’t label my house as shoes on/shoes off. Because I don’t care!

I'd dispute shoes off isn't predominant now. Things have changed. I go into a lot of people's houses (of all different classes and income brackets) for work. Far more are 'shoes off' than 'shoes on' IME.

We have a box of plastic shoe-covers so people coming in have a choice of "shoes off" or "shoes covered". I'd say it's 50:50 between what people choose to do!

Yes, I've said upthread that I also visit lots of clients' homes for business, and most appear very grateful that I offer to take my shoes off and accept my offer! Very few say to leave them on.

I don't think it's at all rude to expect someone to respect the host environment when they accept an invitation. It's no different to covering your hair in a mosque or synagogue. If you find it that objectionable, don't go.

So making it about religion again when most people on here demanding shoes off are not asking for religious reasons.

It does seem to boil down to ‘my house, my rules’. Or ‘Do what makes you feel comfortable’..

And I don’t find it objectionable at all. As I said it’s never an issue as I always offer to take my shoes off.

Religion is moot. The point is, you've been invited into a place where they do things a certain way. If you're not prepared to abide by that for the duration of your stay - in other words, if you don't respect the host - then don't go.

My house is also vegetarian, so I won't be serving meat even though I know a lot of people prefer a meat meal. Is that bad hosting?