Page 5 | Sex not gender. Sex not gender. Sex not gender.

transchloe · 19/12/2023 15:02

To those above, really??? Why, when I have engaged I respectful dialogue, do some of you deem it necessary to resort to abusive comments?
I have used mums net for many many years and never seen the abuse thatvis being meted out for someone showing that we need open dialogue.
I guess some of you just don't respect other people.
As for reality. The reality is that being trans is biological. ManY trans people know at the age of between 4 and 8 that they are trans. Not nurture, nature.
Good luck everyone stuck in your little bubble of abuse and disbelief.

Kernackered · 19/12/2023 15:13

Eh? Who was abusive??

pickledandpuzzled · 19/12/2023 15:16

I think saying’I don’t agree with you’ is abusive.

Though to be fair I did say people who don’t belong there should fuck off out of women’s spaces.

Kpo58 · 19/12/2023 15:16

misscockerspaniel · 19/12/2023 13:09

Why oh why do some people, forms etc say "assigned at birth". What does the midwife do - toss a coin to decide? Sex is observed at birth, it isn't a random decision.

I'm assuming because in the very rare case of intersex babies, the sex isn't always 100% obvious so a sex is assigned. Maybe they later do DNA testing and sometimes have to correct it?

Kernackered · 19/12/2023 15:18

pickledandpuzzled · 19/12/2023 15:16

I think saying’I don’t agree with you’ is abusive.

Though to be fair I did say people who don’t belong there should fuck off out of women’s spaces.

Well, maybe a little sweary, but its hardly abuse!

Mylobsterteapot · 19/12/2023 15:20

It’s one thing asking my gender, when what you really want to know is my sex. But the vet forms asked for my cat’s gender. He doesn’t have a gender, he is a cat (a male one).

myphoneisbroken · 19/12/2023 15:21

Can't we keep this on the sex and gender board please? It's bad enough as it is without it spilling out all over Mumsnet.

tellmewhenthespaceshiplandscoz · 19/12/2023 15:26

So many threads on MN are only loosely under the topic they get posted on.

I always think a good tip is, if I don't want to read it (and in this case the subject matter is glaring obvious from the title) I just scroll past

Girlontherailreplacementbusservice · 19/12/2023 15:50

Peskysquirrel · 19/12/2023 12:28

Working "in essence" apparently.
Whatever that means 🤔

Surely the 'essence' is the thing that someone born female is never going to produce from a fake penis.

ImthatBoleyngirl · 19/12/2023 16:01

transchloe · 19/12/2023 12:51

Cis is only used to separate trans and non trans people. Also, it ensure during discourse online that if a descriptor is missed whether it be trans or cis, the flow of the argument is still clear and people don't get confused who is being refered to.
I also think it is disrespectful not to consider what to call someone.
No-one is saying trans people can change their sex...just their gender. They/we wish to be treated as our chosen gender, including pronouns.

Women and Transwomen. I am not Non-Trans, thank you!

Verv · 19/12/2023 16:05

Peskysquirrel · 19/12/2023 11:53

@transchloe We are in a situation that is very similar to the section 28 movement in the '80's and the anti-Aids movement int he late 80s and early 90's.

Can you explain a bit more why you think the situation is similar to the section 28 movement and the anti-Aids movement?
You can't just make a statement like that without explaining why.

I wish people would stop weaponising Section 28 and the Anti-AIDS movement, which targeted homoSEXuals in order to silence those who are aware that human sex is immutable.

S28 was homophobia, knowing that a male will always be male is material reality.

Im sick to the back teeth of the LGB being dragged into the wifi passwords paraphilias.

