Fed up with my son. Not fair on my other children

[Notoschool]

Ok so there is some history with mental health issues . We are waiting on CAMHS. I often chase them up but its a long waiting list .

I have posted about the situation before under this name. But also once or twice under other names. I can't even remember what names they were . But its my way of trying to stay anon. But trying to give a bit of back ground as well.

So my son has some issues going on which effect his mental health/moods etc. We have had social services involved but they left. Also tried to get him counselling and support whilst we are waiting for CAMHS. But he refused to engage. Social services left because there's basically nothing they can do. So that leaves us waiting for CAMHS.

Today's post is about how fed up I am with walking on egg shells around him and my other children have to suffer as well. He spends most of the nights awake till silly o clock. He gets up about 12.30/1.30 in the afternoon. It's just me and him in the house. Sometimes he's in the living room . Some times in his room. I go to get my children from school at 2pm and get home around 4.15.

As soon as we are home . He gets his ps5 puts it on in the living room . This would not be a problem. BUT every time my 6 and 7 year old make a bit of kiddie type noise. Or interact with each other . Or have a low volume on their tablets or ask a question. He starts on them constantly telling them turn it down. Be quite, stop it. Don't sit there , ds6 playing In garden don't make noise with that. Basically they can't be kids.

Now compared to what it was a few months back he is better . But he is still quite aggressive in his tone and body language to me. Some of it could be me as I have had it go on for so long that I'm expecting it so maybe it's in my head.

I do tell him to leave them alone over and over again. But I get met with the aggressive tone . I don't know how to explain it he kind of trys to shut me down.

Hes not been to school in a long time. He has agreed to go to college in September that is a massive step for him. And he seems positive about it. But im to scared to say to mich to him about how he is with his younger siblings incase I rock the boat to much and we go back to stage one . I just keep telling myself roll on September. And then he might have a focus. And maybe meet friends and things might get better.

I just want my kids to be kids 😔

Your child is not your partner, though.

But that's how he's acting - an abusive one at that.

This is another reason why applying for an EHCNA is beneficial. If the LA agree to assess, a psychiatrist &/or clinical psychologist assessment can be part of the needs assessment without the need to sit on the normal waiting lists. And if an EHCP is issued MH therapies can be provided via that, again without the need to sit on the normal waiting lists. If CAMHS can’t or won’t assess or provide the therapies in section F of the EHCP the LA must commission independent assessments/provision.

It does sound like applying for EHCNA is worth looking at.

Your life sounds very tough right now. I know family therapy didn't work out. but have you looked into therapy just for yourself? Even if you can't get him to engage with therapy, it will still be helpful for your whole family if you can explore your own issues.

Does he have any interests? Hobbies? Is there anything you can connect with over in the short gap between him getting out of bed and your young children finishing school? Go out alone together for his favourite food/beach/museum/cinema?

It sounds like you could all really do with him getting his teeth into something over the summer for his mental health and to get him out of your hair. Is he motivated by money? Could a summer job work? Volunteering?

Could something like NCS The Challenge be appealing to him? It's a free programme, 2 weeks part residential, outdoor sports like rock climbing and rafting, team building, lots of fun, big focus on self-development and community. They can provide a one to one for young people with additional needs/behavioural issues.

If he will be 16 by the end of August he can join this summer, if not would be next summer.

How about seeing what the Princes Trust have in your area? www.princes-trust.org.uk/

Or asking his future college about Duke of Edinburgh? www.dofe.org/

Are you a single parent? Have you spoken to Gingerbread? www.gingerbread.org.uk/what-we-do/advice_and_support_for_single_parents/

I know you have been involved with SS and other agencies already so sorry if this is all old news to you.

Some police officers are excellent at this kind of thing - ie giving teenagers the scare/wake up call that they need. Needs to be a man though, because this kid has learned he doesn’t need to respect women.

