Children want to live with their dad, I’m devastated

[HawaiiCount]

3 DC. Split with their father when they were little, now early/mid/late teens.

Initially we did the every other week/weekend thing. Ex re-married 6 years ago and we’ve done 50/50 since. No maintenance either way.

Our household incomes are poles apart. He and his wife are very wealthy. I work full time but still eligible for universal credit. Very different houses, they share bedrooms at mine, no foreign holidays, expected to do chores, cook dinner etc.

Older teen started staying at their dads more often around 6 months ago. Two younger teens have now said they want to move to their fathers and come to mine every second weekend.

Im devastated. I hid it when we were discussing and said I’d think about it and needed some time to think how that would work. The second they left I broke down. These are my babies, I grew them from scratch, I never thought I would be in a position where my children don’t live with me and I see them twice a month. I never wanted any of this, the reason we split is because of his affair, karma is bullshit, he’s remarried, wealthy and now has our children. I have nothing.

I want to be fair to the kids and support what they need but my heart is broken

What a nightmare. Surely important that both parents enforce rules / limits / chores otherwise teens (even the nicest ones) will go for the lax parent which ultimately isn’t in their best long term interests.

I think they were totally out of order agreeing with the kids before talking to you

50% of the parenting? Erm no. He had the DC e/o weekend whe he had to parent them himself. He took them 50% only once he had a new partner to dump the childcare on.

Plus although wealthier he didn't pay maintenance when he only had them e/o weekend. He's very far from being a devoted father. That was a mistake OP, you should have put in a claim, your own life and that of DC would have been easier/better as a result of the extra money.

I think you should ask him for maintenance now. You're about to become financially worse off if the DC don't live with you, you'll lose any children-related benefits you receive and you can't downsize to a smaller property if they're planning to come stay e/o weekend.

Unless you can afford to downsize to a smaller place on the other side of town so they can see you more easily without saying over? Maybe depends if that's the expensive side of town.

Goodness, I would be devastated.

Does it all have to be so set in stone? Could you let them come and go? I think I would insist on one night a week at mine though and a reassurence that I would be consulted on all big decisions.

It really won't hurt them to know you pushed for more time with them than once a fortnight.

@WeAreBob that is not what I said on the 2 posts I wrote.

@pinkpurplegreen he didn’t leave her in poverty as it happens, he offered her a very generous settlement despite her having an affair. She pushed for more and declined the settlement. In court the judge awarded her the minimum because she had turned down a good settlement. They got an equal split of the equity and both went into rented housing. I’m sure it doesn’t fit your narrative that women are never in the wrong though!

I agree with you there. Plus telling her in advance what feelings she is allowed to display, whilst at the same time not telling her what the news is. He could have told her the news when he was telling her how to feel, but chose not to. He's really not very nice.

Sorry to read this, no wonder you are heartbroken. I think even worse that there was seemingly no conversation between their dad and you before they came to you.

Really sorry op, it’s sounds really upsetting.

It might be ‘easier’ for them now but hopefully when they are grown up they will come to realise how you raised them and all you did and will thank you for it.

I also expect that if they live with DF long enough rules will start to be implemented and the fun dad shine will rub off. So maybe you are playing a waiting game.

Just continue being supportive and enjoy a new found hobby one evening a week with your extra time until they reconsider.

OP that's so hard. Agree with PP your ex informing you last was out of order and no, he hasn't done half the parenting; he was a weekend dad until he had another woman to involve.

It sounds like you have handled it very tactfully so far. Don't make it an emotional battle, but you can still seek to negotiate, both over the distribution of time and the mitigation of financial consequences if you lose 50% parent status.

You'll come back from this, as will your relationship with your children. All the best.

@fyn you have me confused now. I reread the op and it definitely says he had the affair unless that was a typo.

Children always ultimate move out and start to live there own lives

This time has come

Use it as an opportunity to invest in yourself and take up your own interests now you will have more time

This could be great news for you and when they come over make it even more special

It's how you view it that counts

On the bright side...think of the weekly shop! You'll be able to save so much more money, and can spend that on yourself.

@Tilltheend99

Fyn posted earlier about how she lived with her dad and the larger house etc made her teenage years much better rather than living cramped up with her mum and nowhere to do homework etc and said that her mum used to berate her for living there etc. Another poster then replied asking why she would live with her dad when he left her mum in poverty etc and couldn't have been a very good dad. That's what her reply about the affair is about.