(And absolutely sex not gender)

Chewbecca · 19/12/2023 16:06

transchloe · 19/12/2023 15:02

To those above, really??? Why, when I have engaged I respectful dialogue, do some of you deem it necessary to resort to abusive comments?
I have used mums net for many many years and never seen the abuse thatvis being meted out for someone showing that we need open dialogue.
I guess some of you just don't respect other people.
As for reality. The reality is that being trans is biological. ManY trans people know at the age of between 4 and 8 that they are trans. Not nurture, nature.
Good luck everyone stuck in your little bubble of abuse and disbelief.

What do you mean by ‘being trans is biological’?

Peskysquirrel · 19/12/2023 16:11

So...what did you expect to gain from this thread @transchloe ?
When you resurrected it out of nowhere after 6 months?

Did you just expect to say your piece and then claim "abuse" when others express different opinions from yours?

I really wonder what the motivation was.

If you're up for it there's a whole board of threads right here https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights

PencilsInSpace · 19/12/2023 16:34

Kpo58 · 19/12/2023 15:16

I'm assuming because in the very rare case of intersex babies, the sex isn't always 100% obvious so a sex is assigned. Maybe they later do DNA testing and sometimes have to correct it?

Show quote history

'Assigned at birth' is something that used to happen to the tiny number of babies that were born with a DSD that made their sex difficult to determine visually. The phrase frequently meant horrific genital surgery so it has traumatic associations for a tiny number of people whose medical condition was mismanaged.

That doesn't happen now because, as you say, there is DNA testing. Also surgeons tend not to do surgery on tiny infants these days unless it's strictly medically necessary.

Aside from that, nobody has ever been 'assigned at birth', the TRA just coopted the phrase because they don't give a shit about anyone else.

PencilsInSpace · 19/12/2023 16:36

I mean, how would it even work?

Sex not gender. Sex not gender. Sex not gender.

Peskysquirrel · 19/12/2023 16:37

😄

HoneyButterPopcorn · 19/12/2023 16:44

Next step - “congratulations Xi Smith - it’s a… oh here you go, you work it out.”

WandaWomblesaurus · 19/12/2023 17:03

transchloe · 19/12/2023 15:02

To those above, really??? Why, when I have engaged I respectful dialogue, do some of you deem it necessary to resort to abusive comments?
I have used mums net for many many years and never seen the abuse thatvis being meted out for someone showing that we need open dialogue.
I guess some of you just don't respect other people.
As for reality. The reality is that being trans is biological. ManY trans people know at the age of between 4 and 8 that they are trans. Not nurture, nature.
Good luck everyone stuck in your little bubble of abuse and disbelief.

Biological?
Are you serious?

Terfosaurus · 19/12/2023 17:04

If being trans is biological why can't we test for it?

EmpressaurusOfCats · 19/12/2023 17:51

Excellent question. Then all transpeople would be validated.

MinnieMountain · 19/12/2023 18:37

@myphoneisbroken if you’re going to police different boards, can you sort out AIBU as well please?

EmpressaurusOfCats · 19/12/2023 18:44

MinnieMountain · 19/12/2023 18:37

@myphoneisbroken if you’re going to police different boards, can you sort out AIBU as well please?

Especially AIBU. There’s loads of stuff on there that shouldn’t be.

pikkumyy77 · 19/12/2023 18:49

Please take this weird fetish for being judgmental about other people’s experiences back to the feminism board. I blocked that very successful and don’t miss it but i would miss chat.

Sprinzy · 19/12/2023 18:58

MithrilCostsMore · 17/01/2023 20:51

Always. Any form I fill in when it asks me my gender, I cross out and wrote sex.

I do this too. And I now point it out on any work documentation that asks for gender when they don’t mean that. whereas at one time mixing sex and gender was ok, today’s meanings are different so language needs to be more precise and keep up to date.

Peskysquirrel · 19/12/2023 19:13

pikkumyy77 · 19/12/2023 18:49

Please take this weird fetish for being judgmental about other people’s experiences back to the feminism board. I blocked that very successful and don’t miss it but i would miss chat.

You clicked a thread titled "sex not gender"
The title is a clue
Why click and then moan about it?