How the upper middle class live

[LisaJool]

Apologies for yet another class thread but I find this fascinating. Off the back of a thread I started watching a TV series about British aristos and their stately homes. This lead to other YouTube videos and a podcast.
Some observations I made:

1. The women all have great bone structure with the infamous MN UMC swooshy hair.

1. A lot of "sleepless nights" and hand wringing about how they can maintain their homes, which they are "custodians" of. Many have had to do tours/homemade jams/souvenirs to try to bring in extra money. But, their dc go to private schools - surely the first thing you'd do is remove them from that to save money or get rid of the ponies?

1. Re decor, lots of chintz like you'd expect in lovely formal rooms but their kitchens look like something Kim and Aggie need to tackle. Clutter covering all available workspace, books, riding gear, pet bowls etc, lots of knick knacks. Someone on another thread stated that the 'clutter free' movement is a class thing, with it being a LMC to working class thing. Not sure if this is true but interesting all the same.

I don't know anyone who is truly UMC as in old money or landed gentry types. For those who are acquainted, what are they like and how do they live?

@Unicorse its Keeping up with the Aristocrats on ITV hub.

Smart jeans? Never! Tis the devil's cloth apparently. Should be moleskin trousers or cords, shirt with small check pattern, always a tie, (sleeveless pullover thing in bright colour in cold weather,) tweed jacket. Black lab.

At least thats how the ones in my organisation dress. Usually military background.

HepzibahGreen · Yesterday 23:23
They would definitely eat Lidl fish fingers. Upper class people don’t care about food much.

So not a single upper class person cares about food? Really?

UC go to boarding/public schools, have houses abroad that they summer or winter in, parents with director level jobs or a series of non-exec directorships/board members for charities and the like, and live in mansions/stately piles/pied a terre in London etc. Probs studied sculpture at St Martin’s College. 😁

This is UMC in my experience. I’ve a good few friends with this background - Eton, Marlborough etc so they know UC but my friends aren’t landed - parents were senior in BoE, Judges, senior Politicians, lawyers and the like and now they are too - Board level execs or owners of own publishing companies etc.

UC are barely holding on to the family pile, as others have described.

In response to an earlier comment, my impression of the stereotype was that the working class keep a very tidy home, no manky bathrooms or kitchens and children well turned out when this is important. Horrible living conditions are indicators of more poverty. I come from a working class family and it matters because we feel defensive and fear that we are judged. UC people have way more confidence, they can present in chaos and people conclude that they are charmingly eccentric. WC don't have that luxury. It's interesting.

I also agree that the higher up you get the nicer people get. I’ve worked with families who genuinely never seem to argue or complain about anything ( and I’ve lived in).
Moaning and being arsey is not very upper class despite the stereotype of rudeness.

@jonesy1999 here you go, the family background of Lady Diana Spencer aka the Princess of Wales. She came from a very old English aristocratic family descended from King Charles II. The Windsors are relatively new and of German & European heritage rather than English.

I have read a number of odd comments on mumsnet, some of them relating to class.
One was a comment by Peregrina saying that at the end of World War II, most of the upper classes were pro Nazi. When questioned on this comment she refused to discuss it.
Hmm…. Plenty of upper class young men fought very bravely in the war, many losing their lives. It must have been odd for them, fighting against and dying to stop a regime they actually supported…….

#onlyonmumsnet

William of Orange from the Netherlands to ensure a protestant throne and stick in a bit of Saxe-Coburg from Albert and you have immigrants that have wrapped themselves in the Union Jack to get the forelock tuggers and cap offers in a tizzy. Coronation from God my arse should be more like Coronation Street.

@Luredbyapomegranate I was at school with someone who lived in a stately home. Titled parents & lots of land (thousands of acres I think)

It was a state comprehensive. His parents had the stately home but not much cash I don't think. Their house was massive, and we had great parties there but it was freezing as the heating was hardly ever turned on. Their holidays were usually camping in this country.

(They did have battered a Volvo and Labradors)

@Andante57 King Edward VIII & Wallace Simpson were Nazi sympathisers as well as some of the Moseley’s & Mitfords who were members of the aristocracy. It’s a well known historical fact that certain members of the British aristocracy & privileged classes were fans of Hitler.

Estella - indeed, those people you mention were Nazi sympathisers.
However they do not make up ‘most’ of the upper classes. Also Peregrina’s point was that MOST of the upper classes were Nazi supporters at the END of the war.
If you have evidence of this I would be most interested to see it.

Exactly that assertion is indeed nonsense.