As for fear of “criminalising your son”…well, if your teenaged son is violent to you, breaks your ribs or worse, he will have criminalised himself. At 15 he knows right from wrong and that is clearly so beyond the pale of acceptability that he needs to bear the consequences. At the moment there appear to be zero consequences for anything he does, so he continues to do whatever, however he likes.

And to OP - as a mother you have a responsibility to your other children to allow them to grow up normally without a bullying monster dominating and threatening all of your lives. This is a tough love thing to say because you are clearly Havin a very miserable time but you’ve got into the mindset of making excuses for him and trying to make them someone else’s problem. YOU need to establish boundaries, regain control of your house and regain respect from your son. College, CAMHS, your GP - none of them are going to fix that for you. Maybe the army might, when he is 18 - they’ve been known to take kids and turn them around completely by giving them the boundaries, structure and male role models that they need - but you and your other children can’t wait that long.

Honestly you can’t teach autistic kids this stuff. I’m a tough parent but my DD would often come out with this crap and still does, the looking for a fight sums it up - I’m choosing not to give it too her. It may not look like I’m doing anything but ignoring them works!

I wouldnt give up on the police, I have rang them myself, several times.

I would say though she’s older now and quite delightful, defiantly still goes for an odd argument, but that’s more around anxiety.

Have you considered anxiety? She has a test or is expected at the doctors etc and she goes through the roof, refusing to attend, won’t engage, cries etc - worth asking the doctors and I would do it before they’re 16, because you can leave it too late as he will be old enough to have you removed.

Ask to book a double length appointment at the GP. Go in and talk about YOU, not your son and what you think he needs, but you. Tell them how terrified you are for yourself and your other kids in your own home and that YOU are not coping.
make them understand the reality of what impact this is having on your mental health.
personally I think you’d be able to cope better with him after some therapy, at the moment he has you beaten down and bullied, but you need more than that, you need support for him, whether it comes from social services, school or the police.

id also be tempted to go and meet my community support police officer, have a chat and rather than calling them when it escalates see if they’ll come and have a chat when things are calm. If you are on their radar they might then come quicker next time, but they might be able to give your son some understanding of where his behaviour is going to land him.
he’s not that far off you being able to kick him out, and then they’ll be no money, no roof, no PlayStation and by the sound of it no job: and that will only end one way.

If you want your kids to be kids be a mother. Grow a backbone.

He either behaves, or PS5 goes. He gets violent? Police. Enough is enough and you're enabling him to behave like this.

Yy to removing the playstation from the house. Totally from the house

It does not come back until he has done college and some exercise or one hour of English, one hour maths and one hour science a day (get CGP study guides). You can reduce or increase this time this depending on his abilities.

Anything else that he chooses to do in preference to these things will also be removed from the house.

Remove it at night when he is asleep or when he is out the house, not it from of him.

Make it clear nothing will alter this. If he threatens violence you still do it, but keep a diary. If he is actually violent you call the police. If he smashes his stuff you do not replace it. If he smashes anyone else's stuff and has pocket money no pocket money until that stuff is replaced, all of it. If he doesn't have pocket money remove

Yy to the EHCP. No I dont think Home schooling was a good plan in this case (although it can be wonderful for many many children). You need to be realistic about your abilities and resources. Home schooling requires either discipline or self discipline, neither of which are in currently in place and cannot be whilst DS rules the roost not you. Get DS back on roll asap.

You need to do all the other dominance stuff too, eat together
at the table with you at the head, he sets the table and/or clears after . If he chooses to eat separately that's fine, Express disapproval but dont stop him, no treats. If he helps himself to treats in the house stop buying them. If necessary lock a few special bits for the younger kids in a lock box.

Noone tells you this but violence works, it will get you exactly what you want. Sometimes the threat of violence is enough. Your challenge as a mum of a violence child is to teach him the lie it doesn't. Basically you have to be the most determined, steady person in the house.

OK so I haven't read all the thread because there is a lot to take in. However I'm more looking at the basic points.
Why did he leave school?
Do you know why he's getting aggressive? Is it to do with school?
He's a teen so hornmones WILL be playing a big big role in this and we all know hornmones are bloody awlful!

