Ioan Gruffudd/Alice Evans

[Notatallanamechange]

Don’t know if anyone has followed this, but she had an arrest warrant issued today for failing to appear in court for breaching a restraining order he has for domestic abuse. Their poor children seem like an afterthought.

So her parents are getting divorced has a nasty mother who has got arrested , dad has new girlfriend travelling round the world , she can't attend her school anymore and she's moving out of her childhood home. She bought 400 dollars worth of stuff on Amazon , got into her father's Instagram and said mean things , then shouted at him. Is she an axe murdering evil person or a confused and very hurt 12 year old? she doesn't seem like a happy child it sounds like she needs a hug and feel like someone is listening to her and there is someone she can rely on..

When subject to that level of parental alienation, I don't believe there's much he could have done, no. You have to realise that the girls are Alice's mouthpieces (that's not her fault, that's how it is with narcs). Therefore nothing short of him getting rid of Bianca and returning to the family home was going to cut it with them. Alice is responsible for destroying their relationship with him; unless they eventually come to terms with what a damaging person she is they will not get that relationship back. She will not ever accept them having any kind of positive relationship with him, that is what people here are failing to grasp. She wants them estranged from him.

Where did I say she was an axe murderer? I was simply agreeing with PP who stated that Ioan was not wrong to assert boundaries with her. Alice has no boundaries whatsoever.

She did it because her father told her that he could no longer afford to pay for her school and that she would need to change schools, whilst simultaneously promoting a film he was making with Bianca. I don’t blame his daughter at all for thinking that he would be funding that film (who else is going to fund a film written by Bianca, about Bianca and starring Bianca) - he gave no fucks about how that would look to his daughter.

You can blame Alice over and over and over but it doesn’t change the fact that Ioan has done plenty himself to push his daughters away.

Apparently not Ioan isn't responsible for anything parenting wise it's all his daughters fault who's the devil incarnate at the age of 12/13. May as well get on with living your best life there's no point trying. The bar is set very low for him..

Imagine losing your school and home , nasty bitter divorce , your mother is unstable, your mother getting arrested and people blame the 12/13 year old for being difficult. She's having her entire life uprooted and she's expected to be happy about it all ? Poor kid needs a hug and unconditional love.

Yes, he is, and from what you can see he is trying to work towards establishing regular, healthy contact using therapy and boundaries

I think he is responsible for not cancelling contact where possible and avoidable so it is consistent. If there is one thing I agree, it is this I’m sure we all do.

He is responsible for providing for them financially.

He is responsible for protecting them from emotional abuse but this is the hardest thing to do, when he has not been able to from the inside perhaps his strongest position was to put on his oxygen mask and try to get them out from the outside.

He is responsible for doing the best he is able to - even if this means with mistakes, errors and flaws. So is Alice, she isn’t expected to be perfect either but never have I witnessed someone do so openly and cruelly what she has been doing to her children, she is an emotional terrorist with 2 little kids as hostages. He was also her hostage remember

It’s the “Ioan isn’t a saint, of course he has some responsibility” coupled with the inability/outright refusal to name one thing that he is responsible for.

Or even if it’s conceded that he moved Bianca into quickly, that’s neutralised with “I can’t blame him/he had no choice.”

I think the hated for Alice is clouding certain people’s ability to see things from the perspective of a 12 year old child, or they are just of the opinion that his young daughters don’t matter because they’re “just like their mother” but they don’t want to come right out and say it.

It’s sickening.

@Vivi0 Alice’s actions have just been so harmful, illegal, disgusting and appalling it is hard to then see 20 pages dedicated to ripping apart every syllable from a screenshot of a few text messages and extrapolate this into ‘Ioan is just as bad and only has himself to blame’ narrative.

People are angry because this has veered from ‘it’s not really her fault he left her for someone thinner and younger’ to now ‘he is abusive for not going to a theme park’. Alice being batshit crazy and nasty was left way back on page 5 and the sole focus is now on him.