We are a high income family but firmly a common garden MC though. Our DC went to a local village primary as it was 5 mins walk away and we wanted them to have friendships with the local kids.

@Andante57 I found this Jewish Chronicle article which is a commentary on the social & political climate of the time.

With regards to private schools- it is about sticking with what they know.
Same as why wealthy working class often stick with state sector.

Anyone who buy's their furniture is from the lower orders.

Met the Italian step family of an old friend… the family was previously titled.

I’m not sure how similar or dissimilar Italian aristocracy may be, I have never met British aristocracy to my knowledge.

What I gleaned during my visits accompanying my friend…

Huge country home but all wings of the house closed off except the one they lived in, the rest hadn’t been renovated for a generation.
Father of the house had a directorship job, his father had never had a paid “job”, he had instead spent his life investing in property and businesses.
Falling down disused buildings on the large estate, some of them massive houses in their own right.
Extremely well trained hunting dogs which were not allowed in the house.
Lady of the house with a keen interest in antiques (she had married into the family and her father’s family had been new money wealthy farmers).
People were respected by their contribution to society and the arts not by how much they earned. Doing nothing was frowned upon.
Food and sitting at the table for every single meal was a huge thing, you were expected to be attentive and make conversation, no tv or devices of course.
They never went on holiday but had a large city pad in which they stayed in the winter.
The son of the family lived in a tiny modest flat and married a working class girl - the mother did not like her. I thought she was a really lovely person. I think he wanted to be “normal” and did not like the stuffiness or expectations of his family.
They dressed modestly but very high quality clothing.
They were very well mannered and known and respected in the community.
Lady of the house cared more about appearances than gentleman of the house.
House was tidy and sparkling, very Italian way.
There were beautiful ornaments and family heirlooms gathered through travel… may favourites were the Italian coloured glass chandeliers stored in the closed off rooms, I thought it was a terrible waste.
They we’re slightly out of touch with reality in a harmless way.
No expense was spared on food, but frugal with everything else.

@Luredbyapomegranate

"It’s coming from a line of people with less to prove I think"...

...never a truer word spoken on MN!

Just musing on this and comparing three families I've been involved with through my job:

One - a titled family with ancient heraldry, weekends at Balmoral, massive country pile with a dower house, hunts going over the land, opening the village fete etc kids at old-money private schools and then Cambridge and Durham. Permanently harassed labrador-entwined wife cooking suppers for 20 all the time and having to resort to dailies as they can't afford live-in staff any more.

Two - family money much more recently made, extremely conscious of class signifiers so obsessed with having a beautifully-maintained home (former working farm now converted to Bamford-style tasteful F&B-painted family home complete with period greenhouse, bespoke complex log storage arrangements, stable annexe for guests, small formal garden and plenty of fields for dogs (labs again!). Wife more brittle and defensive and less hands-on than titled wife above, but still obsessed with having the perfect walk-in pantry and cooking for identikit local friends. Hols in Klosters, Italy, Scotland for fishing and hunting. Kids at Marlborough and the like. Everything screams too much time and money on their hands.

Three - self-made zillionaire parent (LMC background), kids at private school but barely bother to attend and parents don't care. Unimaginably wealthy but v down to earth about some things. Weird mix of normality and UHNW lifestyle. Hols every two months at least, always by PJ (superyacht charters, Caribbean villas, Vegas, Mexico, Courchevel - would never in a billion years go shooting in Scotland). No dogs. Multiple live-in staff at all properties and insane wastage of resources due to everything needing to be ready at the drop of a hat.

I find the link between clutter and class fascinating

The school fees definitely come from trust funds. They also seem to have at least 4 children all at boarding schools so that would need around £200k a year

don't know anyone who is truly UMC as in old money or landed gentry types. For those who are acquainted, what are they like and how do they live?

much more like working class with money

@ivykaty44 incidently I've also started watching the Real Housewives of Cheshire. These are women of (I assume) quite wc backgrounds who have married into huge amounts of money. The two groups would never in a million years mix though because their lifestyles are worlds apart. The latter groups have huge kitchens which look like showrooms, with lots of chrome and brushed velvet curtains with diamonte dangly things. The former group have old, worn 'country shaker' style kitchens that are covered in clutter with photographs sellotaped onto the cupboard doors. The WAGS would be calling the aristos tramps.

So not a single upper class person cares about food? Really?
Do you know what a generalisation is?
In general, compared to middle class people, upper class people are not arsed about fancy food. English food is normally quite plain, lunch is more likely to be a boiled egg than a mn “massive salad”Dinner for aristos is much more about the social aspect than showing off their Otto Lenghi. As a generalisation, in my experience.