Ukraine Invasion: Part 31

[MagicFox]

31st thread, welcome all and thanks as usual.

[Ijsbear]

All of that sounds very good to me hills.

Russia is part of the world and it has to be dealt with.

I wish the West would allow the bloody trained professionals make more decisions and politicians would keep their hands a bit further off.

And YES to more weopons. Even NATO books on the ground.



Bloody love the idea of a Referendum in Russia to become part of the NL. Russia would benefit greatly from current Dutch values and culture. Imagines Putin on a bicycle with a seat made of nails

[Igotjelly]

China's comments on the sidelines of the UNSC "hope that the flames of war will go out as soon as possible" and that a "ceasefire can be negotiated."

Not as strong as we might have hoped but in the right direction in my view.

[MagicFox]

Good thread on mobilisation and nuclear threat: https://twitter.com/pwnallthethings/status/1572948141971742721?s=46&t=VGcV13woX22_bVTnI9Hh1w


Agree with you re podcast hills

[MagicFox]

Stories of men being pulled out of beds and classes in Russia, disproportionally in minority areas, alongside an unclear treaty clause suggest that this is really general, not partial, mobilisation

[MagicFox]

Oh, on that: see below

[Igotjelly]

Lavrov walked out of the UNSC after his speech. Real mature 🙄

[MagicFox]

Statement from Indian foreign minister : https://twitter.com/shashj/status/1572983811465695235?s=46&t=VGcV13woX22_bVTnI9Hh1w

Lavrov is disgusting

[N1C]

@MagicFox

Stories of men being pulled out of beds and classes in Russia, disproportionally in minority areas, alongside an unclear treaty clause suggest that this is really general, not partial, mobilisation

They're off to fight and die for the opinions and values of rich old men in Moscow. Meanwhile, said old men in Moscow send their children abroad to study and enjoy their youth.

[minsmum]

mobile.twitter.com/DefenceU/status/1572947574016933888 Defence of Ukraine video thanking the US and Russia for lend lease

[Igotjelly]

Yes very interesting from India. They’re generally closer to Russia and China than to the West so it’s a step in the right direction.

[Cillery]

‘Vladimir Putin has secretly approved a law that will send a further one million men to fight in Ukraine, a Russian newspaper reported on Thursday.’

There would be no wars if old men had to fight them! As it is depraved old men like Putin send his young men to die

[N1C]

Here's what some ordinary Russian men think about the prospect of being drafted

[Hillsmakeyoustrong]

www.theguardian.com/world/2022/sep/22/my-heart-sank-with-news-of-draft-russians-flee-in-droves

www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2022/sep/22/my-heart-sank-with-news-of-draft-russians-flee-in-droves

It's absolutely general mobilization!

[autumn1610]

God it’s all so f@*#ing awful. I know loads of people don’t have sympathy for Russians and tbh I hadn’t much before, but seeing the young guys being loaded into buses is just horrible. I look at partner and it kills me thinking it could be him.

i feel like my thoughts have gone right back to February again, when we seeing the poor Ukrainian guys leaving their families. My heart breaks they are still going through this and for what? Russians previously I hadn’t given much thought to, but seeing these guys who are being pulled out of their jobs etc, all I can think is what a waste of a life. I hate their government that they think it’s acceptable to waste Ukrainian life’s and their own populations life. I want to scream and for someone to wake up and do something and stop this mad train that’s running totally of the rails if Putin goes I genuinely don’t think they would get much better. Potentially someone worse who wants to “finish” the job and restore russias “pride”.

sorry nothing to actually add just venting on this shit show

[DFOD]

🇺🇦

[MagicFox]

Surprised to see this so starkly put in the Chatham House article as media threats have encompassed lots of other NATO allies:

"It is important to understand Putin’s repeated nuclear threats have always been directed towards NATO, and not against Ukraine itself. Indeed, the emphasis in the media indicates that they would be targeted at the UK

These latest threats are intended to sway public support against Ukraine by inciting fear of Russian nuclear weapons use in Europe – but giving in to nuclear blackmail would only embolden Putin further."

https://www.chathamhouse.org/2022/09/ambiguous-nuclear-threats-heighten-catastrophic-risks?utmsource=twitter.com&utmmmedium=organic-social&utmcampaign=russia&utmmcontent=nuclear-weapons

[grannysbay]

Sorry, I have been following these boards for some time, and find them so interesting and informative. One thing is puzzling me, and I would be grateful for any insight. What will be the effect on the Russian economy of this mass mobilisation? Or are the main 'recruiting grounds' going to be in the East again?

[MagicFox]

Putin's speech analysed by RUSI: rusi.org/explore-our-research/publications/commentary/vladimir-putins-speech-scrutinised

[MagicFox]

Particularly interesting from the below:

"Much attention has rightly focused on Putin’s apparent readiness to use nuclear weapons. There are concerns that the so-called referendums, scheduled to be held in the coming days in the four Russian-occupied areas of Ukraine, will allow Russia to consider these areas to be Russian territory. This could mean that any encroachment by Ukrainian forces to defend it or recapture the region would amount to an attack on what Russia calls its ‘territorial integrity’.
These concerns are valid, but some of the sentiments behind the statements may be revealing. First, although he seems to have gone further than before, Putin has previously talked about nuclear weapons in a similar manner. There are some parallels with this speech and Putin’s March 2018 national address, in which he showcased Russia’s nuclear arsenal and, in statements directed to the West, ordered its leaders to ‘listen to us now’. Irrespective of whether Putin would consider using these weapons, an important alternative reading of that speech was not just a show of strength, but also a demand for the West to heed and ultimately acknowledge what Putin believes to be Russia’s national security interests – even if they are in contravention of established international law.
So too, in this speech, there are potential alternative messages behind the threat of nuclear weapons. Given that this speech comes alongside the referendums, which aim to absorb the four Ukrainian territories into Russia’s, Putin appears to be delineating Russia’s territorial interests more narrowly, warding the West away from them."

[TheABC]

@grannysbay

Sorry, I have been following these boards for some time, and find them so interesting and informative. One thing is puzzling me, and I would be grateful for any insight. What will be the effect on the Russian economy of this mass mobilisation? Or are the main 'recruiting grounds' going to be in the East again?

Well, the media are reporting a million soldiers being recruited and there's 144million people in Russia so presumably they can be spared. I think people fleeing mobilization might have more of an impact! On top of that, their economy is being hammered by sanctions, which presumably is not helping employment figures.

[Qisk]

@MagicFox

Statement from Indian foreign minister : https://twitter.com/shashj/status/1572983811465695235?s=46&t=VGcV13woX22_bVTnI9Hh1w

Lavrov is disgusting

I would be ashamed, in this significant time in history, in this hour, to make that kind of statement to the UNSC. Particularly so in the case of India. It is insipid and weak at best.

[RedBea]

would it be possible for the west to say to Russian men who do not want to fight to leave into NATO territory? Then he’d have very limited options as there wouldn’t be much of an army left. I can’t imagine many people wanting to be sent to die. Would this even work?

[katem98]

@RedBea I think Germany have said they'd welcome men fleeing conscription with open arms but I cannot seem to find that link now.

[katem98]

Here is screenshot...

[RedBea]

Wow that’s an amazing! We all need to do this. This will have a huge effect on Russian power