He has clearly been through hell and you could even see how physically awful he used to look. The kids live in the same house and are used to him being away working - their lives have mainly changed in terms of a school (of which she was only there for a year and Alice has changed her schools multiple times). He has had to leave with nothing and now has no money either. Him working away is what Alice has been able to use against him, so I imagine he has a million regrets now about many things. Alice has no regrets as she keeps on destroying everything and risking it all for revenge

I didn't say he had no responsibility, I was simply giving my views on the impact years of abuse had on its victims' judgement. Something that wouldn't be disputed on here if the sexes were reversed, because it is well documented.

It's typical though. As usual it is the victim's fault and not the abuser's.

What are you talking about?

What thread are you reading?

We’re discussing Ioan in his capacity as a father.

Do you not think the two daughters are the ultimate victims of Alice and the toxic divorce ?Not a grown man who has left, has a new partner and going on countless trips. I think the two children are the ones suffering the most but some reason a grown man is given more empathy than a 12 year old!!!!!

Of course they are, where did I say otherwise?

Unless your argument is that grown adults with children cannot be victims of abuse themselves?

The abuse he suffered is massively relevant to the discussion, they're not two separate issues. As anyone who has been parented by an abuser AND a victim of abuse would know. My mother was often an imperfect parent due to abuse she had suffered from my father. My father was an imperfect parent because he is a narcissist.

Yes but you are arguing Ioan has no responsibility to parent because he has been a victim of abuse. In fact it's imperative the girls know he's there as they are stuck with Alice 24 hours a day. They are children so can't just to choose to leave they are much more powerless than Ioan is. They fundamentally need a dad who's involved and unconditional love , you don't get to opt out of responsibility of parenting traumatised children because you are having issues. The children need at least one parent who will put them first.

Which is why he is going through a long and expensive court process.

If this is going to be another 10 pages as to all the reasons he is a bad father and Alice is just now a background character then this is pretty pointless.

Many people have an abusive parent and the other parent just doesn't get a new partner move in then go on multiple trips abroad then say limited contact until therapy.

I didn't say that at all. Please don't put words in my mouth. I said the abuse he suffered will have affected his parenting, not that he had no responsibility.

Alice was limiting his contact with the girls by (a) telling them their Daddy had a new woman and didn't love them any more (b) physically stopping contact and (c) muscling in on their contact I.e. removing their phones during face time and so on.

If you haven't, I strongly advise you to read all the court documents and the tattle wiki, because you seem to have a version of events in your head that is not reflective of the extent of parental alienation that woman has inflicted on those girls.

Obviously he is going to be a less better parent than he would probably like to be in some part the circumstances of the abuse. I’m pretty sure he would also say he’s made mistakes, I don’t think he is arguing he hasn’t. I don’t think he’s trying to paint himself as a poor guy who got screwed over by his ex, and nothing is his fault. No one here has said he has no responsibly but this is now picking the bones of a carcass that’s been out in the sun for 6 weeks

Alice is the fundamental cause , will she realistically change ? No this has been going on for years she's still a narcissist and horrible. I have hope Ioan can change his behaviour to a better less selfish parent. This isn't the tattle thread if you want to praise ioan go there. This is a parenting forum where parenting is discussed..
Nobody has said they back Alice.

There is being an imperfect parent and then there is outright abandoning your children because they aren’t as thrilled as you expected them to be when you, mid divorce, brought a new girlfriend home from your work trip who is now living with you.

No, they are two seperate discussions. Ioan’s dubious decisions merit a seperate discussion.

The current state of his relationship with his children is not all on Alice. Far from it. He’s done plenty on his own for his daughters to feel hurt, abandoned and angry about.

I've read everything it still doesn't change he got a new partner very quickly moved her in, travelled about even when visitation started ! It was delayed as he was away travelling. Estranged child asked to go to a theme park he said no as new girlfriend might get ill but they had been travelling round the world. Pulled her out of school as it was too expensive then started promoting a film his girlfriend a z lister was going to star in. How does that look to a 12 year old child ?

I suppose much on this dissusion depends on people chosing who they believe to be the abusive one in the marriage.

I can see Alice who was once a confident, intellegent and capable person has basically been reduced to rubble and is I think needs help in coping with an ongoing, chronic nervous breakdown. Her children are living with this, they will grow up quickly having to endure such pain in the family home, poor children.

I really can't see how people have come to the conclusion that Ioan is a saint and Alice is an evil abuser.
Personally I don't think Ioan has been very kind to this woman for a very long time, long before the affair and divorce.