Bye Bye Big Dog. Who is going to take over? Truss V Sunak Thread 12

[Roussette]

www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4589396-the-one-where-big-dog-is-still-here-and-the-race-to-be-the-new-top-dog-thread-11?page=40&reply=118674329

Here we are.

Rory Stewart has called out the Liz truss high school schooling ( during a conservative government) on Twitter
Nobody did there

Rishi comes across so well.

Truss was pathetic whining about her school AGAIN. It was under a Tory government, it's been disputed by her peers, and it got her to Oxbridge

Rishi Sunak will be the next Tory leader and PM . It was always gong to be Rishi Sunak. My belief.

twitter.com/OpiniumResearch/status/1551677039349944320?t=Nee5vbsd_Pua0_iapOgk-Q&s=19

Tonight we asked over 1000 regular voters to watch the debate and we have just asked them who they thought performed best.

Results:
Sunak 39% vs Truss 38%

Conservative voters thought Truss did better (47% vs 38% for Sunak).
Labour voters thought Sunak did better (41% vs 30% for Truss).

The last bit I heard (before I left to keep my blood pressure under control) was Truss saying she would start paying back the covid debt in three years' time. Quite apart from the major question of whether she would still be in power then, what on earth does she think is going to happen in three years that will make us so much better off? What guarantee has she got that Putin will be dead or sane?

I would like to think you are right, but I'm not at all sure that Conservative party members are going to go for him. These are people many of whom are allegedly desperate to.get Johnson back, remember.

The one consolation is that Truss will be such a car crash that she's found to lose the next election. But I hate to think of what we have to go through before we reach that point.

We are away so I didn't watch the debate tonight.

I think it will be Truss even though all the party members I know (well enough for them to volunteer information) are voting for Sunak.

Truss has the Mail and Telegraph acting as mouthpieces and all those hankering after Poor Maligned Johnson to bring in to the fold.

Although he was on Newsnight a few days ago speaking very authoritatively about the plan to use small nuclear reactors to resolve the fuel crisis. I was impressed at how knowledgeable and clear he was. Until DH piped up and said 'sounds great but he talking bollocks'. DH is a nuclear scientist and he put what Ellwood was saying in the same category as estuary airports and bridges to Ireland. He's just a more convincing bullshitter than Johnson.

The daily Mail liked Liz Truss. No surprises there.

"That he wants revenge on Rishi Sunak is already apparent, but if Liz Truss is elected, she will face the identical problem. The chances of her loyalty to him being repaid are close to zero. Boris lives his life as a performance, and he will want the next act to fill every seat in the theatre of British political life.
The Conservative Party had no choice but to remove Johnson from officee_. His standards of governance and veracity had fallen below what reasonable people could defend. The downside is that the party will always have the problem of what he will say next."
William Hague correctly summing up what Truss/Sunak have to look forward to. Johnson is going to be an ongoing problem - the heftiest of loose canons left to thrash about causing more chaos and undermining the new PMs authority. He has little to lose.
I suspect by Christmas any sensible Conservatives will be desperate for him to take up public speaking in the US.

Twitter indicates that Truss said last night she might offer him a post? Is that correct? If so she'd be a fool to think it might neutralise the threat, it will only egg him on.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/tories-must-beware-boris-the-incredible-sulk-m5lsbmjtb

The debate on twitter about whether or not there were cardboard cut outs was funny.

I also understand they both failed the honesty test when claiming Dover had nothing to do with Brexit.

Twitter indicates that Truss said last night she might offer him a post? Is that correct? If so she'd be a fool to think it might neutralise the threat, it will only egg him on

Yes and no. I watched the debate for my sins. She would not answer the question twice by saying that he wouldn't want one and he needs a rest (😂) and let's not forget he had covid really badly blah blah. (Sorry I can't remember if she brought up covid to this question, but whenever she did, it was totally out of context. )
When pushed for the third time she said no, she couldn't see him having a post in the cabinet. I think that might come back to bite her on the arse when he insists!

Truss moved from not having him in her cabinet last week to maybe last night, she obfuscated by adding that she doubted that he’d want a cabinet job and ge deserves a rest. I don’t know what she calls what he’s doing now, it looks suspiciously like a holiday to me.

Blossom

Snap!
He's in camo out on manouvres, or dressed like Tom Cruise's unfit brother!

I feel like we might see Action Idiot out on a zipwire again soon!

BBC debate: Liz Truss and Rishi Sunak fact-checked

www.bbc.co.uk/news/62296191

'The cardboard lady 'is very apt. He is being criticized today for being too aggressive.
she did put Chris Mason in his place a bit about the book ' Britain unchained' ( I think it's called ) she only wrote the part about the education system. I haven't read it myself , but I wished they had followed this up with what her plans were for education and if the tax cuts will affect that. The audience looked like they had all taken a pill beforehand or maybe , as they had all voted conservative in 2019, they were a bit puzzled as to how we all got to this place.
I am feeling a bit down about either of them being in charge and the NHS problems and immigration were not mentioned.
It was badly run but then the bbc is concerned about its future too , so maybe they have just given up a bit too as we all know it's all a bit depressing all round.

There is a Sam Freedman article in TES today about what Truss and Sunak means for education.

In short, he isn't interested. May focus on post 16. She is interested and this may not be a good thing. Is obsessed with maths education.

It's actually 4 days old :

www.tes.com/magazine/analysis/general/truss-or-sunak-what-either-new-pm-could-mean-education

Not sure all of you will be able to read this.

Is it really true that parents hate the concept of grammar schools? That doesn’t fit with people paying well over the odds to move to their catchment areas. I suspect Mr Freedman’s prejudice is showing there.

I can read the article, thanks for sharing.

As for the secretary of state, it would be nice to have someone who was genuinely interested in education, rather than seeing the role as a stepping stone for their longer-term ambitions. Schools and colleges need someone who’ll fight their corner more than ever.

Now that would be nice indeed.

Isn't that exacly why people have a problem with the concept of grammar schools? It isn't open to everyone, it isn't leveling up when people buy their way in.

We don't live in a grammar school area so it's not something people discuss, I mostly read about it on MN.

I don’t know. It’s an interesting discussion - probably not for this thread, it would derail it for ages! As the product of the grammar school system I have a bit of a soft spot for them, having seen first hand the social mobility they achieved.

MN always makes it appear as if there are way more grammar schools than there are. They are actually a tiny part of the UK's educational offering. Huge swathes of England, and the whole of Scotland and Wales don't have them. NI a different schoolscape and political parties. They are over represented at Oxbridge for state school applicants which may explain Tory party's fondness in part.

Where I live, there are people who move away from the grammar school area.

The social mobility argument doesn't stack up though. And if it did stack up, that would be worrying for most of GB! As you say, maybe for a different thread.

I suspect actually what is ahead is the free marketisation continuing - forced academisation and so called specialist schools whihc will select on ability in eg maths.