He's playing games because he likes them, he's trying to escape and games will be calming him down. Is there any chance you could stear him in a direction where he could look at becoming a game tester/designer?

Correct me if I'm wrong in any of this please.

My 2 pennies worth, @Notoschool. My 14 year old DS was exactly like this during the first lockdown. (he´d had a diagnosis of ASD the previous year). I applied for an EHCNA myself using all the documentation from my repeated contact with GP, CAMHS, police, social services etc. Had to appeal but they did issue the EHCP 6 months later.
Then he avoided school for this past academic year - just didn't go back last sept.
He is calmer and less controlling as he is not in school. However he has had no structure or medical needs tuition at all. But he wants to start a new technical school in September and is excited about it.

What has helped?
His dad has left the family home and that has helped - less arguments between them.
Speaking to him, being positive and being affectionate when he is calm has helped.. (grit your teeth and pretend, and then it will come naturally when you see that warm side to him return)
Affirm, love and build up your other child/ren as well. They need to know he is NOT more important than them.
Staying on top of his diet and helping him to eat regularly and good quality food has helped (if he had his way he´d live on chocolate and sweets).
When he is calm I can tell him how his behavior impacts on his younger sister who is now a nervous wreck after all we have been through the past couple of years, plus lifelong low level bullying from DS. She is now getting counselling via her school as I let them know what has been going on. I´m thinking about getting her seen by a psychologist too.
My DS also now has a youth worker from SS who is going to work with both kids and help with the transition back into education in September.
It is really hard, and I could have written your OP almost word for word. I would have put him into care many times if I could. But we seem to be turning a corner. We still have outbursts, but not as bad and we try to discuss afterwards. He is also able to tell me how he felt about things that happened a long time ago, as if he is only now starting to process them.

You can do this, OP. Lots of advice in this thread. But please ignore those who say "just take away the PS and parent him" They have no idea what it´s like.

Thank you. Yes the situation codes sound very simlar. Especially the school part. He could not get help at school I know that they /local education had a duty to help him. Fact is they did not . If safe guarding was shouting/ threatening me down the phone. Sod knows how she spoke to ds many times ds has touched on how we /I did not believe him thought he was playing the teachers up. He would not accept the counselling he was offered there because it was the very place he had been treated /shouted at by the adults that were meant to help him. Ds social worker had to email her in the end to tell her to lay off. How could I/ds have worked with someone like that.

You can do this, OP. Lots of advice in this thread. But please ignore those who say "just take away the PS and parent him" They have no idea what it´s like.

Yes I have no idea what it's like... I dont have two round the clocks carers for my DS who almost killed me during a mental health break. Literally. Definitely Havent been doing exactly the stuff I've written about to reestablish some element of home schooling in an ASD child... 🙄🙄🙄

@MackenCheese
You really shouldn't comment on other peoples experiences when you dont know other peoples background.

I will agree with you on making sure the diet is low in sugar and chocolate

Quote. Social services have already been involved. They won't take him into care. It's not that simple Social services work with the family to keep him with the family. Unquote.

1)Can you film him being violent towards you and your younger children?
2) Can you get him sectioned and detained under the mental health act?
3) This monster needs to stop wrecking your life and the lives of your younger children.
4) It is OK to NOT love a person when their conduct makes them unlovable. It is OK to wash your hands of your son, to protect the younger ones.
5) It is OK to walk away from your son, to move house, to get an injunction out so that by law he cannot go near you. He sounds dangerous to me.

This sort of advice isn't helpful. The child is in a grown male body.

@Icedlatteplease we are all here to "comment on other peoples experiences, without knowing other peoples background".......🙄I thought that was the point of MN.

As you've described it sounds like your 15 year old son is taking advantage of the fact that he's bigger and stronger than you now to be an utter arse and basically do everything he wants to do and nothing he doesn't want to do.

I'm sure it isn't as cut and dried as that, I'm sure you love him because he's your son. I can offer unreserved sympathy, the exact mixture of stuff that got you here is irrelevant to the point that it's a truly crappy situation to be in now.

