How the upper middle class live

[LisaJool]

Apologies for yet another class thread but I find this fascinating. Off the back of a thread I started watching a TV series about British aristos and their stately homes. This lead to other YouTube videos and a podcast.
Some observations I made:

1. The women all have great bone structure with the infamous MN UMC swooshy hair.

1. A lot of "sleepless nights" and hand wringing about how they can maintain their homes, which they are "custodians" of. Many have had to do tours/homemade jams/souvenirs to try to bring in extra money. But, their dc go to private schools - surely the first thing you'd do is remove them from that to save money or get rid of the ponies?

1. Re decor, lots of chintz like you'd expect in lovely formal rooms but their kitchens look like something Kim and Aggie need to tackle. Clutter covering all available workspace, books, riding gear, pet bowls etc, lots of knick knacks. Someone on another thread stated that the 'clutter free' movement is a class thing, with it being a LMC to working class thing. Not sure if this is true but interesting all the same.

I don't know anyone who is truly UMC as in old money or landed gentry types. For those who are acquainted, what are they like and how do they live?

My family are all pretty messy and do have houses full of old furniture and clutter. I know my mother winces at my matching furniture. Anything not solid wood she thinks is pretty ghastly.

I wish I had a giant country pile. But the money runs out doesn't it. My family spent it all. Houses sold off. Jewellery. Art. Everything. 150 years ago my family had the lot, but by the 1950s it was running out. Down to a few trusts which were badly managed. My mum's generation got nothing. I got nothing. So now living in a bog standard house.

Not sure where that leaves me in the class system. Middle middle probably.

I think the MC/UMC have a real aversion to synthetic fabrics too. I always had wool jumpers as a child. All carpets were wool.
My parents would rather have a half moth eaten wool carpet than put down a synthetic carpet.

Another day another #ucmyths thread on MN.

I wish I had a giant country pile. But the money runs out doesn't it. My family spent it all. Houses sold off. Jewellery. Art. Everything. 150 years ago my family had the lot, but by the 1950s it was running out.

Same. My great-grandfather was a successful industrialist but a mixture of death duties, not observing primo geniture (though there was never a big estate) and successive generations not having his business acumen meant most of it has gone.
Also, there was a feeling that lasted into the 1960s that if you could afford not to work then you should spend your time doing good works and not take the bread out of the mouths of those who needed it more.

I LOVE this thread.

Thank you @SavouryPancake for your lovely post about the Italian family.

Anyone with insights into Dutch, German, Austrian UC/UMC?

Estella I am sorry if I was rude. It’s just I’m genuinely interested where Peregrina got this idea about the Nazi support from British people at the end of the war as opposed to the 1930s.
Did she read it so where or was it an off-the-cuff insult to the upper classes which she dislikes? It was a very unpleasant thing to say.
(I love the tulip of your username, by the way).

Just be aware that much of it is cobblers.

Why don’t you post her comment instead of quoting someone who isn’t here to defend or clarify. We can verify if the poster did indeed say ‘most’ not ‘some’.

Are you sure she wasn’t referring to the German aristocracy?

Not all. Also interesting -to me anyway- what people say is UC/UMC.
Nothing quite compares with England in term of obsession with class. India?

Sorry, previous post to @Mirabai

Also interesting -to me anyway- what people say is UC/UMC.

Most of it’s not accurate.

@Mirabai what people say

Exactly. If you find that entertaining, fine, for me it got tedious a long time ago.

Some more for you then…

The lady of the house liked a full table setting each evening, and there was always both a dessert and cheese platter. Wine too, but everyone seemed to drink only a small glass. The two elders were well padded and had been told by Drs to reduce rich foods due to gout, they couldn’t bring themselves to do this, food was their passion.

The lady of the house’s sister had dated a famous jewellery family, they were apparently exceptionally beautiful in their time and had money of course, if not lineage.

The lady of the house’s favourite clothes shops were Loro Piana and Max Mara, always understated.
She kept her hair in a short ponytail because she said it wasn’t seemly for an older lady to have long hair, this must be an Italian thing.

It was acceptable to talk about sex at the dinner table, usually jokes, maybe another Italian thing.

The gentleman of the house preferred extremely slim and light Swiss watches. I have never seen them on anyone else before or since.

Very occasionally they had their neighbours in their town house over for dinner, apparently this family was still in possession of a title, I never met them.

The extended family loved going to the Dolomites on holiday in the summer, stayed at the same four star hotel every year and knew everyone as a lot of other families doing the same.

There was an obsession with visiting private Drs for every little thing, I believe the mother was somewhat of a hypochondriac.

They we’re all extremely well read, even though my friend and the lady of the house had not gone to university.

They did watch television, in the evening, briefly after dinner. Some did crosswords or read while this was happening.

They had cats, they were allowed in the house, but not in the bedrooms.

hu ho

Thank! Everything about the food sounds quite French too, But@SavouryPancake cats? CATS?

No they wouldn't. They go to waitrose and buy fishcakes at the fish counter!

Our local, very rich, huge estate, family, have an appalling reputation locally - they donate dirty clothing, treat their staff horribly and generally screw every penny they can, from anything and everyone! The local charity shop puts their donations straight into the bin now, without opening!

The hetero men all have mistresses do they not or visit high-class brothels? I seem to remember Fergie's dad got caught in some Wimpole St establishment.

But she didn't even say it on this thread?

You seem unhealthily obsessed with one comment from one person, who isn't even on this thread to answer you. Why even bring it up?

Over the years I’ve had UC, UMC, MC and working class regular clients. The upper are the nicest- they have manners and their breeding showed no snobbery. (My clients are mostly female), I found the middle class more snobby and trying to keep up with Jones’s. Though I have to say a lot of the upper class women didn’t seem to have much common sense- I’ve had to guide one or two with advice but treated me as an equal and were lovely.

I know pp are sick of these threads, which they can avoid, but some of these descriptions are amusing, if just general fluff.

I don’t really buy the UC are all friendly as nothing to prove though, it’s basically just life at the top of the pile and some manners probably saved you generationally speaking as you’d not want it all taken away by revolting peasants (not the nasty kind).

Plus I reckon dogs feature as many are eyeing up your wealth when you pop your clogs.

Lighthearted in spirit of thread etc

Everything I know about class I learned from Jilly Cooper; I recognise so many of the UC/UMC tropes which always come up on Mumsnet class threads from her writing. See also Nancy Mitford.

That sounds like upper class to me - the custodians element give it away.

The UMC I know have beautiful, large but modernised houses and enough help that they tend to be tidy and well kept.