You were a selfish teenager that put your material comfort above your mother's feelings. And you still refuse to see the harm you did. Well done.

I don't think they were out of order to say that. If the teenagers approach their father to ask if they can stay full time, he is more than welcome to tell them they are. Just as the OP is free to tell her children that they are free to spend more time with her. These are teenagers, not young children, and so they have the right to decide where they live. Had they approached the OP saying they wanted to spend more time there and only see their father EOW, would the OP be unreasonable saying that they were welcome to?

But did he say that he'd have to talk to their mum about it as it would be such a big change?

A child isn't responsible for their parent's feelings. If they are happier and more comfortable in one household and want to live there then that's what they should do. It's often difficult for the NRP to spending less time with their children, but children have opinions and agency. Parents have a responsibility for their child's happiness and welfare, not the other way around.

It's interesting that you are using the word selfish to describe the child, not the adult. I'd argue that the mother is more selfish for trying to manipulate her child to live with her when she was less happy there and passing guilt on to her.

Its not 'my' account. The data is very clear on this. Women are far more likely to end up in poverty at the end of a relationship (involving children) than men are.
And you only need to come on here to see account after account of men seeking to rip women off at divorce.

So just on the information in your first post, the balance of probability was that this had happened. But sorry if it doesn't fit YOUR narrative that suspecting this was the case was based on the data rather than man hatred.

Why is living with dad worse than living with mum? Do the dad’s feelings not matter? And why are the mum’s feelings more important that the child’s?

I’m also sure there were other factors at play, there always are when a family splits.

@Gigi42p "I'm not suggesting emotional manipulation."

It actually sounds like you are. You have advocated guilt tripping her kids into staying at her house. This could backfire hugely, especially if the kids feel they are being manipulated. I certainly would have responded with "F you" had my parent(s) become hysterical at my suggestion I was going to move a few miles away.

Yes there are "consequences" and at the same time we must own our own emotional shit. When we start having to justify our own behaviour to others because they are unset with us, its often downhill from there.

I would, however, tell them how I felt - calmly and reasonably without "breaking down". Whenever anyone escalates their emotions in order to get someone to do something they don't want to do, there is a huge red flag for me. I don't believe in it, nor do I believe in acting like a victim.

Thank you all. Some good points and a lot to think about.

On the face of it they have a “harder” life at mine. They all have chores each day, their dad has a cleaner so they aren’t required to do any housekeeping. Our house is cold in the winter and they have to chop wood, take a hot water bottle to bed etc, they have their own fridges in their bedrooms at their dads! They have their own en suites and individual meals catered for, my house is “this is what’s for dinner”!

Ex did pay maintenance when they were EOW, stopped when we went 50/50. All costs since then are shared ie trips/uniform/stuff they need etc. They have clothes at both homes but much bigger wardrobes at their dads. They even have an at home gym which DS loves.

but what happens when DD gets her first period? When older DD breaks up with her boyfriend, when DS needs a hug. I want my children with me, I want to be part of their everyday life. I feel like my kids have been stolen from me bit by bit and it was so subtle I didn’t notice. I thought I was doing the right thing letting their stepmom be so involved. I’ve lost my kids because of money. DS is packing some stuff up but not taking much because “I’ve got most of it at daddy’s”. DD knows I’m upset and keeps coming to check on me

I just want my children

Every cloud has a silver lining op- your exh can bear the brunt of their teenaged angst. They might come back to you when they are older and the gloss has worn off. In the meantime you can develop your own life, carer, friendships, hobbies.

And I know this shouldn’t matter but I’m embarrassed to tell people my children don’t live with me. It’s unnatural. People are going to think I’m an awful mother. This man wouldn’t even change a nappy when they were little. I did years and years of grunt work. I did all the hard work. I feel like raging at the world

He gave the OP a heads up the children were going to talk to her about something. I don't think that was a kind or helpful message from the father and he could have handled that better, but that doesn't mean I think he's wrong for agreeing the children can spend more time with him if they want. I don't think at the teenage age, there's really much need to consult the OP himself for a decision the children have made, and in terms of accepting responsibility for their actions, it's better the children tell the OP what they have decided themselves. Sadly for the OP, she doesn't really have any option either than to agree. If she tried to go to court to maintain the 50:50 contact then the court would almost certainly go with the children's wishes. And teenagers have agency, so even with a court order of 50:50, if they want to spend more time with their father they will.