To offer some tips that may be of assistance.

Negotiate rules, with him and younger siblings and yourself. A behavioural contract if you will for the use of shared areas. Then enforce it, not with threats and punishments just by pointing out that he isn't keeping to the contract. e.g. you have sole use of the lounge for your ps5 from 1 until 4 and 10 until 1. The time now is 5pm so it's tv and stories, you're welcome to watch with us but this room is a shared area not just yours.

You will need to repeat this a lot to get things to improve but this is why you need to negotiate it properly with him (and younger siblings) in the first place. Kids (even huge ones) do have a strong sense of fairness, is their something else he feels like he should get / should have gotten but didn't or he thinks in unfair on him and he's taking this is 'compensation'? maybe (don't answer but may be something to ask him / think about)

OP I can’t comment on what to do as if I was in your situation I wouldn’t know what to do either. That must be so hard and it sounds like the guilt towards your little ones is heartbreaking.

You must be so strong to have had to get through all this for so long. What are you doing to take care of yourself in this situation? You’ve posted all about DS’s exercise, diet, education…can you carve out any time to prioritise this for yourself. Take a walk, eat something good, spend some time in a different headspace. Looking after yourself will benefit your whole family in the long run.

I've responded to you upthread and it just sounds such a difficult situation but I am guessing he is feeling very unloved at the moment - he's made himself unloveable! I wonder if you are able to find moments to chat about small stuff, and let him know he is loved?

My slightly younger DS was getting very engrossed in his x-box and becoming irritable with everyone, had dropped all of his hobbies, was no longer going out with friends after school. I have a rule that everyone (me included) has to do one scheduled physical activity a week and I was absolutely firm on that. He's started going to the gym with a friend and that led to him also joining cadets (a bit like scouts). He seems so much happier and less highly strung that he was. I think the x-box was becoming an addiction.

I know you situation is way more complex and you need external help but maybe communicating with your son about stuff that isn't highly charged might help a small amount.

You have been let down by the school and LA but by deregistering him you are playing into their hands. There are many services that the LA are obliged to provide but only if he’s on the books of a school- he doesn’t ever have to attend. Please have a look up thread at the advice on getting an EHCP.

Name changing as outing

I am the sibling of a brother with mental health issues and this is very hard on the family but most of all on you OP. Things can usually improve post adolescence, but you do need to be very strong.

There is no way around this having a negative impact on the family but you can minimise it.

My DB would walk around the house shouting and screaming aggressively which was upsetting and disruptive. My DM (single mother) simply did not allow this behaviour outside his room and his space. So he spent a lot of time in his room, shouting , screaming , etc. Not ideal, but better for the family than the alternative . As hard as it is OP you need that PlayStation upstairs and he needs to respect that. I appreciate you are frightened of him but it’s either so this or throw him out as the way you are living is not tenable

I know all mental health issues aren’t the same but to give you some hope my DB, who was at one point committed, now lives independently . He is still challenging but in a more manageable way. Good luck to you

Jesus. Yes just write off your son for good aged 15. Vulnerable teen? Stop loving them, lock them up and throw away the key. Nice.

Unlovable? OP has already stated that she loves him to bits.

Monster? He is clearly a very troubled child with complex mental health problems who has been self harming and is so dysregulated he is expressing himself through violence, possibly also addicted to gaming and withdrawn from life.

@Manamala well said!

I do love him to bits. I just hate his behaviour. That does not mean I don't love him.

What an awful situation.

It seems like it needs something to break this cycle but I appreciate that's easier said than done.
Have you tried any of the charities like the Prince's Trust? It seems he had a bad time at school and is now shutting out life. But resenting it and taking it out on you.

He desperately needs someone to show him other kinds of life. I know he is likely to be hostile to such suggestions but if there was some kind of volunteering/ outdoor/creative scheme he could be part of it might boost his confidence.

You all need respite of some kind to try and reset this horrible situation

Is it a special needs college he will be going to?